Kurt Fearnley.... his views on Qantas

[milehighclub]

I find it interesting that one minute he is bagging Jetstar for taking his wheelchair (a policy which is clearly stated on the website) at check-in, then less than a month later we find him on the welcome aboard video saying how wonderful Qantas is when it comes to handling his disability. I know the Qantas policy is slightly different to the Jetstar policy however Jetstar does make it clear the conditions for traveling with a wheelchair and since he had flown with them before, why all of a sudden is it news worthy...

I am all for equality and I certainly go out of my way to help all disabled passengers above and beyond what is required of me, however there is a way of making a point and feel he has certainly gone the wrong way about it.

The video can be viewed here
Fly - Onboard - Welcome Aboard
It's under both International and Domestic videos and is titled "Don't Dis My Ability"

 

[Moody]

I find it interesting that you are bagging Kurt for making a positive video for Qantas, who have a very accommodating policy with regards to passengers with special needs.

I see no conflict with him taking Jetstar to task for having a less sympathetic policy ... in fact it makes perfect sense. And now that Jetstar have clarified their policy, the public can be in no doubt who provides the better service.

I think you have gone about making your point in a very negative way.

 

[docjames]

He sure does like publicity.

 

[samh004]

So he goes out of his way to fly with Qantas, but chose Jetstar the other day (or was that a route that Jetstar took over)?

I don’t think we really need to get into another flame war on this topic, so I’ll bow out now. But interesting turn of events. Maybe he’s got some free travel out of the video.

 

[UP4014]

He is a bit tedious.

 

[777]

So he goes out of his way to fly with Qantas, but chose Jetstar the other day (or was that a route that Jetstar took over)?

He lives in Newcastle - which is essentially a port that QF have abandoned to JQ. I doubt he chooses to fly them because he's hunting for cheap tix.

 

[samh004]

He lives in Newcastle - which is essentially a port that QF have abandoned to JQ. I doubt he chooses to fly them because he's hunting for cheap tix.

Ahh OK. Wasn’t sure about that point.

 

[777]

Ahh OK. Wasn’t sure about that point.

I live in MEL but grew up in NTL and go there for work a lot (about 30 times in the last 18 months). Jetstar on this route is pretty much the reason i switched most of my flying to DJ.

 

[medhead]

I find it interesting that you are bagging Kurt for making a positive video for Qantas, who have a very accommodating policy with regards to passengers with special needs.

I see no conflict with him taking Jetstar to task for having a less sympathetic policy ... in fact it makes perfect sense. And now that Jetstar have clarified their policy, the public can be in no doubt who provides the better service.

I think you have gone about making your point in a very negative way.

Was there any doubt that qantas is a full service airline and jetstar is not? Maybe for someone who has been touring outer mongolia for the last 10 years. But anyone in the real world knows that Jetstar is a low cost, lower service airline and that all passengers need to carefully read the jetstar rules. Even my in laws understand that fact and the last time they flew anywhere was in 1985.

I find it very interesting that you defend Kurt's bagging of Jetstar despite the obvious facts about low cost carriers, and then act negatively to anyone who mentions the elephant sitting in the corner, regarding Kurt's in consistent actions.

But then again not that interesting.....

 

[Moody]

Was there any doubt that qantas is a full service airline and jetstar is not? Maybe for someone who has been touring outer mongolia for the last 10 years. But anyone in the real world knows that Jetstar is a low cost, lower service airline and that all passengers need to carefully read the jetstar rules. Even my in laws understand that fact and the last time they flew anywhere was in 1985.

I find it very interesting that you defend Kurt's bagging of Jetstar despite the obvious facts about low cost carriers, and then act negatively to anyone who mentions the elephant sitting in the corner, regarding Kurt's in consistent actions.

But then again not that interesting.....

