Qantas & Jetstar revealed as first airlines to fly from WSI

[dairyfloss]

Big WSI update today from Albo & QF/JQ... initial domestic services referenced are BNE, MEL & OOL. This one might need it's own thread to banter around:

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/qantas-and-jetstar-revealed-as-first-airlines-to-fly-from-western-sydney-airport/news-story/b72c910670791750059562cf80b420c3

Created a thread for the QF/JQ specific stuff, as well: Qantas & Jetstar revealed as first airlines to fly from WSI

Cheers,
Matt.

 

[dairyfloss]

News in the last hour is that Qantas and Jetstar revealed as first airlines to fly from western Sydney airport (WSI)
https://www.news.com.au/travel/trav...t/news-story/b72c910670791750059562cf80b420c3

Qantas and Jetstar will be the first airline carriers to fly from the new Western Sydney International Airport when flights take off in 2026.
Outgoing Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce revealed on Thursday the airline would be the first to run domestic services from the airport.

“Qantas and Jetstar aircraft are going to be rushing down this runway in just over three years,” Mr Joyce said.

“We’ve made the commitment that both carriers will operate from this airport when it opens for business – on day one.”

Mr Joyce revealed that the carrier would receive one new plane every three weeks up until the airport’s launch in late-2026.

Within a year of opening, Mr Joyce said the airport would home as many as 15 Qantas aircraft – the sixth largest in the Qantas fleet.

and this:

In the first year, 10 Jetstar and five Qantas aircraft will fly out of the airport, travelling between Melbourne, Brisbane and the Gold Coast.
Qantas forecasts those aircraft will carry around four million passengers through the airport every year on more than 25,000 flights.

Cheers,
Matt.

 

[dajop]

Wonder if Virgin will be there on day 1 also?

There was never any doubt that Qantas would be the first airline to announce they would be first to fly out of the airport. Still a long time between now and 2026.

 

[docjames]

To be honest, not overly surprising – the two biggest demand routes ex-SYD (QF+JQ) and big leisure route (JQ).

THe bigger question is will QF/JQ use it more as a point to point airport or will they structure it to allow connections. Suspect more of the former initially, and as time passes and overall demand grows, move to more the latter.

Would be fascinating to know the airport charges relative to SYD (and for that matter, AVV/MEL) and how the fares will price versus the equivalent routes to SYD or whether they will price them equally?

 

[Lynda2475]

Well i would pay a premium to fly QF SYD-MEL, as I am sure that premium will be far less than an Uber from home-WSI (which is in the middle of nowhere).

SYD-AVV proved to be a dud route because AVV is not close enough to Melbourne CBD.

WSI is not anywhere near Sydney CBD, nor the eastern burbs, inner west, inner south or north shore - who can all get to SYD much much less expensively.

I would expect to see JQ move more flights to WSI than QF as JQ passengers more likely to live closer to WSI. Road Warrirs doing SYD-MEL regularly more likely to live close to SYD.

SYD-MEL has some leisure but is predominantly a business route. OOL and Bali leisure routes might be popular from WSI for those who look for cheapest fare of day rather than full service carrier.

 

[AIRwin]

QF media release:

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media-releases/national-carrier-to-land-in-western-sydney/

 

[SYD]

No real surprises and it will be good marketing for QF and/or JQ when they have the first plane arrive / depart etc etc

But I did have a cynical snigger when I heard this reported (and in the link).

“This airport is designed for growth and will one day become the same scale and size as Dubai and JFK airports,” Mr Hickey said.

Not in my lifetime.

Edit: the other thing and was reminiscent of last nights Utopia, WSI is still only halfway there. Still 3 more years!

 

[Daver6]

There was never any doubt that Qantas would be the first airline to announce they would be first to fly out of the airport. Still a long time between now and 2026.

And in what world do major infrastructure projects ever finish on time?

More seriously though, are QF not shooting themselves in the foot by splitting operations between two airports in the same city? It would certainly limit connecting flights.

 

[marki]

And in what world do major infrastructure projects ever finish on time?

More seriously though, are QF not shooting themselves in the foot by splitting operations between two airports in the same city? It would certainly limit connecting flights.

Are you talking about BER? That was certainly on time

 

[dairyfloss]

I'd pay the SYD premium too - which is of course already being paid. It's more likely you'll get a discount for departures & arrivals at WSI.

Greater Sydney and the surrounding regions have a lot of people in them, and I can see there would be enough demand for both business and leisure travel to leverage WSI vs SYD, and I look forward to any relief it brings to infrastructure & traffic around SYD, however as it relates to QF (vs JQ, or VA), I beleive it will remain limited to busy golden triangle and a maybe handful of other destinations (CBR?), to test interest.

Possibly no QFi movement, except for maybe an NZ O&D per day, or where a pre/post SYD curfew slot is desirable for scheduling / utilisation, and not just IROPs.

Cheers,
Matt.

