Qantas Carbon Tax Offset - Correct Value?

[Sprucegoose]

I wonder if the impact on airfares with this carbon tax will equal the offset that Qantas requests from the traveller when purchasing from the website?So how has Qantas been valuing carbon if the claims that it will cost $115m in profits are indeed validated?

 

[leemin]

I wonder if the impact on airfares with this carbon tax will equal the offset that Qantas requests from the traveller when purchasing from the website?So how has Qantas been valuing carbon if the claims that it will cost $115m in profits are indeed validated?

I wondered the same thing. If an extra $3.50 is fully passing on the costs, how does it then affect profit? It should be budget neutral. The cynic in me suggests this may be a convenient excuse for the budget impacts of all of Qantas' 'enhancements' thus far.


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[Mal]

I suspect the Gillard TAX will increase airfares more than any current carbon tax offset scheme is charging. It won't just affect the price of oil - it will affect other Qantas vehicles, plus the costs of food and maintenance etc. Additional wage claims from staff will push up the cost further.

 

[medhead]

Additional wage claims? The increased tax free threshold reduces the ability to claim additional wage increases.

 

[Sprucegoose]

Yes things are not clear at all!!Business will pass on the costs where they can collude and get away with it? Illegal of course, but prove it!

 

[Mal]

Additional wage claims? The increased tax free threshold reduces the ability to claim additional wage increases.

Nope. There will be extensive wage claims due to increased cost of living.

I've done my sums and feel I'll be several thousand $ a year worse off. Even the "official calculator" (which will of course paint a rosy picture tells me that I will be $12/week worse off.)

I chose not to knock up the first woman I met and spawn a huge family. I've also chosen a career where I get paid well and pay more than my fair share of tax. There are many others in similar situations, and they also will feel this type of pain.

Let's review this in a few years and see how accurate the Government guestimation is vs mine...

 

[medhead]

Nope. There will be extensive wage claims due to increased cost of living.

I've done my sums and feel I'll be several thousand $ a year worse off. Even the "official calculator" (which will of course paint a rosy picture tells me that I will be $12/week worse off.)

I chose not to knock up the first woman I met and spawn a huge family. I've also chosen a career where I get paid well and pay more than my fair share of tax. There are many others in similar situations, and they also will feel this type of pain.

Let's review this in a few years and see how accurate the Government guestimation is vs mine...

Hard to support when the cost of living isn't projected to increase much from this one off measure. Where there extensive wage claims when GST was introduced.

As for thousands a year worse off, you can always reduce you carbon emissions.

As for knocking up women and having children. I also pay more than my fair share of tax, including a flood tax.

 

[codash1099]

I chose not to knock up the first woman I met and spawn a huge family.

Dear Abby...............

 

[Mal]

Hard to support when the cost of living isn't projected to increase much from this one off measure. Where there extensive wage claims when GST was introduced.

Because a range of taxes were removed and replaced, with certain exemptions (eg fresh food). This new tax is very different and will affect the entire supply chain and increase prices.

I also pay more than my fair share of tax, including a flood tax.

Heck, I even pay the flood levy, even though I was financially affected by the Brisbane flood.

Back to Qantas and airfares. They will go up from this Gillard tax, more than the Qantas Carbon program currently charges. Her ineptitude, and multiple levels of bureaucracy will ensure the most inefficient collection and usage of the money collected.

Oh, and I'm also sure the GST is set for a rise in the next 5 years or so.

 

[medhead]

Because a range of taxes were removed and replaced, with certain exemptions (eg fresh food). This new tax is very different and will affect the entire supply chain and increase prices.

But back to your point there was a one off increase in the CPI with the introduction of GST and there was not extensive wage claims. There is projected to be a one off increase in CPI with this tax. They have also taken a first step to reform the tax rates including a step to phasing out the low income offset. This reform in itself is massive and important. So similarly to the GST there is no basis for excessive wage claims.

Heck, I even pay the flood levy, even though I was financially affected by the Brisbane flood.

Oh you edited out the bit where you repeated yourself.

You're exempt from the flood levy, no idea why you're paying it. The point remains that I know people who have exploited the flood assistance*, that [annoys me greatly]. But I also know people who really needed the assistance. Hence I can handle paying the tax even if it is absolutely no benefit to me.

I thought it was you who pointed out that the greenhouse offset is currently only related to the flight in question whereas the carbon tax will affect all fuel usage by Qantas.

* Karma has already got them back

 

[AdMEL]

Because a range of taxes were removed and replaced, with certain exemptions (eg fresh food). This new tax is very different and will affect the entire supply chain and increase prices.

Heck, I even pay the flood levy, even though I was financially affected by the Brisbane flood.

Back to Qantas and airfares. They will go up from this Gillard tax, more than the Qantas Carbon program currently charges. Her ineptitude, and multiple levels of bureaucracy will ensure the most inefficient collection and usage of the money collected.

Oh, and I'm also sure the GST is set for a rise in the next 5 years or so.

My initial thoughts are that this tax will result in everything increasing in price, resulting in everyone being worse off, even after any tax benefit.

What makes you think GST will increase?

Supporting you is the fact we have the lowest GST of any comparable country, including our closest neighbour, who, if memory serves me correctly, recently increased theirs!

Having said that, it is my understanding that the GST netted far more than the gov expected and continues to do so.

 

[Mal]

What makes you think GST will increase?

