Can someone please explain Qantas Reaccomdation Policy?

[jackaroo]

I feel like I'm missing something here and feel quite daft ! I'm just trying to prepare.

We have a direct flight from Asia to Europe coming up, two tickets. Used Qantas points to book the flight (business class reward seats).

I have been reading all the great information on this site, including the helpful article from the editor (plus everything on the Qantas website), however, I cannot find definitive written information about Qantas having to find alternative seats in the same class if they change or cancel our flight.

I note, from the article this statement the customer states "when I explain that the terms and conditions of carriage require them to find me alternative seats in the same class".

Could someone please show me where exactly it states 'the same class' part on Qantas conditions of carriage? Or specifically where Qantas would have to ‘convert revenue seats’ to accommodate you for the same destination?

All I can find, and maybe my research is not as good as others, is this :-

14.9.4 If a Classic Flight Reward is cancelled by the airline and reasonable alternative travel cannot be arranged (from here https://www.qantas.com/au/en/freque...join/terms-and-conditions.html#reward-flights)

or this

9. Schedules, Late or Cancelled Flights (from here https://www.qantas.com/au/en/book-a...age.html#-schedules-late-or-cancelled-flights)

(c) Significant Change

If, due to Events Within Our Control, after you buy your Ticket we make a Significant Change to your flight we will:

rebook you on the next available flight (or combination of flights) on our services to your booked destination at no additional cost to you

9.2 Late or Cancelled Flights (Events Beyond Our Control)

Where we make a Significant Change to your flight due to an Event Beyond Our Control, whether you have checked in or not, we will:

use reasonable endeavours to rebook you on the next available flight on our services at no additional cost to you

____

I can find nothing about 'same class' or opening up revenue seats? Would it be in the Australian Consumer Rights links ? (for which I haven't, but am going to, read through).

Advice gratefully received for someone feeling quite thick!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

You got it.

You have paid for a ticket in [whichever] class. If there’s any change to that - cancellations etc - they have to find you a seat in the same class as you purchased. It’s the product and service you paid for.

Nite that you are presented with options… the ‘same class’ might not be available the same day, or the next day. It would be your choice to wait for the next flight where your desired class was available, or accept another class of travel to go earlier, or ultimately, to take a refund if none of the options suited you.

 

[jackaroo]

Thanks @MEL_Traveller for the response. I understand that however I still can't find however where this information is stated in writing online?

As mentioned in my original post, I'm trying to find where exactly it states online 'the same class' part on Qantas conditions of carriage? Or specifically where Qantas would have to ‘convert revenue seats’ to accommodate you for the same destination?


Can you advise (or anyone) how you know this / where online this is stated?


Thanks all.

 

[RealtimeY]

Nite that you are presented with options… the ‘same class’ might not be available the same day, or the next day. It would be your choice to wait for the next flight where your desired class was available, or accept another class of travel to go earlier, or ultimately, to take a refund if none of the options suited you.

I've always thought that when there is a disruption/schedule change the fare buckets go out the window and Qantas usually will open up seats for you on other flights unless they are full. Am I reading this wrong or do I have the wrong understanding?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Thanks @MEL_Traveller for the response. I understand that however I still can't find however where this information is stated in writing online?

As mentioned in my original post, I'm trying to find where exactly it states online 'the same class' part on Qantas conditions of carriage? Or specifically where Qantas would have to ‘convert revenue seats’ to accommodate you for the same destination?


Can you advise (or anyone) how you know this / where online this is stated?


Thanks all.

That’s the thing, it doesn’t say ‘in the same class’ but it doesn’t need to. The conditions of carriage relate to the ticket you have bought. So if you have purchased a ticket in business class then you are entitled to the options outlined, in business class. Same for first or economy.

Different rules cover downgrading or bumping, which would kick in if an airline wanted to change ‘the same class’ element.

I've always thought that when there is a disruption/schedule change the fare buckets go out the window and Qantas usually will open up seats for you on other flights unless they are full. Am I reading this wrong or do I have the wrong understanding?

On day of travel airport staff have broad scope to make changes and fare buckets aren’t usually relevant. My understanding is that IATA or whatever have worked out a set of rules between carriers to accommodate changes/rearranges in these circumstances. Some airlines may have more restrictive policies… so ultra-low cost carriers are probably not going to accommodate you on a full-service carrier unless there is a compelling reason to do so.

Other airlines may have the ability to accommodate you on other airlines but choose not to for commercial reasons. A non-status passenger on a cheap fare may not be given a seat on another airline, but a top tier status passenger may be given that benefit.

