42 737s Cabin Refresh from 2027

[Daver6]

AA doesn’t have a problem with the 20 seats from my experience. I can’t speak about China Eastern, and most likely will never experience that.

Have you flown with AA?

To be fair, AA don't do a meal service on shorter flights.

They're also smart and tend to take food and drink orders prior to take-off. You can even pre-order your meal online too (or maybe I'm thinking of AS).

 

[DC3]

To be fair, AA don't do a meal service on shorter flights.

They're also smart and tend to take food and drink orders prior to take-off. You can even pre-order your meal online too (or maybe I'm thinking of AS).

I recall having meals served on AA in 20-seater (and 16-seater, and 12-seater) business (“first”) class, domestic. I have seen two FAs do the meals/drinks, then one goes down the back to help the other two, leaving one up the front.

Edit: Yes, the meals can usually be pre-ordered, on-line, so you’ll get your choice, and it may speed-up the process on-board. I recall one FA worked 16 seats alone, and boy was he slick.

 

[WilsonM]

The J seats will probably be similar to the A220s, but the A220 Y seats are too wide for the 737NG interior. So either Recaro modifies the design slightly or they go with something different. But the images used by various media outlets are speculation - Qantas haven't confirmed anything except that they want to “Align customer experience with the new domestic fleet”. VH did say that they want the seats to be exactly the same, but VH does say a lot of things...

New bins are pretty standard: https://services.boeing.com/maintenance-engineering/modifications/interiors/737-space-bins

They haven't talked at all about the configuration, so they probably won't change it - you might feel like there's a bit more seat pitch as the new seats will be slimmer, but there probably won't be a change in that regard.

As an aside, it'll probably be the VZ/XZ/VY series of 737s to get refurbs - there's exactly 42 of them. First deliveries in 2008 (for the VZs). QF have said ~40 aircraft retirements, so 19 Q200/Q300s + 9 717s + 2 A380s still means 10 others (assuming the 2 A380s are included, which they might not be). So every chance we see 737 retirements in the next year or so, especially since some of the first tranche would be approaching their 2nd D checks.

 

[Harrison_133]

The J seats will probably be similar to the A220s, but the A220 Y seats are too wide for the 737NG interior. So either Recaro modifies the design slightly or they go with something different.

The A220 seats are the Recaro R2 model which are used on the 737 by a few airlines. Southwest just switched to the Recaro R2 seats for their new builds and Alaska are retrofitting their 737-800 aircraft with R2 seats.

 

[WilsonM]

The A220 seats are the Recaro R2 model which are used on the 737 by a few airlines. Southwest just switched to the Recaro R2 seats for their new builds and Alaska are retrofitting their 737-800 aircraft with R2 seats.

Yeah - point was they can't simply use the exact same seats, but they can still go with the same R2 design - in the same way the J seats (which are the R5s I believe?) can be slightly wider on the 737 vs the A220.

 

[Justinf]

AA doesn’t have a problem with the 20 seats from my experience. I can’t speak about China Eastern, and most likely will never experience that.

Have you flown with AA?

Nope.
Was just making an observation.
If QF are going to cram 20 J seats on a single aisle at the expense of less Y seats then I’d be surprised.
J legroom might be the first to suffer.
This was the China Eastern pitch. Pleasant enough flight for just less than two hours, but legroom not a strong point.



Edit: that thing on my right leg is really bugging me now.

 

[clifford]

I flew on a China Eastern A321 with 20 J seats and the legroom was barely better than economy.
Be careful what you wish for.

Sounds like the QF A220. Nice aircraft, pity about QF turing it into a must avoid thing. I''ll never book an A220 in J again. woeful.

 

[clifford]

J legroom might be the first to suffer.

It can't be reduced much if at all, unless you only allow children to sit there. Got to be the worst J pitch in the (civilised) world as it is.

 

[moa999]

As an aside, it'll probably be the VZ/XZ/VY series of 737s to get refurbs - there's exactly 42 of them

The confusion is the press release said 42.

But the HY presentation said 80+ refurbs including the previously announced 332s (10) and JQ 787s (11) which means 59+ 737s, assuming no other refurb announcements.

The difference being 17-26 (assuming 80+ means 80-89)
And there just happens to be 24 BSI + IFE 737s - which presumably needs a lot less refurb given they are are BSI aircraft with larger bins and newer sidewalls.

So equally it could be 42 major refurbs, 24 minor refurbs, which would actually only leave 9 737s retired without refurb.

I equally don't quite believe that (think you'd want at least 5 years out of any aircraft refurbed) so maybe there was some last minute changes, or there is some other aircraft they are going to refurb but haven't announced.

