Operational Upgrades

[justinbrett]

I think most people agree the following are the conditions when one might exect to be upgraded to J for no cost or points:
1. The flight is oversold in Y
2. There are seats in J
3. You have paid full Y fare
4. You are an elite FF

However, I was wondering how the following factors may effect your chances of being selected:
1. Check in method. Counter check in definitely works - but does OLCI prevent you from being selected?
2. Check in time. If you check in 24 hours before, will you not be considered? What if you check in at the counter 30 minutes before? Is there an optimal time?
3. Is the process completely automated, or do the check in staff have a role in the selection?

 

[moa999]

I would clarify to say that this is subject to No. 1 occuring
The mere fact of No. 2, ie J seats available is unlikely to lead to an OpUp on QF

I also think No. 4 has more relevance than No. 3.
Almost all staff can see your FF status, but very few could see fare paid or fare class.

 

[justinbrett]

I would clarify to say that this is subject to No. 1 occuring
The mere fact of No. 2, ie J seats available is unlikely to lead to an OpUp on QF

I also think No. 4 has more relevance than No. 3.
Almost all staff can see your FF status, but very few could see fare paid or fare class.

I actually think all these conditions must be met. #3 included if it's an automated process (I have heard that before).

 

[serfty]

... 3. You have paid full Y fare ...

I would discount this; most of my op-ups have been from deep discount WHY.

Also, to add another, the QF staffer doing the op-ups may take other issues into account on an ad-hoc basis. (PAX a friend or relative, can't be stuffed -whoever come up next etc.)

... However, I was wondering how the following factors may effect your chances of being selected:
1. Check in method. Counter check in definitely works - but does OLCI prevent you from being selected?
2. Check in time. If you check in 24 hours before, will you not be considered? What if you check in at the counter 30 minutes before? Is there an optimal time?
3. Is the process completely automated, or do the check in staff have a role in the selection?

1. I don't believe check-in method is consistently relevant; I have had ops ups "At the Gate" when boarding, on human check-in and with Quick-Check. I even was located in the HBA QP once and handed a new BP with 1A on it. :shock:

2. If the QF agent follows processes this would rarely be relevant. Those Elites who have already checked in whether 30 minutes or 24 hours before would get a rejected BP at the gate when boarding with BP for a new cabin supplied.

3. I would believe the process is manual - perhaps the QF agent can bring up a list in pecking order to select whom to op-up.

 

[serfty]

... #3 included if it's an automated process (I have heard that before).

a) I don't believe it's an automated process, and 2) we are talking Qantas here, not AAnother AAirline.

 

[NM]

I don't believe the fare paid has a significant influence on your chances of an op-up. QF Op-ups are only provided when there is an operational need (that is why its called an op-up). There are several reasons why this can happen, including:

• Flight is oversold (unlikely for domestic)
• Flight has lots of standby passengers due to pax being moved from a cancelled or delayed flight. This often looks like its oversold to some people and has the same affect.
• The flight is almost sold out and they need some Y seats for group seating flexibility (i.e. for a family to be seated together).

I do not believe it makes any difference as how or when you check-in, especially for domestic flights. In most cases the seat has already been allocated to you well before you front for check-in so even if the need to op-up occurs before or after you check-in, it seems to be processed the same way.

It really is pot luck. And in my experience, it more about which seat they want to make available and who happens to already have it allocated.

 

[simongr]

Perhaps we need some more statiscal evidence about this. There have been many many ad hoc threads about this but no hard evidence or trend analysis. Perhaps start a new thread where people post the following:


Flight No.
Origin
Destination
Original Seat
Final seat
Fullness of Cabin (subjective though)
Status of pax
Fare class
Availability prior to boarding (if known)

Anything else? Smartness of PAX?

 

[Dave Noble]

I don't believe the fare paid has a significant influence on your chances of an op-up. QF Op-ups are only provided when there is an operational need (that is why its called an op-up).

Actually QF doesn't call it an operational upgrade in the booking ime, it is referred to as an Involuntary Upgrade

Dave

 

[NM]

Actually QF doesn't call it an operational upgrade in the booking ime, it is referred to as an Involuntary Upgrade

Does the name given by the airline make any difference to the process?

 

[simongr]

Well I think the assumption being that if the upgrade is an involuntary upgrade rather than an operational upgrade it may detract from the reasoning that the upgrade is gievn for operational reasons...

I am not having a good day...

 

[Petch]

Does the name given by the airline make any difference to the process?