 

[Ade]

Thanks @MEL_Traveller for the response. I understand that however I still can't find however where this information is stated in writing online?

As mentioned in my original post, I'm trying to find where exactly it states online 'the same class' part on Qantas conditions of carriage? Or specifically where Qantas would have to ‘convert revenue seats’ to accommodate you for the same destination?


Can you advise (or anyone) how you know this / where online this is stated?


Thanks all.

I'm not sure if there is any reference to the exact wording or even if the exact wording exists. From experiences of other folks, I have seen QF (or any airline, in the current climate) either honour the booking class by

a. converting commercial seats into reward seats
b. asking customers to travel on a different data/service to retain the class of travel
c. if partner airlines are involved, request partner to release reward seats
d. pay the commercial fare on partner and get the pax home
e. in some extreme cases, downgrade pax and sadly inform them that the only class of service available isn't what the pax was originally booked on

so any of the above can (& has) happened ... so it really is a case-by-case thingy rather than a documented information somewhere ...

Also, airlines (or pretty much any service these days) T&C are written in a way that "we WILL NOT doing the wrong thing" rather than "we WILL do the right thing" ...

Post automatically merged: Oct 26, 2022

That’s the thing, it doesn’t say ‘in the same class’ but it doesn’t need to. The conditions of carriage relate to the ticket you have bought. So if you have purchased a ticket in business class then you are entitled to the options outlined, in business class. Same for first or economy.

Agree with this view ... but in some cases, the travel plan might not be flexible (from a pax's perspective) and so the pax might (on their own volition) consider talking a downgraded class and travel on the date they want ... really depends on a case-by-case basis, if I might say ...

 

[jackaroo]

Thanks @Ade

I understand, thanks for your input.

The reason I was trying to find specific information online was that I had heard anecdotally, and read on this forum quite a few times, many Qantas customer services staff saying that there weren't any 'reward' seats and weren't allowed to convert revenue tickets.

I suppose I was looking for information that specifically clearly outlined this in the event this happened. Something I could direct the uninformed customer service agent to that clearly stated about the revenue seats release & in the same class.

I'd read (mainly on here) many posters stating this was fact and I just wondered if my research was failing but not being able to find this info specifically!

Of course I'm hoping this doesn't happen but just like to be fully informed.

 

[encryptededdy]

The reason I was trying to find specific information online was that I had heard anecdotally, and read on this forum quite a few times, many Qantas customer services staff saying that there weren't any 'reward' seats and weren't allowed to convert revenue tickets.

I understand what you're after and... yeah, this is hard. Are your reward tickets booked on QF flights or partner flights? If you're booked on partner flights then unfortunately you don't really have much of a chance of getting reaccomodated if the partner cancels, unless it's last minute.

 

[Ade]

many Qantas customer services staff saying that there weren't any 'reward' seats and weren't allowed to convert revenue tickets.

I suppose I was looking for information that specifically clearly outlined this in the event this happened.

My understanding is that this particular information WILL NOT be available for public domain ... feels like this is too much internal/commercial info for the public to know ... meaning, this is definitely not something that QF (or any airline) would like the public to know, for a fact ... I believe that this will be available via internally circulated work instructions to customer service staff, advising to initiate the conversion of $ fares to reward fares ...

Something I could direct the uninformed customer service agent to that clearly stated about the revenue seats release & in the same class.

I'm sure you'd be able to suggest this to the staff and gently nudge them in this direction ... Depending on your status with QF, I'd believe support staff based out of HBA/AKL/AU/NZ centres will do this automatically without the customer needing to remind them ... they'd (based on their training and based onshore) might have the access to do this ...

I'd read (mainly on here) many posters stating this was fact and I just wondered if my research was failing but not being able to find this info specifically!

If this is somewhere on the internet, I'd like a copy pls

Of course I'm hoping this doesn't happen but just like to be fully informed.

Totally agree .. information is wealth ...

 

[Vic]

The fundamental question is really simple. You've paid to fly in business class, so they have to fly you in business class. (this does not need to be in writing - it is a given)(it's the law, it's mabo, it's the consitution)

What happens IF this becomes an issue is highly dependent on the circumstances at the time. Those circumstances can be highly variable, and cannot be predicted. You success on flying in the same class, IF the worst was to happen, will depend on you. It will depend on 1) your willingness to insist on flying in the same class - asserting, politely, this fundamental position that you've paid for business class, and 2) your ability to be delayed waiting for an available flight.

Note that you might also be able assert the need for Qantas to accommodate you regardless of available awards - BUT that depends on the circumstances.

