Should QF9 be re-routed

[Isochronous]

I thought QF was picking up a lot of EK South Asia traffic on DXB-LHR with QF1/2 and 9/10 DXB-LHR-DXB, but have seen some posts suggesting that loads are not as good as expected.

So I thought it would be interesting to create a poll and discussion to see what other posters think QF could or should do with QF9, eg:

Since QF9/10 and QF1/2 are similarly timed, MEL-DXB passengers for LHR could transfer on to QF1/2 from SYD at DXB to continue to LHR, with QF9/10 then re-routed to a different European port (e.g. FRA, Berlin etc)

Or should QF9/10 be withdrawn from DXB completely and routed to LHR or elsewhere via Asia, e.g. SIN?

 

[vitagen]

Should go to another destination....

Germany would be the obvious choice

 

[smit0847]

Should go to another destination....

Germany would be the obvious choice

SIN-FRA was unprofitable on a 747, not sure why they would attempt FRA again? I would have thought CDG would be a more popular destination?

 

[Isochronous]

SIN-FRA was unprofitable on a 747, not sure why they would attempt FRA again? I would have thought CDG would be a more popular destination?

Except QF can't run daily flights to CDG, they can to German ports.

 

[Ansett]

in My opinion QF9/10 should be rerouted VIA Singapore

 

[markis10]

Except QF can't run daily flights to CDG, they can to German ports.

On what basis is that statement made?

 

[Isochronous]

IMO Berlin is the obvious choice to link in with Air Berlin as a oneworld connection from Germany, the economic powerhouse of Europe.

The question is whether more money would be made out of DXB getting EK feed or from SIN, which might increase loads on QF SIN services from other Australian ports. It would also unlock the A330 running MEL-SIN currently for something else. PER-HKG I say!

 

[serfty]

On what basis is that statement made?

I believe qantas are/were resticted into Paris - I know of no such to Germany ...

There is reference to the French restriction here: Qantas to Paris - PPRuNe Forums, and here: About Qantas | News Room | Media Releases | Qantas Announces New Codeshare with Air France and Increased UK Services for the Northern Winter (with a quote from John Borghetti:

...
"Qantas is restricted to operating only three flights to Paris a week under the bilateral agreement between Australia and France," Mr Borghetti said.
...

 

[Plodder]

The obvious answer if the planes aren't full enough is to simply scrap the route. Sadly it's probably the likely official response.

 

[AdMEL]

In my order of preference for purely selfish reasons:

MEL-SIN-LHR
MEL-SIN-FRA
MEL-SIN-BER
MEL-SIN-CDG or elsewhere in Western Europe
MEL-DXB-FRA
MEL-DXB-BER/CDG or elsewhere in Western Europe

In order of what I think is actually possible from an economic and logistical perspective:

MEL-DXB-BER
MEL-DXB-FRA
MEL-DXB-CDG
MEL-SIN-LHR
MEL-SIN-FRA
MEL-SIN-BER
MEL-SIN-CDG or elsewhere in Western Europe

 

[markis10]

I believe qantas are/were resticted into Paris - I know of no such to Germany ...

There is reference to the French restriction here: Qantas to Paris - PPRuNe Forums, and here: About Qantas | News Room | Media Releases | Qantas Announces New Codeshare with Air France and Increased UK Services for the Northern Winter (with a quote from John Borghetti:

Available capacity is three flights a week beyond what is currently in place via codeshare which is 400 seats daily (250 to QF 150 to VA), QF currently to not have rights to Germany at all however there is 27 flights a week in direction available as capacity.

 

[vantage03]

Just yesterday I heard from quite senior QF A380 crew that the rumour of the moment is that QF9 will change to MEL-HKG-LHR giving MEL an A380 service to HKG.

I know 'Galley FM' can often be the least reliable source of info, but thought I'd mention it given someone else started the topic... I find it hard to work out how EK would agree to this though.

