Risk of being bumped of flight?

[hopebravia]

Hi all, my husband and I areabout to use points for a direct return flight to Hong Kong. But I am worried about being bumped off the flight (eg to a longer flight with stop overs) at the last minute because we will be travelling with a baby. How likely could it happen? I will be travelling during Jan 2012, peak season.

 

[awilcockson]

Welcome to the forum ... No need to post the same question twice, once is enough to get someone's attention. Sorry, I can't answer your question, but in my experience I doubt you'd get bumped.

 

[Boris spatsky]

Re: Risk of change flight when using points to travel?

You sHoud be fine. A confirmed seat on QF is a confirmed seat, regardless of whether you use points. Baby should make no difference.

We did HK last year with 1.5 year old on points, with no problem.

 

[Timtammi]

My understanding is that once you have secured your flight with points QF don't treat you any differently than someone who has paid with cash for their flights ie you have no more chance of getting bumped than anyone else does. As QF yield/load management is usually pretty good I would say its highly unlikely.

Cheers

 

[hopebravia]

Thanks for sharing your experience guys. We just heard of stories from friends who have been bumped off before. I rang Qantas Customer Service who said there's a risk but with a infant would be taken into account.

If any one has been successful in persuading groundstaff to stay on the booked flight, I'd love to hear from you... if needed in the future.

 

[11sjw]

To add to the "No you'll be fine" sentiment....

A few years ago we were booked on MEL-AKL-LAX (RTW in J with points) and Qantas got in touch to say we may not get the Skybeds we were after. I immediately rang and said this is not acceptable and we were bumped onto the MEL-LAX direct flight. Saved a few hours of travel and kept the Skybed. Pity they were Mk1

 

[harvyk]

I'm also going with very unlikely.

Not to say it never happens, but QF are very good with load management, and I don't think they engage in overselling to the same degree as their US counterparts.

They usually ask for voluntary changes first, and whilst I've taken some flight changes in the past I've normally been called well before I got to the airport and asked if I'd mind. (and I never did, as the changes have been better than the original schedule, I've also been able to use flight changes to move unchangeable fares to better flights)

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Thanks for sharing your experience guys. We just heard of stories from friends who have been bumped off before. I rang Qantas Customer Service who said there's a risk but with a infant would be taken into account.

If any one has been successful in persuading groundstaff to stay on the booked flight, I'd love to hear from you... if needed in the future.

There could be a couple of issues going on here a) getting bumped because the flight was overbooked & your friends were last to checkin or
b) your friends arrived at checkin too late - ie after the flight had closed & were denied uplift

To be honest I'd take these stories from friends with a grain of salt. Usually people neglect to give you all the facts about what happened like what time they actually arrived at the airport.

After you've made your booking, try and get seat allocation & if your baby is 6 months or less you may be able to get seats in front of a bassinet.

A good idea would be to checkin online the day before to minimise any hassles. You still need to get to the airport in plenty of time to drop off the bags - allow extra time when travelling with an infant. I've seen many people turn up at airports for domestic flights within 30 minutes of departure & when told luggage acceptance has closed reply "but I checked in online" or "but we're travelling with an infant". Infant or not you need to be at the airport before checkin closes.

I know of one AFFer who upgraded on points from Y to PE (premium economy). On the day the flight was overbooked in PE but the people who were bumped were the last ones to checkin & travelling on a paid PE ticket.

 

[jamesatfish]

I would have thought if anything that having the baby and travelling as a family makes you a bit less likely to be bumped off a flight.

I assume you have (or will) put in a request for a bassinet seat, which should normally mean you get a seat allocation fairly early in the process. Having a seat allocation in the system is most likely an indicator of your 'likelihood of flying' - i.e. whether you're going to show up and take the flight. If I was doing yield management and had to find people to bump off an oversold flight I'd be looking first at those who had not allocated a seat at that time before turning to people with allocated / checked-in seating.

The other factor is that if Qantas bump someone off a flight (involuntarily) then they are required to find you another flight to get you where you are going. This is pretty much the only thing contractually obliged when you buy a ticket - that they'll get you from A to B somehow. As you've got quite specific needs (2 seats together in a basinet row) it would be harder for them to find a suitable alternate flight where these needs can be met - harder for instance than bumping 2 solo travellers elsewhere in the cabin. Again if I was bumping people from a flight I'd start with the ones I could most easily rebook on alternate flights.

 

[drewbles]

In over 400 QF flights in 10 years i've never once been bumped so I'll join the 'it's highly unlikely' voters.

As mentioned though, make sure you're not last to check-in and it should be fine (just get to the airport well ahead of time to make sure).

 

[BadgerBoi]

I would have thought if anything that having the baby and travelling as a family makes you a bit less likely to be bumped off a flight.