Fundamental - you PAID for business they need to fly you in business. How that plays out cannot be predicted, IF there is an issue.

 

[jackaroo]

Thanks @Vic

"It's law, its mabo, it's the constitution"

I hear what you're saying. I suppose the class would be like for like as, as you say, this is what you've paid for.

The bit about the releasing of revenue for cancelled reward would be a bit trickier I'm guessing?

Thanks again @Ade on reflection I do concur ... why indeed would QF put this info in public domain, that would be FAR to easy for customers to access!

We have a flight with non-QF metal. Reward & Business. We will be abroad already when we are due to take this flight.

Hoping for the best!

Thanks so much everyone. Such a helpful site.

 

[justinbrett]

I also wonder, if you are booked on non-QF metal, QF can use "events not within their control", as QR (or whoever) cancelling the flight is not within their control. All the language of "when we make a change...", well, they didn't, it was QR.

I do think that's why they try a bit harder to accommodate you when it's QF metal that's been cancelled. I think "reasonable endeavours" is really the best you can hope for.

 

[Vic]

Don't get me wrong, it is a horrible prospect and it's good to be prepared if the worst happens.

Another point to think about, since you're flying Singas to Europe. There is nothing to say they have to accommodate you on the same airline. for example Qatar or emirates.
CLause 9 talks about "on our services" and also about "to your booked destination".

If you're flying qatar Singapore to Paris, Qantas should focus on getting you to Paris. That could be Qantas to London and BA to Paris. There is nothing to say it has to be an award on qatar.
IMO

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Agree with this view ... but in some cases, the travel plan might not be flexible (from a pax's perspective) and so the pax might (on their own volition) consider talking a downgraded class and travel on the date they want ... really depends on a case-by-case basis, if I might say ...

Yes that’s right, and it’s one of the options available in the terms and conditions. If a pax chooses to accept a downgrade stakes have changed.

Also, as pointed out above, the terms and conditions are different for matters within or outside an airline’s control. A partner cancelling a flight will almost certainly be ‘outside of control’.

 

[roby]

From my recent experience, I can tell you QF will not rebook you on a commercial fare basis if your reward seat gets disrupted and there is no alternative reward seats available. However, in most cases, I find that the operating carrier will rebook you automatically on an alternative flight, maybe on a different flight or on a different date. This is your best bet and all you have got to do is make sure the new flight gets ticketed (often not). Failing that, you may be able to get an agent to open an extra reward seat on a QF flight if there is one but I am not optimistic unless you hold top tier status and can get to an agent in Hobart. If not, you will be lucky to even get a competent agent and you could be spending days on the phone (Don't get me started on the Fiji call centre). Before you even ask them to get you a new flight, they will often suggest full refund. Unfortunately this is currently the reality of QF call centre service.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

From my recent experience, I can tell you QF will not rebook you on a commercial fare basis if your reward seat gets disrupted and there is no alternative reward seats available. However, in most cases, I find that the operating carrier will rebook you automatically on an alternative flight, maybe on a different flight or on a different date. This is your best bet and all you have got to do is make sure the new flight gets ticketed (often not). Failing that, you may be able to get an agent to open an extra reward seat on a QF flight if there is one but I am not optimistic unless you hold top tier status and can get to an agent in Hobart. If not, you will be lucky to even get a competent agent and you could be spending days on the phone (Don't get me started on the Fiji call centre). Before you even ask them to get you a new flight, they will often suggest full refund. Unfortunately this is currently the reality of QF call centre service.

The official qantas commercial policy (for agents to handle flight cancellations or schedule changes) is to rebook the passenger in the lowest class available within the chosen cabin. This includes award seats.

This means that passengers can be reaccommodated even if no awards are available, or if the lowest revenue classes have sold out.

 

[roby]

The official qantas commercial policy (for agents to handle flight cancellations or schedule changes) is to rebook the passenger in the lowest class available within the chosen cabin. This includes award seats.

This means that passengers can be reaccommodated even if no awards are available, or if the lowest revenue classes have sold out.

Have you tried their call centres laterly? Try finding a competent agent and explaining that to him/her, you would probably need to call 50 times, not joking!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Have you tried their call centres laterly? Try finding a competent agent and explaining that to him/her, you would probably need to call 50 times, not joking!

For flights sold and operated by qantas I don’t think there is an issue. Agents simply rebook you.

The difficulty can be with partner airline schedule changes, and that’s covered by the conditions of carriage… it is an event outside of QF’s control and while they will try to help, there’s obviously only so much they can do. If an alternative flight isn’t offered by the partner, QF will refund.