Hhonors subtle "Enhancement" ??

[Moopere]

I know there has been recent posts and at least one long thread on the changes coming to HHonors. The chat was mostly centred around Diamonds but there seems to be a more general tightening of the the whole system. Just got this in an email a few minutes ago:

Hilton HHonors™ - MyWay Benefits Blue

Looks to me like the inevitable tightening and clarification of benefits due to the mass of 'free' or comped status memberships that all the big chains are throwing out there at the moment.

I notice in particular that the definitions used for gaining the various status tiers have changed to "Paid nights" or "Paid Stays" whereas I before I think it was only "nights" and "stays". I think rewards and other cost offset methods have always not earned, but its really clear and up front now.

 

[beardoc]

I notice in particular that the definitions used for gaining the various status tiers have changed to "Paid nights" or "Paid Stays" whereas I before I think it was only "nights" and "stays". I think rewards and other cost offset methods have always not earned, but its really clear and up front now.

Whilst they can always change the Terms and Conditions, currently Rewards count towards elite status requalification:

Hilton HHonors® - HHonors® Terms & Conditions

In point 14 of "accrual of points:

"For purposes of counting stays and nights for Elite tier qualification (as explained below), Reward Stays will count towards the number of overall stays and nights."

We may naturally see this change of course - it is interesting. I might fire off a message to Hilton Diamond desk about this.

 

[serfty]

...

We may naturally see this change of course - it is interesting. I might fire off a message to Hilton Diamond desk about this.

I doubt it, especially since SPG began counting some reward stays toward status in the last few months (prior to the recent significant changes).

Aside from that, paid with HHonors points is still paid.

 

[Moopere]

Aside from that, paid with HHonors points is still paid.

Ahh, thats an interesting take. Paid with "something"; ie points or money, as opposed to free (presumably certificate style) stays.

Ok, perhaps I'm reading too much into the new wording.

 

[straitman]

Whilst they can always change the Terms and Conditions, currently Rewards count towards elite status requalification:

Hilton HHonors® - HHonors® Terms & Conditions

In point 14 of "accrual of points:

"For purposes of counting stays and nights for Elite tier qualification (as explained below), Reward Stays will count towards the number of overall stays and nights."

We may naturally see this change of course - it is interesting. I might fire off a message to Hilton Diamond desk about this.

Personally I would not stir the pot. Award stays have counted for as long as I know about.

 

[pshepvic]

They've actually bumped up the benefits - I got an email yesterday saying that Diamond now get all 3 benefits instead of having to choose. So you get an upgrade (which now officially includes suites), continental breakfast, and an extra 1000 bonus points.

I also got one from SPG a week ago indicating there is a choice upon check in for Gold members to get free in-room Internet, or 250 bonus points, or a complimentary beverage.

Seems like the competition is heating up a bit and the benefits are improving.


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[drron]

They've actually bumped up the benefits - I got an email yesterday saying that Diamond now get all 3 benefits instead of having to choose. So you get an upgrade (which now officially includes suites), continental breakfast, and an extra 1000 bonus points.

I also got one from SPG a week ago indicating there is a choice upon check in for Gold members to get free in-room Internet, or 250 bonus points, or a complimentary beverage.

Seems like the competition is heating up a bit and the benefits are improving.


Sent from my iPhone using AustFreqFly app

Unlike SPG where both plat and diamond have got increased benefits the worry is for people below diamond in Hhonors.Many golds are worried that their previous benefits will be eroded.The wording re the changes gives real cause for worry.

 

[anat0l]

The ambiguity is rather concerning, but are they perhaps attempting to exclude nights on free night certificates to count towards elite qualification?

 

[Deleted member 29185]

They've actually bumped up the benefits - I got an email yesterday saying that Diamond now get all 3 benefits instead of having to choose.

On checkin at Surfers on Thursday, the bubbly reception lady went to great pain to explain the increased benefit to me, finishing by saying "Well bascially......you get everything!" How can one argue such a convincing spiel?

the worry is for people below diamond in Hhonors.