So being a LCC allows you to treat disabled passengers like sub-human cripples? That is patently absurd. Both Virgin (a LCC) and Qantas (who skate around the edges) offer a sympathetic policy. At the time Kurt raised his complaint Jetstar had a published policy of transferring wheelchairs users "at or near the gate", but have now admitted that they will always demand that the wheelchair be checked in 2 hours prior to departure.

So the facts are that Jetstar was lying and are now telling the truth and that has nothing to do with being a LCC. It's called honesty. And now that Kurt has exposed these lies and made Jetstar own up to having a truly horrendous policy for disabled passengers of his kind, people can make more informed decisions.

That's what this forum is about ... isn't it?

 

[medhead]

So being a LCC allows you to treat disabled passengers like sub-human cripples? That is patently absurd.

1. I didn't say that at all. Please do try to read the other posts, before putting your own emotive spin onto them.

2. It is only your opinion that Jetstar's policy treats people like sub-human cripples. I don't agree that less-able people are sub-human cripples, no matter what emotive language you use. (in fact, I have a mobility impairment myself)

3. Qantas requires people with guide dogs to provide notice before allowing them to fly. In your terms: treatment as a sub-human cripple?

Both Virgin (a LCC) and Qantas (who skate around the edges) offer a sympathetic policy. At the time Kurt raised his complaint Jetstar had a published policy of transferring wheelchairs users "at or near the gate", but have now admitted that they will always demand that the wheelchair be checked in 2 hours prior to departure.

So the facts are that Jetstar was lying and are now telling the truth and that has nothing to do with being a LCC. It's called honesty. And now that Kurt has exposed these lies and made Jetstar own up to having a truly horrendous policy for disabled passengers of his kind, people can make more informed decisions.

That's what this forum is about ... isn't it?

3. Virgin is no longer a LCC. Yet Jetstar firmly remains as such.

4. You seem to only mention facts that support your version of events

5. There are plenty of people here who fully understand that Jetstar is a LCC that will do absolutely everything to minimise their costs. It is good to inform the casual visitor to the site of this fact. But there are plenty of other examples here to illustrate this fact. IMO your emotive language isn't helpful.

6. To me this forum is about:

Learn how to maximise the value of your Qantas Frequent Flyer points, Virgin Blue Velocity and other airline frequent flyer points. Ask all Travel related questions, and share your Travel knowledge and experiences.

I'm not sure that includes accusations of lying, or throwing around language like "sub-human cripple".

 

[UP4014]

Have to agree with medhead.

 

[straitman]

So being a LCC allows you to treat disabled passengers like sub-human cripples? That is patently absurd. Both Virgin (a LCC) and Qantas (who skate around the edges) offer a sympathetic policy. At the time Kurt raised his complaint Jetstar had a published policy of transferring wheelchairs users "at or near the gate", but have now admitted that they will always demand that the wheelchair be checked in 2 hours prior to departure.

So the facts are that Jetstar was lying and are now telling the truth and that has nothing to do with being a LCC. It's called honesty. And now that Kurt has exposed these lies and made Jetstar own up to having a truly horrendous policy for disabled passengers of his kind, people can make more informed decisions.

That's what this forum is about ... isn't it?

Moody,

I quoted you here so you could read your post again and reflect :!:

 

[Moody]

Medhead,

Well at least you put forward an argument .... unlike others who just repost with a smilie or a pithy comment. OK - let me explain why your original post annoyed me.

Was there any doubt that qantas is a full service airline and jetstar is not? Maybe for someone who has been touring outer mongolia for the last 10 years. But anyone in the real world knows that Jetstar is a low cost, lower service airline and that all passengers need to carefully read the jetstar rules. Even my in laws understand that fact and the last time they flew anywhere was in 1985.

No - there is absolutely no doubt that Jetstar is extremely cost conscious. There was no need to mention "outer mongolia", "real world", or "Even my in-laws". Each one of those comments was designed to be personally insulting and denigrating - mostly to me but I think you also owe your in-laws an apology. In any case the sarcastic tone was designed to put me offside and it worked.

