Help "optimising" an award fare

[wafliron]

Looking for some advice on the following - any help or suggestions much appreciated!

My partner and I am heading off on a month-long trip to the USA next May (roughly - dates can be a bit flexible either way). The current plan is to visit the following cities / regions (roughly, exact itinerary still TBD):

- New York
- Washington
- Miami
- New Orleans
- Yellowstone National Park
- Las Vegas
- Los Angeles
- San Francisco

Due to weather considerations and geographical proximity, we're planning on visiting the cities / regions roughly in the above order - starting in New York or Washington, and flying home from Los Angeles or San Francisco. Movement from place to place will be by air, except perhaps Yellowstone -> Vegas - we may fly from Yellowstone to somewhere on route 66 a little closer to Vegas, and then drive the remainder.

That leads to my first question: does anyone see any issues with the above itinerary, or have any general suggestions?

Moving on, and the main point of this post: the international flights will be to/from MEL, booked using points, and travelling in J (possibly F in one direction if the points balances allow it). I currently have enough SQ and QF points to fly any combination of Star Alliance or OneWorld airlines (*A both ways, OW both ways, or *A one way and OW the other).

I was originally thinking of flying SQ on the way over (MEL-xSIN-JFK) as I'd love to fly on SQ's all-J A340 service. However, there doesn't appear to be any availability showing for Saver awards on the xSIN-JFK leg on the A340 (not just waitlisted - actually showing "Not Available") - I'm assuming this might be due to the titbits I've read of SQ possibly pulling the all-J service on this route, or maybe they just don't allow Saver awards on it?

Anyway, assuming the SQ all-J A340 service is not an option, my current plan B is QF on the way over (MEL-xLAX-JFK, hopefully FASA, or JASA with J->F upgrade requested on MEL-xLAX), and pretty open on the way home - QF is the quickest option and just fine, but given we're flying J I don't mind a longer trip via Asia and am interested to try SQ/TG/CX (not to mention a stop in Hong Kong would be nice).

The above is some current plans and preferences, but they're just that - preferences - and I'm open to changing them if there's a good reason. Hence, I'm interested to know if anyone has any suggestions - either in general, or more specifically can suggest a way to "optimise" the airlines and routings used to reduce either points burn or eliminate the need to pay for some of the domestic flights inside the USA.

Two "optimisation" options I'd considered so far:

1) I don't think RTW tickets on either *A or OW will save any points, as the points burn for a return "regular" award redemptions is lower (except perhaps if we decide to fly QF one way, and CX via HKG the other) and I'm pretty sure both alliances only allow one or two domestic sectors on a RTW ticket. There's also a potential problem with needing to use enough carriers to qualify for a RTW ticket - I guess we could use QF+AA+CX for OW, not sure what the rules are for *A.

2) Flying to / from one city "into" the itinerary and using the first port in the USA as a stopover - e.g. at the start of the trip book MEL-IAD as MEL-xLAX-JFK-IAD with New York as a stopover. Ditto maybe SFO-MEL on the way home as SFO-LAX-MEL with LAX as a stopover. I must admit I'm not sure if this is even possible, nor if it actually saves points?

I'm really starting to stretch my FF knowledge here, so I'd greatly appreciate any thoughts on the above two possible "point / $$$ saving options", plus any other, different ideas.

Thanks!

 

[jgm]

I can see 2*J on SQ22 Apr 29,30 & May 1 & 2 2013. Nothing showing up later, but I can only see up to the 5th of May.

 

[drron]

Well you will have a little problem flying in to Yellowstone.There is a Yellowstone Regional airport but only open June to september.
Best bet is flying into Jackson Hole-100 miles south-AA flies there via DFW and Delta via ATL.
There is an airport at Bozeman Montana.Delta fly into there and Allegiant flies from there to LAS.It is 90 miles north.
Personally I would fly into Jackson Hole,hire a car,drive through the Grand Tetons NP to Yellowstone and then drive to LAS-~1000KM on good roads but it also means you can visit some of the National Parks in Utah which are spectacular.Good roads all the way.