 

[Programme]

Just yesterday I heard from quite senior QF A380 crew that the rumour of the moment is that QF9 will change to MEL-HKG-LHR giving MEL an A380 service to HKG.

Effectively QF29/30 going back to LHR as an A380? Done properly it would give SYD/MEL/BNE an Asian stopover option to LHR again (all A380 ex MEL/SYD), improve the product offered on MEL-HKG, remove an anecdotally low yielding flight DXB-LHR and free up the existing A330 that is doing QF29/30 to operate something new (PER-HKG to connect with HKG-LHR?)

Nah, that would almost make too much sense. No way QF will do it!

 

[Melburnian1]

markis10,a great idea for a poll since my and many others' contention is that QF's rerouting via DXB has been unsuccessful.

'The Australian' ran a large graphic a couple of weeks ago showing a half empty seating plan on QF10. In a sense this was a bit silly because November is a low month for travel: too far away from Christmas to attract the Brits heading to Melbourne for the cricket or to spend summer in Oz.

The Middle East has little in common with Australia. It isn't on my bucket list to go through customs into any of those countries except the democracy of Israel, which is from where many entrepreneurs hail.

Australians feel far more comfortable in southeast or north Asia. While they may be an extreme case, ask the two Australian gents who were detained for years.

Through Singapore would be the traditional route to LHR - and popular with many travellers (although 80 per cent of passengers departing Australia do not patronise QF: I am in that large majority).

The Berlin suggestion is interesting but while no one doubts 'Germany is the economic powerhouse of Europe', how many of us have business or familial links with northern or eastern Europe or Germany/ Austria/ Switzerland? The percentage would not be high, as historically Australians came from English, Irish, Scottish or Welsh.
Migration
flows since 1975 have been from Vietnam, Philippines, mainland China/ Hong Kong/ Taiwan, Malaysia and the Middle East, along with New Zealand, while our European business ties seem largely with the UK (far outshone in terms of trade by the combined South Korea/ Japan/ mainland China/ Taiwan/ Hong Kong/ United States).

One could use Germany as a hub but QF5 and QF6 allegedly lost money when operating to and from FRA.

QF may simply discontinue QF9/10 beyond DXB.

 

[Edge]

I'm for MEL-SIN/HKG-LHR

Flew QF9 in October and it was EMPTY in Y. I would stop over in SIN/HKG, never in Dubai.

 

[Austman]

So November is the low season?

Here is a pic of QF10 LHR-DXB, after the doors were closed, in mid May 2013:





I have to say the DXB-MEL sector was more heavily loaded!

 

[Melburnian1]

Austman, very topical. I said November was a low season month.

I gather that the others tend to be February and May. This is mostly true for Australian domestic travel as well.

In May 2013, QF's load factor on Melbourne or Sydney flights to Dubai and London (the percentage is seats occupied ex Australia) was 85.6 per cent: this is not broken down for Melbourne and Sydney flights QF9/ QF1.

For the reverse direction as pictured (QF10 or QF2), the load figure was much lower at 63.6 per cent, due to many not wanting to spend winter in southern Australia versus many Australians who want to fly 'north' for the European summer:

http://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/ongoing/files/International_airline_activity_1305.pdf

 

[Austman]

In May 2013, QF's load factor on Melbourne or Sydney flights to Dubai and London (the percentage is seats occupied ex Australia) was 85.6 per cent: this is not broken down for Melbourne and Sydney flights QF9/ QF1.

It's true that my QF9 MEL-DXB-LHR flights a week earlier were a lot more loaded (but not full in Y).

But none-the-less, QF10 LHR-DXB was a surpising experience for me! A lot of PAX from Germany joined QF10 DXB-MEL.

 

[Melburnian1]

serfty, markis10 or another moderator, could you please draw this online poll's attention to RedRoo when he or she returns from holidays?

 

[TonyHancock]

As an occasional flyer with only eight trips to the UK this year I have found transit through DXB suits me just fine, but I have certainly seen plenty of spare seats in Y.