New ways to use QFF points...email

[lovetravellingoz]

Hi all...I noticed this announcement at the base of an email from Qantas on 20th Birthday Offers. Some of this was mentioned in newspaper articles a while back...but some is perhaps new?



[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]More ways to use your points – coming soon![/FONT][/FONT][FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]From mid 2008 we’re planning exciting new benefits for our Frequent Flyers. These include introducing any seat availability redemption options on Qantas and Jetstar flights. Our plans also include expanding our extensive family of partners and our reward range, so you’ll be able to earn and redeem points in a variety of new ways.[/FONT][/FONT]


So:

• any seat availability
• new partners for redemtion

 

[JohnK]

I know some people are in favour of it but I just do not like the sound of 'any seat availability'.

To me all it means is that you will be charged a premium on FF points required for hard to get award seats but I also expect this change to increase FF points required for normal award seats. We shall wait and see but I am not keeping fingers crossed or holding my breath. Yes I know the sky is not falling in....

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Yes I too expect that the current points required for flights will be "enhanced" with all redemptions costing more...

Lets hope not.


On the other hand there are some with big point blanaces who have busy lives who cannot get redemptions...and so for them paying more may bea good option.

How much this "more' ends up being will be interesting....

 

[Commuter]

I hope it won't affect the 'better award seat availability' benefit for the WPs... But I suspect it will, somehow.

 

[Standby]

I would expect QF will have to convince the ACCC,as they have in the past, how manage FF avail.As for they way they seem to provide better access for higher tier FF it doesnt make sense to annoy those that actually give them the most money.Tier status isnt earnt by credit card spend.
Realistically I see this like any other monetaryized (is that a word?)scheme.
The likeihood of anyone using points more than 2 or 3 levels above the cheapest fares avail seem remote.....if SYDMEL is 8K who in their right mind is going to waste 20K-25K in points for a one way flight for poss last seat availablility heaven forbid what that means on a longhaul flight. DJ will be in the same boat with velocity anyseat on V Australia when they get off the gound.Bottom line its all marketing spin to say you can access any seat when in reality it makes no sense to do so

 

[Mal]

if SYDMEL is 8K who in their right mind is going to waste 20K-25K in points for a one way flight for poss last seat availablility

There are people who channel their entire business spend through their cards. 20000 points is nothing to them, and if they get a free flight worth $300 for that, then they're happy.

Any level of redemption will have people queuing up for redemptions.

 

[one9]

I know some people are in favour of it but I just do not like the sound of 'any seat availability'.

To me all it means is that you will be charged a premium on FF points required for hard to get award seats but I also expect this change to increase FF points required for normal award seats. We shall wait and see but I am not keeping fingers crossed or holding my breath. Yes I know the sky is not falling in....

FF points are going to continually be devalued regardless of which enhancements they chose to make.

 

[JohnK]

Yes I agree but not to the point where the points I earn through flying are devalued so much because of the airlines huge liability through credit card FF point earning, especially the sign on bonuses.

It is ludicrous when you can earn 40,000 FF points by signing up for a credit card with no annual fee in the first year and minimal spend, if any. I am being loyal to the airline by flying with them regularly whereas these people are not loyal to the airline or the credit card company. I just hope that someone wakes up shortly and these type of offers disappear and we can get back to the proper way of earning FF points.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]""Our plans also include expanding our extensive family of partners and our reward range, so you’ll be able to earn and redeem points in a variety of new ways."

I would read this as meaning that the FF is not going to be narrowed back to just earning points for flying anytime soon...and indeed it would seem to be accelerating in the other direction....both for earning and redeeming.

The trick as aways will be in maximising the situation for ones own personal circumstances.


Hopefully there will be some "loopholes" that can be exploited.


On the AMEX sign on deals...they seem to be tightening up as most of the recent ones have had some minimum spend provisions.
[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[one9]

Yes I agree but not to the point where the points I earn through flying are devalued so much because of the airlines huge liability through credit card FF point earning, especially the sign on bonuses.

It is ludicrous when you can earn 40,000 FF points by signing up for a credit card with no annual fee in the first year and minimal spend, if any. I am being loyal to the airline by flying with them regularly whereas these people are not loyal to the airline or the credit card company. I just hope that someone wakes up shortly and these type of offers disappear and we can get back to the proper way of earning FF points.

SC is what rewards loyal customers. no matter how many points you have you can't get status privlidges without SC

 

[Flying Fox]

Yes I think that it will signal greater costs for a 'normal' reward and even greater costs for an 'anytime' reward seat......

Hopefully I'm wrong.

 

[MelUser]

This is the way that UA's Mileage Plus Program works. You can get a standard award [AUS - anywhere in North America] for 150 000 in Y [220K(J) 270K(F)] or it is 80 000(Y) /110K(J) 140K(F) points for a "saver award".

So it's roughly double but it does 2 things:

(1) guarantees you a seat; and

(2) allows you to change the flight if you need/want to.

With traditional QF award flights or United "saver" awards you can forget about being able to change your flight(s) as they will always tell you that there is no availability.

 

[simongr]

The problem for me with "anytime" awards is that I assume these will be only on QF metal. I have not had much trouble getting the flights I want in J on QF metal domestically - it is the overseas flights that I need to book far in advance and "anytime" most likely will not help this...

 

[JohnK]

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]I would read this as meaning that the FF is not going to be narrowed back to just earning points for flying anytime soon...and indeed it would seem to be accelerating in the other direction....both for earning and redeeming.