But to use the LCC moniker as an excuse for discriminatory service does not wash. So if I wanted to operate a low-cost-shopping-centre I could force wheelchair users to park at the farthest corner of the lot 2 hours before I opened, and then make them transfer to a shopping trolley like an errant toddler so that they could be pushed around the mall? I would be shut down in very short order and rightly so.

I find it very interesting that you defend Kurt's bagging of Jetstar despite the obvious facts about low cost carriers, and then act negatively to anyone who mentions the elephant sitting in the corner, regarding Kurt's in consistent actions.

But then again not that interesting.....

The obvious facts about LCCs are that they offer a no-frills service in the name of price competitiveness. Hopefully we are all in agreement now and can stop playing childish games. But what was not obvious until the recent publicity was the enormous gulf between the service provided by Jetstar and the other 2 major domestic carriers. In part this was because the topic hadn't been raised before (to my knowledge) but also partly because Jetstar misinformed the public about their policy. They have now clarified that policy, to whit :-

Have legs - check in 30 minutes prior to boarding and we'll see you at the gate.
No legs - check in 2 hours prior to departure and we will transfer you to a push-chair and take you to the gate. Try not to soil yourself while waiting for your flight.

Oops - there I go again with the emotive language. And here's me without any mobility impairment or friends with one. Must be that nasty empathy rearing it's head again.

Anyway - I am still struggling with the statement "Kurt's inconsistent actions" I have a few theories based around your previous (and repetitive) referral to Kurt sometimes being carried into camp whilst on his Kokodo trek, but it would be best for you to explain in your own words.

As to your rebuttal ...

1. I didn't say that at all. Please do try to read the other posts, before putting your own emotive spin onto them.

True - I used the term "sub-human cripples" as a logical extension of your claim that being a LCC was an excuse for discriminatory behaviour. Do you really believe that to be true?

2. It is only your opinion that Jetstar's policy treats people like sub-human cripples. I don't agree that less-able people are sub-human cripples, no matter what emotive language you use. (in fact, I have a mobility impairment myself)

In that case I find your lack of empathy even more disappointing.

3. Qantas requires people with guide dogs to provide notice before allowing them to fly. In your terms: treatment as a sub-human cripple?

Errr ... no. I assume that either you were determined to make 6 points up or your medication has really kicked in. Where did this one come from?

3. Virgin is no longer a LCC. Yet Jetstar firmly remains as such.

I disagree - please explain the differences in the models they pursue.

4. You seem to only mention facts that support your version of events

Errrr ... yes ... Most people do.

5. There are plenty of people here who fully understand that Jetstar is a LCC that will do absolutely everything to minimise their costs. It is good to inform the casual visitor to the site of this fact. But there are plenty of other examples here to illustrate this fact. IMO your emotive language isn't helpful.

This is not about cost minimisation - it is about treating ALL customers with dignity.

6. To me this forum is about: "[quote removed" - I'm not sure that includes accusations of lying, or throwing around language like "sub-human cripple".

Jetstar seriously misinformed the public about the very sub-standard service offered to wheelchair-bound passengers. How's that for a compromise?

 

[medhead]

Medhead,

Well at least you put forward an argument .... unlike others who just repost with a smilie or a pithy comment. OK - let me explain why your original post annoyed me.

Well lets just say that I wouldn't have posted anything if you hadn't of put in the 2nd post to this thread, which annoyed me greatly. In was negative and emotive and it failed to recognise that other people have different views on Kurt's behaviour. Personally, I believe that he picks and choose when he wants to be outraged. Referring to me as sickening is not going to change my views.

Edit: just skimmed through the rest of your post.

I have empathy for people who are in situations beyond their control.

This is not about cost minimisation - it is about treating ALL customers with dignity.