One of the great things i've learnt from reading all the diverse minds on AFF, is airline terminology. When you speak with a rep, (particularly during "irreg-ops") and sound vaguely like you know what you are talking about, the rep's bullsh!t quotient drops and their service quotient increases.

So, next time I manually check-in, I plan to volunteer for an involuntary upgrade.

 

[Platy]

This maybe a case of the exceptions to prove the rules sugggested above, however...

I have had two "complimentary" upgrades in the last couple of weeks and only one operational upgrade in 16 years previously.

On both occasions the aircraft had very very light loadings.

On both occasions I already had a boarding pass.

To qualify the story...both were on the domestic legs of international services (CNS-BNE) thus only about 4-6 J pax in a 25J cabin (767 intl config) and leaving at the early hour of 0550.

I was virtually the only person in the INTL QP and I have WP status.

The first time, the QP person recognised me as a regular and local, which may have made a difference.

The local customer service people get "control" of the flight a few hours before scheduled take off so in these cases local staff are using their discretion.

Certainly here in CNS there is a fair bit of "who knows who" going on.

 

[Dave Noble]

Does the name given by the airline make any difference to the process?

No, but it has an impact on the logic of the statement "QF Op-ups are only provided when there is an operational need (that is why its called an op-up)." . If it isn't called an op-up , then the causal link isn't there

Dave

 

[serfty]

So how about IUFOR (involuntary Upgrade for Operations Reasons)

 

[NYCguy]

Certainly here in CNS there is a fair bit of "who knows who" going on.

That was my experience; a couple of previous lives ago; at the old AN GW lounge @ CNS.

 

[NM]

So how about IUFOR (involuntary Upgrade for Operations Reasons)

Or just IOU (Involuntary Operational Upgrade).

At the check-in desk you could ask if need any volunteers for an IOU. And when the BP is rejected at the gate you could be told by the gate agent that Qantas has given you an IOU.

 

[justinbrett]

Well after all I ended up getting an operational upgrade, without asking for it.

 

[serfty]

Well after all I ended up getting an operational upgrade, without asking for it.

It's that time of year ....

Congratulations.

How did you check in? Was the op-up apparent at the time of check-in or given at the gate?

 

[International Lady]

[quoteHowever, I was wondering how the following factors may effect your chances of being selected:
1. Check in method. Counter check in definitely works - but does OLCI prevent you from being selected?
2. Check in time. If you check in 24 hours before, will you not be considered? What if you check in at the counter 30 minutes before? Is there an optimal time?
3. Is the process completely automated, or do the check in staff have a role in the selection?[/quote]

There is an outside person called 'customer journey manager' who decides on the day who they are going to upgrade due to Yclass being full. They can see when you were last upgraded and will pick someone else due for an upgrade if you've had a couple in the recently! These are decided well in advance of you even checking in. Mostly on 3 class services.

Other flights such as the QF21 to Narita, upgrades 'anyone' even no FF status, when they have to - usually done at last minute - often checkin staff are asked to look for 'suitables'. Usually happens when there are large groups of Japanese students down the back. If this is the case, you will not get upgraded if you are wearing jeans, thongs or just don't look the part!

Also, I have been upgraded on the LA800 flight to AKL many times - as they are always oversold in Yclass to AKL. They will only upgrade their own pax ie. not QF321 codeshare. Again, must look 'suitable' and you won't get lounge access or priority baggage but you will get jclass service, seat n meal for the price of yr yclass ticket - no matter how discounted!!

 

[justinbrett]

It's that time of year ....

Congratulations.

How did you check in? Was the op-up apparent at the time of check-in or given at the gate?

Well it was great timing, as my end of year, going home for Christmas trip (and just finishing work for the year).

Check in:
1. Checked in online, 24 hours before
2. 7 hours before, called movements (work at the airport) and got changed to an exit row.
3. 1 hour before, I checked in at the counter (as I didn't have the new boarding pass) and was told I had been upgraded.

One thing is for certain, I was definitely upgraded before going to the counter - proving that nothing I could have said, or my appearance, would have made any difference.

The funny thing is there were no J seats for sale on this flight for about 2 weeks before, as Y was also sold out.

It was a domestic flight, DRW to BNE.

This is my fourth upgrade in 12 months:
1. This very flight last year (Friday before Christmas) DRW to BNE
2. DRW to CNS (though movements upgraded me as they couldn't clear my waitlist on a direct flight to BNE)
3. BOM to LHR, British Airways from WT to WT+ (Not J but was good to see WT+)
4. This flight.

I'm paying WT+ with British Airways next year to LHR - have been told by people if you have status you are very likely to get upgraded to J if the flight is full.