 

[DC3]

This was the China Eastern pitch. Pleasant enough flight for just less than two hours, but legroom not a strong point.

Oooooh. That looks nasty for Business.

Anyway, AA seems to be able to keep similar leg-room as QF in J domestic seating. So, it can work. Just my observation.

Edited

 

[moa999]

IlGot to be the worst J pitch in the (civilised) world as it is.

Flown in Europe recently?

Edit: that thing on my right leg is really bugging me now.

Old school IFE box.. another good reason to dump IFE.. though these days modern systems don't tend to have that.

 

[Justinf]

Oooooh. That looks nasty.

MU probably not the best example to give I will admit.

 

[elanshin]

The confusion is the press release said 42.

But the HY presentation said 80+ refurbs including the previously announced 332s (10) and JQ 787s (11) which means 59+ 737s, assuming no other refurb announcements.

The difference being 17-26 (assuming 80+ means 80-89)
And there just happens to be 24 BSI + IFE 737s - which presumably needs a lot less refurb given they are are BSI aircraft with larger bins and newer sidewalls.

What if its other type refurbishments that they decided on but don't want to announce yet (because it's a bit early to announce). Like B789 as they start to hit the shop for D checks in 2029?
Maybe the 380s might see something if they forcast that they'd be used for well into the 2030s instead of just "early 2030s).

 

[wenglock.mok]

The confusion is the press release said 42.

But the HY presentation said 80+ refurbs including the previously announced 332s (10) and JQ 787s (11) which means 59+ 737s, assuming no other refurb announcements.

The difference being 17-26 (assuming 80+ means 80-89)
And there just happens to be 24 BSI + IFE 737s - which presumably needs a lot less refurb given they are are BSI aircraft with larger bins and newer sidewalls.

So equally it could be 42 major refurbs, 24 minor refurbs, which would actually only leave 9 737s retired without refurb.

I equally don't quite believe that (think you'd want at least 5 years out of any aircraft refurbed) so maybe there was some last minute changes, or there is some other aircraft they are going to refurb but haven't announced.

The number of 42 is more likely to be correct, which is exactly the entire VZ and XZ series (including VYZ, which is really VZN in disguise).

Interestingly, VZA is only 25 months older than VYL is although I guess they have to draw the line somewhere.

 

[justinbrett]

To be fair, AA don't do a meal service on shorter flights.

They've even eliminated the snack basket in F on short flights (like LAX-LAS). Only on flights more than 500 miles - which is more than SYD-MEL/BNE. You have to fly 900 miles to get a meal (which is more than BNE-MEL).

I mean really? I'm sure the pax could pass it around if you're worried about FA capacity.

 

[Saab34]

Interesting if it’s the BSI aircraft, the overhead bins do offer much more capacity vs the non BSI which are not great. I guess the BSIs will be around for another decade.

 

[Peasant]

This again shows how completely negligent fleet planning was under Alan Joyce.

Assuming they'll start by refurbishing the oldest of the 42, that'll be an aircraft that's already 19 years old. They're not going to the effort and cost of doing it for anything less than 6-7 years of use, which would mean their goal is to fly them until they're at least 25-27 years old.

I recall in one of their investor briefings that they wanted to extend the life of their 737s to beyond the previously advisable age set by Boeing, but wow, even United and American have started to move on from wanting to fly dinosaurs until the end of time.

That QF will have only 7 A321s by June next year suggests there's very little to look forward to, all while the LCC subsidiary flies around 21 brand new airframes of the type. It's almost deranged.

 

[elanshin]

This again shows how completely negligent fleet planning was under Alan Joyce.

Assuming they'll start by refurbishing the oldest of the 42, that'll be an aircraft that's already 19 years old. They're not going to the effort and cost of doing it for anything less than 6-7 years of use, which would mean their goal is to fly them until they're at least 25-27 years old.

I recall in one of their investor briefings that they wanted to extend the life of their 737s to beyond the previously advisable age set by Boeing, but wow, even United and American have started to move on from wanting to fly dinosaurs until the end of time.

That QF will have only 7 A321s by June next year suggests there's very little to look forward to, all while the LCC subsidiary flies around 21 brand new airframes of the type. It's almost deranged.

Its less deranged when you consider that the margins are thinner on JQ thus better performance planes (newer) is more ideal and for legacy having older less efficiency planes still fine due to the margins for the company. They got the 787-8 years before the first 787-9 for mainline.

Yes hasn't gotten anything to do with passenger comforts or anything. That being said new isn't always better.