Because the Federal Govt, like their State counterparts are spending like there is no consequence and relying too heavily on mining saving their balance sheets. One day they will realise that the mining boom is just that - something that will bust. I suspect that it would happen soon after Gillard was returned to power.

So similarly to the GST there is no basis for excessive wage claims.

There may not be a basis, but they will occur. Look at the various Qantas unions huffing and puffing right now. Any increase in living expenses WILL lead to wage claims that are higher.

Oh you edited out the bit where you repeated yourself.

I removed 2 words which some people could have read as a personal attack (it wasn't btw). Nothing else.

You're exempt from the flood levy, no idea why you're paying it.

No I'm not exempt. Not everyone who was affected is eligible for the flood tax rebate. And similarly, the Qld Govt flood grants also were blocked for certain people who should have been eligible... An off-side, again we're paying for Government mismanagement with that levy.

I thought it was you who pointed out that the greenhouse offset is currently only related to the flight in question whereas the carbon tax will affect all fuel usage by Qantas.

Can't recall stating that specifically, but yes - that is my view. It will increase costs for every input into the Qantas group. Hence fares must go up more than what the current voluntary offset is.

 

[leemin]

Sorry, but there is something seriously wrong if someone on more than $150k can't absorb an average increase of $10 a week.

Even if this was much higher due to a lot of flying, the equivalent of the booking fee on a return flight isn't exactly huge. I almost pay that for the Karmarama juice on DJ.


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[medhead]

given the idea that carbon tax will impact on all inputs I don't find it strange that the carbon tax charge is higher than the current carbon offset. What I do find annoying is the apparent lack of realisation that the carbon tax cost can be reduced by switching to non taxed energy. Nothing is stopping qantas from filling the roof of SYD T3 with solar panels. Effectively reducing their carbon tax liability.

There may not be a basis, but they will occur. Look at the various Qantas unions huffing and puffing right now. Any increase in living expenses WILL lead to wage claims that are higher.

I'm not sure were to edit this down to, but in relation to the first sentence. They didn't occur for the GST so I can't agree they will happen for this one off introduction of a "tax"

I removed 2 words which some people could have read as a personal attack (it wasn't btw). Nothing else.

well the words are gone now but I recall that you removed "as do I". Far from a personal attack I just thought it was funny that we could get into a circular [discussion] about about how we each pay more than our fair share of tax.

 

[Mal]

Sorry, but there is something seriously wrong if someone on more than $150k can't absorb an average increase of $10 a week.

I assume this was meant for me. Sorry, but I don't fall for the Government's lies that the increase will be an average of $10 or so / week. Yeah right. And that is on top of CPI increases and everything else. I can easily handle it (at that amount), but it's increasing the cost of living in Australia - on top of Australia already being an expensive country.

Nothing is stopping qantas from filling the roof of SYD T3 with solar panels. Effectively reducing their carbon tax liability.

Indeed, but Australia has lost the plot with this kind of technology. Why not put the money into building solar farms where they make a real difference and don't duplicate things like inverters and installation, and can use the best solar panels rather than cheaper ones? As you've posted in the other thread, Nuclear is the way forward for Australia - but with the Greens pulling the puppet strings, this will not occur.

I'm not sure were to edit this down to, but in relation to the first sentence. They didn't occur for the GST so I can't agree they will happen for this one off introduction of a "tax"

We both have different views. Time will tell who is correct!

well the words are gone now but I recall that you removed "as do I". Far from a personal attack I just thought it was funny that we could get into a circular [discussion] about about how we each pay more than our fair share of tax.

Actually, yeah I removed 4 words IIRC (Not sure why I thought it was 2). It was basically "Congratulations, As do I". After looking at it later, I believed it could be perceived as a personal attack and removed it. But it doesn't seem you were concerned about it, so there it is again. And no, we shouldn't get into that circular discussion.

Going back to the Qantas story, it will also be interesting to see how much airfares increase as a result. And for frequent flyers, I see costs going up all over the place - hotels (increased input prices), taxis (increased inputs), airports (increased costs of inputs) etc etc etc.

 

[medhead]

Sorry, but I don't fall for the Government's lies that the increase will be an average of $10 or so / week. Yeah right. And that is on top of CPI increases and everything else. I can easily handle it (at that amount), but it's increasing the cost of living in Australia - on top of Australia already being an expensive country.

If you believe the $10 is a lie then surely you must also believe the CPI is a lie. Also this is not on top of the CPI. Im having trouble finding the information again but IIRC there is a one off increase in CPI when the tax is introduced of 0.7%. After that the cost will be included in the CPI and the reserve bank with still have it's instruction to keep the CPI below 3%. and the assistance appears to be indexed to CPI.

Indeed, but Australia has lost the plot with this kind of technology. Why not put the money into building solar farms where they make a real difference and don't duplicate things like inverters and installation, and can use the best solar panels rather than cheaper ones? As you've posted in the other thread, Nuclear is the way forward for Australia - but with the Greens pulling the puppet strings, this will not occur.

Australia is building solar farms. The quality of panels is up to whoever installs them not the government. If I install panels I'll be getting the good ones. Nuclear is blocked by all political parties in Australia including the coalition. In that regard the greens are pulling all of their strings.

Taxis mostly use LPG - lower carbon tax impost

After looking at it later, I believed it could be perceived as a personal attack and removed it. But it doesn't seem you were concerned about it,

I was more offended by the "knock up the first women" comment. There was at least 30 before I knocked anyone up. (that I know of)