Clearly you dont understand the LCC model - It is about cost minimisation and that effects what options customers get presented. From the information presented in the newspaper Jetstar didn't force Kurt to crawl around the airport. He made that choice. It certainly wasn't the situation you describe:

No legs - check in 2 hours prior to departure and we will transfer you to a push-chair and take you to the gate. Try not to soil yourself while waiting for your flight.

Or get your brother who is standing there next to you to ensure your safety while in the push chair by pusjing you to the facilities provided by the airport.

 

[Moody]

Medhead,

You really should read the posts a couple of times to pick up the finer points. Let's look at post #2 with a bit of care :-

I find it interesting that you are bagging Kurt for making a positive video for Qantas, who have a very accommodating policy with regards to passengers with special needs.

I see no conflict with him taking Jetstar to task for having a less sympathetic policy ... in fact it makes perfect sense. And now that Jetstar have clarified their policy, the public can be in no doubt who provides the better service.

I think you have gone about making your point in a very negative way.

Now we have your review of it :-

Well lets just say that I wouldn't have posted anything if you hadn't of put in the 2nd post to this thread, which annoyed me greatly. In was negative and emotive and it failed to recognise that other people have different views on Kurt's behaviour. Personally, I believe that he picks and choose when he wants to be outraged. Referring to me as sickening is not going to change my views..

Negative? Emotive?? Maybe I'm not using enough smilies for people who struggle with comprehension. And where did I refer to you as sickening?

And maybe you should read Jetstars new Wheelchair policy. If you don't happen to have a carer on hand you are SOOL, and if Kurt had too much pride as a paralympian to be pushed around the airport then good on him.

But to get back on topic .... I find it very, very peculiar that this thread started as a criticism of Kurt for making a positive video about Qantas' treatment of mobility-impaired customers. It seemed like a petty reason to have a go at him, but pettiness is AFF's middle name.

 

[medhead]

Medhead,
Negative? Emotive?? Maybe I'm not using enough smilies for people who struggle with comprehension.

But to get back on topic .... I find it very, very peculiar that this thread started as a criticism of Kurt for making a positive video about Qantas' treatment of mobility-impaired customers. It seemed like a petty reason to have a go at him, but pettiness is AFF's middle name.

Negative:

I find it interesting that you are bagging Kurt

Emotive:

I think you have gone about making your point in a very negative way.

As I said someone is expressing an opinion that you don't agree with and you respond by making negative characterisations about their opinion and then follow it up with accusations.

The thread started by highlighting the apparent hypocrisy of Kurt's actions. It seems to me that you only see that as petty because of Kurt's mobility impairment. Sorry but in my world view I apply my standards for this type of behaviour equally, to all people.

BTW: I don't read the fine detail of your posts because I don't like being characterised as sickening and your going on about stuff that has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.

edit: but then I have to put in edits: Kurt did have someone on hand to help him. You just proved my point. Glad you finally get in.

 

[Moody]

Medhead,

I have re-read the above a number of times but can find nothing worth quoting because it is self-evidently a complete load of cobblers. Looks like you have a bee in your bonnet about Kurt and me so feel free to finish this thread off in the manner in which it started - with a petty and ill-informed attack upon an individual who tried their best to enlighten the public.

I don't "get it" and hope I never do.

 

[ejb]

Medhead,

I have re-read the above a number of times but can find nothing worth quoting because it is self-evidently a complete load of cobblers. Looks like you have a bee in your bonnet about Kurt and me so feel free to finish this thread off in the manner in which it started - with a petty and ill-informed attack upon an individual who tried their best to enlighten the public.

I don't "get it" and hope I never do.

How was he "enlightening the public" as you claim. I am trying to see this from both sides but I am lost.

ejb

 

[medhead]

I don't "get it" and hope I never do.

Well lets just say that I will continue to apply the same standard to Kurt's actions as I would of anyone else. I'm not going to treat him differently (be less critical when criticism is warranted) just because he is in a wheelchair. In my view ignoring character faults because of a disability is demeaning and patronising.