I should say this quietly, I know....but isn't that the idea? With this DJ/HH deal, I'm dedicated to repaying the gesture by definitely shifting my accomodation choices toward Hilton to the point of even taking relaxation stays, just for the hell of it (well the spectre of losing status without 4 stays in 6 months may have swayed that judgement slightly ). It's worked though, to the point that I'm not sure I'll requal as diamond, but will definitely score gold and I was thinking that with such little difference between diamond and gold, what's the problem? I'm now thinking I'll have to make a bit better effort and keep diamond. Isn't that just what HH want?? (even my $ conscious +1, is HH points watching.....now that's scary).

 

[Moopere]

It's worked though, to the point that I'm not sure I'll requal as diamond, but will definitely score gold and I was thinking that with such little difference between diamond and gold, what's the problem? I'm now thinking I'll have to make a bit better effort and keep diamond. Isn't that just what HH want?? (even my $ conscious +1, is HH points watching.....now that's scary).

For their captured client base sure, they want to give you reason to spend more with them - quite reasonable.

However, its not just that in this game, they need to always be wary of the competition just as with any loyalty scheme I guess. Its about earn/burn.

I perceive that things didn't just get better for those below Diamond, not sure yet if things are actually worse, but it seems they might be. Also, even for diamonds, the change in wording now leads one to believe that executive level upgrades can no longer be expected .. they _may_ arrive, but the wording has been changed for a reason I'm guessing.

For those with middle status in several programs, changing T&C will cause those people to re-evaluate their strategy. Hilton will be hoping that folks will go all in for their Diamond level, but its a gamble. I might just decide to move my spend to SPG to guarantee Platinum (for example).

 

[drron]

On checkin at Surfers on Thursday, the bubbly reception lady went to great pain to explain the increased benefit to me, finishing by saying "Well bascially......you get everything!" How can one argue such a convincing spiel?



I should say this quietly, I know....but isn't that the idea? With this DJ/HH deal, I'm dedicated to repaying the gesture by definitely shifting my accomodation choices toward Hilton to the point of even taking relaxation stays, just for the hell of it (well the spectre of losing status without 4 stays in 6 months may have swayed that judgement slightly ). It's worked though, to the point that I'm not sure I'll requal as diamond, but will definitely score gold and I was thinking that with such little difference between diamond and gold, what's the problem? I'm now thinking I'll have to make a bit better effort and keep diamond. Isn't that just what HH want?? (even my $ conscious +1, is HH points watching.....now that's scary).

But SPG can improve both plat and gold whilst it appears HH is improving diamond and debasing gold.It takes more than just the top tier customers to make the hotel profitable.By the way I had Hhonors diamond for 7 years and the treatment certainly didn't improve over that time and why i now am with SPG.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

it appears HH is improving diamond and debasing gold.

Are they debasing gold?

I've just had a read of that email from HH and they still offer room upgrdes if available (exec floor was never guaranteed was it?), and now give the option of points benefit or breakfast, similar to the option diamonds had until recently.

What debasing has occurred? (I ask that in all sincerity. It's not rhetorical)

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[TD="width: 558, bgcolor: #c8d7de"] As a valued Hilton HHonors™ member, we've taken the benefits you know and love and made them even better. Now, when you check in to Conrad® Hotels & Resorts, Hilton Hotels & Resorts and DoubleTree by Hilton™, you will get a room upgrade at check-in when space is available. And when you reach Diamond status, you'll now receive both daily complimentary continental breakfast and 1,000 Bonus Points per stay. As a Gold member, you have the option of choosing between these two great benefits.

These new benefits are in addition to all of the other benefits you currently receive as an HHonors member. Reacquaint yourself with all of your HHonors benefits and start having more experiences worth sharing. [/TD]

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[serfty]

It used to state upgrade to "Executive" floor/room if available. Now it's simply a "Preferred Room".

Lounge access for Gold is only if upgraded to executive. Implication is a Hotel can put a gold into a room with enhanced amenities/view/etc. that is not classed as "executive" and state "there's your upgrade; sorry no lounge access".

 

[Deleted member 29185]

It used to state upgrade to "Executive" floor/room if available. Now it's simply a "preferred Room".