 

[Saab34]

Avalon isn’t a success as it’s in the middle of really nowhere. They only have one low cost option also.

Avalon will become a powerhouse the day Geelong joins Melbourne, with an associated metropolis in between. That will happen eventually, likely not until the 2100-2500s.

 

[dajop]

Avalon isn’t a success as it’s in the middle of really nowhere. They only have one low cost option also.

Correction, two low cost options.! Would be interesting to see if QF ran an E190 or Q400 service from Geelong (AVV) to SYD whether it would attract any passengers. Also whilst government is giving the operators subsidies, the parking fees are OTT, you can park for 3 days at MEL for $36, but at AVV it costs $50.

 

[dajop]

More seriously though, are QF not shooting themselves in the foot by splitting operations between two airports in the same city? It would certainly limit connecting flights.

I doubt it. There's probably "fat" on the routes mentioned to allow it, which are already high frequency. If you shifted half of MEL's xx:15 and xx:45 services to WSI and a few Jetstar services, it would barely have any effect on ability to connect through SYD to/from MEL. Likewise for BNE and OOL.

 

[dajop]

Which is why moving business traveller heavy SYD-MEL flights there makes no sense.

Did they say they were moving or adding capacity? I am sure the demographics of Western SYD are sufficient to support QF. If LST and NTL can support QF services to MEL, I am sure WSI can too. And there are businesses with significant presence or event HQ in Western Sydney, not every business is based in the Sydney CBD. (eg. Woolies HQ is actually showing as being 10-15 mins closer to WSI than SYD right at this point in time).

 

[jpp42]

More seriously though, are QF not shooting themselves in the foot by splitting operations between two airports in the same city? It would certainly limit connecting flights.

The market would be point to point flights at first, focusing on origin and destination traffic, nothing to do with connecting flights. As mentioned above, dozens of cities worldwide have secondary airports like this.

Examples of legacy airlines in similar situations: American Airlines flies to three airports in the NYC area (JFK, LGA, and EWR), and three in the Washington DC area (DCA, IAD, BWI). British Airways flies to three airports in the London area (LHR, LGW, LCY). The fact that AA operates to EWR, or BA to LGW, doesn't impact their hub operations at JFK or LHR, respectively - there is plenty of traffic for everyone, and Sydney will be the same way.

Edit: I should also note that services to MEL or BNE/OOL actually strengthen the hubs there. Western Sydney travellers keen on avoiding Sydney CBD traffic, may find it convenient to have a one-stop itinerary to other destinations from those interestate hubs. Using the US example, this is the reason AA flies to EWR, as New Jersey travellers might choose itineraries such as EWR(Newark)-ORD (Chicago)-> somewhere else. Similarly, western sydney residents might choose to fly WSI-BNE-CNS, or WSI-MEL-HBA, or even WSI-OOL-NRT (JQ).

 

[jpp42]

“This airport is designed for growth and will one day become the same scale and size as Dubai and JFK airports,” Mr Hickey said.

In the press release they're setting their sights even higher than JFK:

"“WSI is being designed for growth and will eventually become Sydney’s biggest airport. We have a roadmap to grow to 82 million annual passengers, around the size of the world’s major airports, such as Dubai and London Heathrow.”

Not sure which is actually "bigger," as LHR would have many more international passengers and JFK likely more flights overall, but much smaller planes on average. Funny that he's quoted both ways. It's worth noting that both DXB and LHR are both limited to two runways (assuming third LHR runway doesn't go ahead), and already capacity constrained as a result - they could be even bigger than they are if the space was there. Western Sydney also only has two runways in the master plan with no growth room past that, so they can't really approach the ultimate capacity of other places like DFW, ORD, or PKX.

 

[kangarooflyer88]

Wonder if Virgin will be there on day 1 also?

Depends on how large the facility is in comparison with Mascot.

Still a long time between now and 2026.

You know what they say time flies (or at least I think they say that).

And in what world do major infrastructure projects ever finish on time?

Australia is unique in that most infrastructure projects finish on time and under budget from the Sydney Harbour bridge to Northconnex.

More seriously though, are QF not shooting themselves in the foot by splitting operations between two airports in the same city? It would certainly limit connecting flights.

I reckon QantasLink will operate connectors between Mascot and Western Sydney. This would also alleviate the issue of getting from Western City into the CBD.

 

[RooFlyer]

I reckon QantasLink will operate connectors between Mascot and Western Sydney. This would also alleviate the issue of getting from Western City into the CBD.

Given the congestion at SYD, to be relieved a bit by WSI, I can't see them filling the freed-up slots with trans city commutes!

 

[dajop]

I reckon QantasLink will operate connectors between Mascot and Western Sydney. This would also alleviate the issue of getting from Western City into the CBD.

Yeah, nah.

 

[jpp42]

I reckon QantasLink will operate connectors between Mascot and Western Sydney. This would also alleviate the issue of getting from Western City into the CBD.

Lol, and helicopter service to Darling Harbour as well, right?