[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]I have no problem with someone earning FF points by staying in a hotel, by buying flowers, by renting a car, by spending on credit cards, by buying wine etc. These are all ways where someone has actually used their own money to purchase something and get some reward. OK not quite the same as flying but it is still spending money.[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]

The trick as aways will be in maximising the situation for ones own personal circumstances.

Like most people I also try to maximise my FF points in every way possible.

On the AMEX sign on deals...they seem to be tightening up as most of the recent ones have had some minimum spend provisions.

I certainly hope so. I see nothing wrong with someone getting a sign on bonus if they are going to use the card. But applying for the credit card, receiving the sign on bonus and then cancelling. Well it sounds a little cheeky to me. But then again you did mention loopholes and good luck to anyone that exploits them....[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[lovetravellingoz]

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]
I certainly hope so. I see nothing wrong with someone getting a sign on bonus if they are going to use the card. But applying for the credit card, receiving the sign on bonus and then cancelling. Well it sounds a little cheeky to me. But then again you did mention loopholes and good luck to anyone that exploits them....[/FONT][/FONT]

At first glance you would think that AMEX Earth etc would have a minimum spend provision (or like ANZ where you have to pay the $95 yearly fee up front....) before the bonus is paid.

However I would assume that what is at play is that the Card companies are relying on people jumping onto their card because of the bonus offered as a carrot and then spending even if they did not intend to do so. some might not spend, but most must.

If the carrot was too restrictive....then many would not take the card out.


As the deals keep being offered I would assume that they track the joinings and spend from it.....and the many who no doubt do not pay off their card each month and so then pay the substantial interest.

Now in my case I actually do spend quite a few $$$ through the cards and so from that point of view I am sure that AMEX make a nice commision off me.

Though I must admit that the recent Earth deal was just a grab for points by me as its earn rate of 1.0 is less than AMEX. However again I am sure that many will get it who will then use it even if they did not intend to.


I have read a number of posts on this site from posters gleeful about their 1.5 earn rate...but who are paying 16+% interest, which to me makes no sense.

If I was them I would transfer to acrd that has a low interest rate one, even if only for 6 to 12 months as this would save them far more. In addition if they are regularly paying the monthly interest they should think about no using credit cards as they are financially worse off.


So I suspect that deals will still be offered as many people cannot manage their finances...and that this means that if you can manage your finances that you can gain benefit.

 

[oz_mark]

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica,sans-serif][FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]
I certainly hope so. I see nothing wrong with someone getting a sign on bonus if they are going to use the card. But applying for the credit card, receiving the sign on bonus and then cancelling. Well it sounds a little cheeky to me. But then again you did mention loopholes and good luck to anyone that exploits them....[/FONT][/FONT]

I am sure the banks are aware of these possibilities when they create their marketing campaigns. But given the expense of getting new customers over retaining existing customers, maybe the should consider retention strategies, rather than aiming purely at churn.

 

[oz_mark]

As the deals keep being offered I would assume that they track the joinings and spend from it.....and the many who no doubt do not pay off their card each month and so then pay the substantial interest.

I tend to find that with new products they generally have some decent benefits, which get eroded over time. A new product comes along, whihc not only gives some bonus for signing up, but has better benefits than what you aleady have. So, I sometimes get a new product, with the intent of closing something else off. This was my thinking behind getting an Earth+ card - I had been considering it for a while - the 15000 points tipped my hand

 

[thadocta]

There are people who channel their entire business spend through their cards. 20000 points is nothing to them, and if they get a free flight worth $300 for that, then they're happy.

Any level of redemption will have people queuing up for redemptions.

I resemble those remarks! :mrgreen:

I get over a million points a year from CC's, but I also fly a bit (not as much as some of you) and rack up around 450 SC's per annum, so I will certainly be using points for flights which would otherwise be better off paying CHC (Cold Hard Cash) for. This is also why I don't mind paying taxes and charges with points, I have so many I really don't notice. Of course, YMMV.

Dave

 

[thadocta]

One other thing which should be mentioned (and is probably deserving of another thread, I will leave that up to the mods) is the question of Why do the points required for a flight from point A to point B need to go up from time to time?

The airlines will say that it is because airfares go up, and the points needed to redeem the flight go up in the same way.

BUT, the thing here though is that the points earnt do not go up.

So, looking at (as an example) SYD-MEL, several years ago, the red e-deal fare might have been $80, and it is now $120. But back then I would have earnt 1000 points, I still earn 1000 points. If the earn amount stays the same, shouldn't the burn amount stay the same as well?

Dave

 

[dajop]

One other thing which should be mentioned (and is probably deserving of another thread, I will leave that up to the mods) is the question of Why do the points required for a flight from point A to point B need to go up from time to time?

Agree completely with you. Further compounded by the fact that when there are significant, real and unexpected(?) cost increases, the airlines have found a way of recovering these from award seats aka Fuel Fines. Using your MEL-SYD example - 8 red edeals gets a 1 way MEL-SYD. A few years ago that would have cost $640 to get back a fare you could buy for $80. Now you pay $960 .. and you still only get an $80 fare back (due to fuel fines of $40).

But I guess the problem with your theory is the CC issue - if the price banks are paying for FF points is increasing at same rate as airfares that is fine, if not therein lies the problem. The fairest (and impossible) way for dealing with this is to index flight earn rates with award seat increases, but not increase CC/other point earn rates. Huh!!