 

[wafliron]

I can see 2*J on SQ22 Apr 29,30 & May 1 & 2 2013. Nothing showing up later, but I can only see up to the 5th of May.

Hmm, you're correct, I can see those flights too - but if I search 26th, 27th or 28th of April then both Saver and Standard J awards on the A340 service are showing as "Not available" (Full is, however). Any idea why the difference?

Thanks too.

Well you will have a little problem flying in to Yellowstone.There is a Yellowstone Regional airport but only open June to september.
Best bet is flying into Jackson Hole-100 miles south-AA flies there via DFW and Delta via ATL.

There is an airport at Bozeman Montana. Delta fly into there and Allegiant flies from there to LAS.It is 90 miles north.

Personally I would fly into Jackson Hole,hire a car,drive through the Grand Tetons NP to Yellowstone and then drive to LAS-~1000KM on good roads but it also means you can visit some of the National Parks in Utah which are spectacular.Good roads all the way.

Thanks for the tips Dr Ron - I wasn't actually expecting to fly all the way to Yellowstone, but you've saved me a bunch of research about how to get all the way there

Thanks also for the suggestion re driving from Yellowstone back to LAS - that could an option too. Have you driven this route and route 66? If so, which would you rate as better?

 

[trooper]

If coming back with the *A I'd suggest trying to plan the long haul either via NRT with NH or ICN with OZ.. Their new C seats are very good.. and the service is generally very good indeed... (JMO!!)

 

[drron]

Driving to LAS from Yellowstone I would rate as the better trip because of the side trips you can do to Utah National Parks-Bryce Canyon and Zion are not much of a detour.A bit more of a detour is the Grand Canyon.
We have done this drive on a couple of occasions,really enjoyed it.Also a lot of route 66.If you do detour via the Grand Canyon then you can also pick up route 66 just east of Williams Arizona to Kingman,AZ where you would then go north on 93(a very good road)past the Hoover Dam to LAS.Really depends on how much time you have.Thats the problem with the states-often too much to see.

 

[ShaneN]

Looking for some advice on the following - any help or suggestions much appreciated!

My partner and I am heading off on a month-long trip to the USA next May (roughly - dates can be a bit flexible either way). The current plan is to visit the following cities / regions (roughly, exact itinerary still TBD):

- New York
- Washington
- Miami
- New Orleans
- Yellowstone National Park
- Las Vegas
- Los Angeles
- San Francisco

That is a lot to cover in one month

 

[jgm]

Hmm, you're correct, I can see those flights too - but if I search 26th, 27th or 28th of April then both Saver and Standard J awards on the A340 service are showing as "Not available" (Full is, however). Any idea why the difference?

Thanks too.

I expect it's due to midweek V weekend. Now showing on Monday 6th May as well.

 

[wafliron]

Driving to LAS from Yellowstone I would rate as the better trip because of the side trips you can do to Utah National Parks-Bryce Canyon and Zion are not much of a detour.A bit more of a detour is the Grand Canyon.
We have done this drive on a couple of occasions,really enjoyed it.Also a lot of route 66.If you do detour via the Grand Canyon then you can also pick up route 66 just east of Williams Arizona to Kingman,AZ where you would then go north on 93(a very good road)past the Hoover Dam to LAS.Really depends on how much time you have.Thats the problem with the states-often too much to see.

Thanks, that's really helpful. As you say, time is the limiting factor though - if we do decide to drive Yellowstone to LAS, would you say it's worth the diversion via the Grand Canyon and onto route 66 as you suggested, as opposed to going direct? i.e. is it worth spending extra time doing that and cutting time from elsewhere in our trip (based on the proposed itinerary in my OP).

That is a lot to cover in one month

Yes, it is :-/ Hence why it's still a bit of a draft, we may have to cut some destinations out to make everything else fit. The problem is deciding what to cut, as they're all destinations we really want to visit!

If coming back with the *A I'd suggest trying to plan the long haul either via NRT with NH or ICN with OZ.. Their new C seats are very good.. and the service is generally very good indeed... (JMO!!)

Thanks for the tip - will check that out.