Lounge access for Gold only if upgraded to executive.

But nothing as yet, suggests exec floor is off limits to a gold upgrade. I understand the thought that the change must have been made for a resason, but I don't see too much difference there. Didn't gold always only have exec access with an exec floor upgrade?

In fact, the upgrade may be to a better than exec floor room....perhaps a suite, which apparently is now allowed.

 

[serfty]

But nothing as yet, suggests exec floor is off limits to a gold upgrade. I understand the thought that the change must have been made for a resason, but I don't see too much difference there. Didn't gold always only have exec access with an exec floor upgrade?

In fact, the upgrade may be to a better than exec floor room....perhaps a suite, which apparently is now allowed.

The problem is that it moves much choice to a Hotel's management.

Here in Oz they tend to be pretty much switched on (these days) - often going beyond the guaranteed benefits.

It was not always the case - until August 2008 Hilton family hotels outside of North America simply had the "upgrade" facet (for both Diamond and Gold) and I found for example that both BNE and HOP would more often than not put HHonors guests in a room with bathrobes/bigger shampoos etc (e.g. Plus Room) and not grant lounge access as a matter of course. The 2008 rationalisation fixed that.

With these changes, there is nothing to stop the hotels doing the same with "preferred" rooms - but with guaranteed lounge access for diamond and now none for Gold.

I am referring to the minimum benefits here - sometimes hotels go beyond these.

 

[Flashback]

I'm looking at the Hilton Garden Inn Krakow for our honeymoon and booking a king room, it appears room upgrades aren't a benefit for HGIs anyway so free breakfast will have to do. Maybe they'll feel nice and upgrade to the junior suite anyway:!:

 

[drron]

But nothing as yet, suggests exec floor is off limits to a gold upgrade. I understand the thought that the change must have been made for a resason, but I don't see too much difference there. Didn't gold always only have exec access with an exec floor upgrade?

In fact, the upgrade may be to a better than exec floor room....perhaps a suite, which apparently is now allowed.

Before the T&C's made Lounge access a promise for Diamonds I often missed out on lounge access-including Adelaide and Cairns+several internationl destinations.So by the changes made in wording I have no doubt that Upgrades to exec floor will be less frequent.
And note the last sentence of the email's first paragraph-you can choose between these great benefits.Before continental breakfast was guaranteed now it is that or points.doesn't really sound like an increase in benefits-more a QF style enhancement.

 

[serfty]

... you can choose between these great benefits.Before continental breakfast was guaranteed now it is that or points.doesn't really sound like an increase in benefits-more a QF style enhancement.

Actually, that had been the case for Golds and Diamonds since Aug. 2008.

Since the changes back then, the choice¹ for both Diamonds and Golds has been:

"1000 HHonors points per stay"
OR
"Upgrade/[continental]Breakfast"
OR
"Complimentary Internet"².
​

The difference was that Gold would not be guaranteed Exec. lounge access unless an exec. upgrade was granted, Diamonds would have this access regardless. Many hotels have been giving golds lounge access in any case - but this is beyond the guaranteed bennies and a big YMMV.

With these latest changes, effectively Platinum get a 1000 points bonus AND "Upgrade/Breakfast" regardless while Gold still have to choose so there is no change there for Golds. However, "Executive Room" has been devolved to "Preferred Rooms", so with this, the chances of a Gold having lounge access via upgrades may be reduced, although a "preferred room" can include some suites.

¹ Some found that by setting their MyWay ViP to 1000 points, they'd often get that as well as the "Upgrade/Breakfast", but that was at a Hotels discretion (or just a lazy front desk). FT is littered with complaints about not getting the "Upgrade/Breakfast" when their setting was for 1000 points.

² Last year Internet access became a standard bennie and the choice devolved to 1000 points or "Upgrade/Breakfast".

 

[anat0l]

Before the T&C's made Lounge access a promise for Diamonds I often missed out on lounge access-including Adelaide and Cairns+several internationl destinations.So by the changes made in wording I have no doubt that Upgrades to exec floor will be less frequent.

That's odd - as a Diamond you should have Executive Lounge access irrespective of your final room type. It is Gold that must get an upgrade to an Executive Level room in order to gain lounge access.

And note the last sentence of the email's first paragraph-you can choose between these great benefits.Before continental breakfast was guaranteed now it is that or points.doesn't really sound like an increase in benefits-more a QF style enhancement.

Not really - before continental breakfast was "guaranteed" only if you chose the MyWay benefit that offers you an upgrade. The other MyWay benefit was the 1000 points.

The change now is subtle but it is either equal or better than before (notwithstanding what an "upgrade" for Gold will ultimately translate to). It is no change if you simply select the continental breakfast option - it is the same as before in selecting the "upgrade" option in MyWay, except one half of the deal is now a Gold standard benefit (i.e. room upgrade) and the other half is a "selected" benefit (i.e. breakfast), compared to the old option where both components constituted the "selected" benefit. On the other hand now, you have the option of selecting the other benefit of 1000 points instead of the breakfast. This is useful if you are booked under a Bed & Breakfast rate where free breakfast wouldn't be useful to you. However under the new system you will still be entitled to an upgrade as well as getting your 1000 points. Under the old system you would've had to choose between a room upgrade (with the "wasted" breakfast) or the 1000 points. (I realise some hotels may organise amenities in lieu in cases like these, but they must be negotiated and are not standard).

In the end, this may not stand out to you as a real benefit, as in technicality it is rejigging the previous benefit scheme to an only slightly more beneficial arrangement. Plus, as mentioned several times, many people are pondering what upgrades for Golds will really amount to now. (Though selecting the breakfast benefit as a Gold


What does chafe me about Hilton is that you needed to select the benefit you wanted in advance of check-in (i.e. by changing a "global" setting in your profile). I suppose this was a big deal when one of the benefits was room upgrade (i.e. need to give hotels enough time to arrange a better room for you), but now that room upgrades are a standard benefit and the other two benefits do not require as much "logistics", it would be so much more convenient if you could choose your benefit (for Golds anyway) at check-in.

 

[serfty]

Before the T&C's made Lounge access a promise for Diamonds I often missed out on lounge access-including Adelaide and Cairns+several internationl destinations.So by the changes made in wording I have no doubt that Upgrades to exec floor will be less frequent.

That's odd - as a Diamond you should have Executive Lounge access irrespective of your final room type. It is Gold that must get an upgrade to an Executive Level room in order to gain lounge access. ...

No, you have that wrong.

drron is referring to pre Aug 2008 when the base HHonors benefits were different between North American Properties and non North American properties.

See my post just a little before yours here:

It was not always the case - until August 2008 Hilton family hotels outside of North America simply had the "upgrade" facet (for both Diamond and Gold) and I found for example that both BNE and HOP would more often than not put HHonors guests in a room with bathrobes/bigger shampoos etc (e.g. Plus Room) and not grant lounge access as a matter of course. The 2008 rationalisation fixed that.

Here's a post I made on FlyerTalk back then:

Originally Posted by serfty
I see this as a enhancement for Diamonds; in that they are now Guaranteed Exec lounge access when staying at hotels that have them worldwide.

Outside the USA, there's little change for Golds other than the benefit of guaranteed continental breakfast. Within the USA executive lounge access is no longer a guaranteed perk; but breakfast is still available.

Here's a June post listing the Gold perks as they were previously.

Originally Posted by Bondiboy
...
Hilton® Hotels in North America 1000 points or

Upgrade to Executive Floor (if available), OR
Executive Floor Lounge access (if the hotel has a Lounge), OR
High Speed Internet Access (available in the US and select locations in Mexico and Canada), OR
complimentary continental breakfast for the member and one guest each day of the stay.
If the rate already includes breakfast, a special food and beverage amenity will be presented.


Hilton® Hotels outside North America (No 1000 point option

Upgrade to Executive Level or to the next best available room type (does not include suites). Upgraded rooms are subject to availability at the time of check-in and only guests that receive an upgrade to the Executive Level will be given access to the Executive Lounge.

At hotels that do not have upgraded types of accommodations or an upgrade is not available, Gold VIPs will receive additional amenities and/or services, which vary by property....