I expect it's due to midweek V weekend. Now showing on Monday 6th May as well.

Ahh right, that would make sense - all of the searches I'd been running would have been for weekends. Thanks - glad to find out the A340 option can be done

---

Thanks for the feedback to date everyone, really appreciate it. Does anyone have any commentary / ideas about ways to "optimise" the flights to save points / $$$ though?

 

[drron]

Driving via the Grand canyon would require 4-5 days so probably not worth it though the Grand Canyon is spectacular.
With time short I would overnight somewhere south of Salt Lake city-probably 6-7 hours driving.next day go south and detour via bryce Canyon and Zion National parks-both spectacular.overnight at St. George-it has an HGI and a Hampton Inn.Then just a morning drive to Vegas.
Before you go get an Annual National Parks Pass which gets the car and all occupants into any NP.Costs $US80.Each National Park in this neck of the woods is $25 per vehicle.
Looking at your itinerary I would probably leave out Miami.Nothing really spectacular there.
For Yellowstone you really need a car to get around anyway.

 

[wafliron]

Driving via the Grand canyon would require 4-5 days so probably not worth it though the Grand Canyon is spectacular

Thanks for the extra info Dr Ron - appreciate it. And apologies for the super-slow reply!

 

[Julesmac]

Wafliron, a little off-topic, but can I suggest you visit the Smithsonian Air & Space Museum in DC. We spent about 6 hours there, time whizzed by. It is absolutely the coolest place I've ever been to! And free!

 

[casanovawa]

Not sure if you have the points but would 2 x 280,000 OW award flights be an option, You get 35,000 miles of flights and 5 stops with 16 segments... You could certainly use QF and AA (for internal flights) and only need a CX or BA depending if you did go RTW and the 5 stops means you could use several of those for internal flights within the US, so first stop JFK and do a quick land leg down to Wash DC another stop down at Miami, New Orleans, maybe up to Jackson hole and do a land leg trhough the West Coast and then a stop in Hong Kong or something on the way back???

The itin does look tight with 4 weeks and 8 stops, so about half a week in each, but that is roughly the time i allow for my trips as i like to jump around... They all look like pretty good stops to me, depends what you like doing in cities though...

 

[wafliron]

Wafliron, a little off-topic, but can I suggest you visit the Smithsonian Air & Space Museum in DC. We spent about 6 hours there, time whizzed by. It is absolutely the coolest place I've ever been to! And free!

Thanks for the tip Jules - definitely going to the Smithsonian In fact, that's by far the main reason I want to go to Washington.

Not sure if you have the points but would 2 x 280,000 OW award flights be an option, You get 35,000 miles of flights and 5 stops with 16 segments... You could certainly use QF and AA (for internal flights) and only need a CX or BA depending if you did go RTW and the 5 stops means you could use several of those for internal flights within the US, so first stop JFK and do a quick land leg down to Wash DC another stop down at Miami, New Orleans, maybe up to Jackson hole and do a land leg trhough the West Coast and then a stop in Hong Kong or something on the way back???

Thanks for that - you prompted me to take another look at the rules for a OW RTW points fares. I was previously under the mistaken impression that they only allowed two stopovers in each country, but it looks like that's *A. Total of 5 still doesn't leave many to use up in the USA, but it's better than two!

Do you think the RTW fare is worth the extra points though? It's 448k for two pax MEL-xLAX-JFK and LAX-MEL in QF J, compared to 560k for two pax on a RTW OW fare. That extra 112k QFF points is "only" buying me 3 extra USA domestic stopovers, and from what I understand the domestic flights will be in Y despite (due to lack of J on most AA domestic AA flights).

The itin does look tight with 4 weeks and 8 stops, so about half a week in each, but that is roughly the time i allow for my trips as i like to jump around... They all look like pretty good stops to me, depends what you like doing in cities though...

After thinking about it a bit further I think we're going to drop one or two cities from the itinerary and spend a bit longer in all the others - especially after Dr Ron's suggestion re the drive from Yellowstone back to LAS. Still haven't decided which ones to drop though