Hmmm. As a rule I travel without a baby and not as a family. I can't for the life of me see why that would make me a better candidate to be bumped, but then I tend not to feel entitled when it comes to public transport.

 

[jamesatfish]

Hmmm. As a rule I travel without a baby and not as a family. I can't for the life of me see why that would make me a better candidate to be bumped, but then I tend not to feel entitled when it comes to public transport.

If Qantas oversell their flight by 2 seats and everybody checks in, then they need to bump 2 people from that flight and make alternate travel arrangements for those people. 2 people travelling together on the same PNR are harder to rebook than 2 unrelated travellers as you can access alternates with only 1 available seat rather than needing alternates with 2 available seats. Adding a baby to the PNR means you now look for alternates with 2 available seats and bassinet access which is harder again.

I'm not suggesting that bumping one party over the other is the 'better' option, or that travelling with family/baby entitles you to better protection from being bumped, just that in my mind the ease of rebooking the bumped passengers would be a factor in determining who gets bumped, and in that light having complex travel arrangements (like a family with a baby) works in your favour.

Of course you could just as equally replace 'bump' with 'op-up' in the above missive and it's the same message without any implication of entitlement as a family traveller - which is to say that there's a higher probability of the OP with her husband and baby flying on the route they booked in the cabin they booked than any given solo traveller on the same flight.

 

[tuppaware]

In over 400 QF flights in 10 years i've never once been bumped so I'll join the 'it's highly unlikely' voters.

As mentioned though, make sure you're not last to check-in and it should be fine (just get to the airport well ahead of time to make sure).

Seems like it might be an American thing to be bumped?

 

[BadgerBoi]

If Qantas oversell their flight by 2 seats and everybody checks in, then they need to bump 2 people from that flight and make alternate travel arrangements for those people. 2 people travelling together on the same PNR are harder to rebook than 2 unrelated travellers as you can access alternates with only 1 available seat rather than needing alternates with 2 available seats. Adding a baby to the PNR means you now look for alternates with 2 available seats and bassinet access which is harder again.

I'm not suggesting that bumping one party over the other is the 'better' option, or that travelling with family/baby entitles you to better protection from being bumped, just that in my mind the ease of rebooking the bumped passengers would be a factor in determining who gets bumped, and in that light having complex travel arrangements (like a family with a baby) works in your favour.

Of course you could just as equally replace 'bump' with 'op-up' in the above missive and it's the same message without any implication of entitlement as a family traveller - which is to say that there's a higher probability of the OP with her husband and baby flying on the route they booked in the cabin they booked than any given solo traveller on the same flight.

So, don't bump me, or me and my partner when we are traveling together, in favour of a couple with a baby traveling together. There's nothing mystical about the word "family".

Don't care if they get op-upped and I don't, that's irrelevant to this discussion; when I want to travel business class I pay for it. Good on them if they get a bonus.

 

[jamesatfish]

So, don't bump me, or me and my partner when we are traveling together, in favour of a couple with a baby traveling together. There's nothing mystical about the word "family".

I don't profess to know all the factors involved in determining who gets bumped and who doesn't when a flight is overbooked. I'm sure there's a lot going on in that determination, including FF status, type of fare, connecting flights, booking agent, date of ticket purchase, time of check-in etc etc and that in the overall calculation the presence of a baby in the travelling party probably isn't a major factor.

That said, I have no doubt that it would indeed be a factor, to the benefit of the couple with the baby. If there happened to be two exactly identical travel parties on that flight - same status, fare type, etc etc - but one of the two had a baby and the other did not, then I would predict that the party without the baby would be the one being bumped.

I'm not saying that situation is 'right' or 'wrong'. I'm not saying the couple with the baby should feel entitled to stay on the flight simply because they have the baby. I am saying that western society as a whole is weighted to the advantage of babies and those who have them over those who don't. A single woman standing on a bus or train is less likely to have a seat offered by another passenger than if that same woman was holding a baby. Shopping centres reserve parking spaces for 'families' close to the entrances whilst 'non-family' shoppers must park further away. In a tie-break situation where everything else is equal our society always tends to favour the baby.

Should I show up to my next flight (for which I'll be on my own) and not get my selected seat in the cabin I paid for on the exact flights I booked because I was bumped in favour of my dopplegänger with a baby I guess that'll be my comeuppance. For sure I'll be seriously upset about it - I'm not going to pretend that my spiel above means I'd be happy to be on the losing end of that tie-break - but at least I think I'd understand why I lost.

 

[DeKa]

The other point is Qantas has no other (viable) way to get you to Hong Kong, other than direct. If they sent you via Singapore, Cathay is the only OneWorld option to get you to Hong Kong - they aren't going to pay Cathay to carry a passenger who 'paid' using points.

 

[BVT]

IME, they usually ask for volunteers first, to be bumped? Last year, I negotiated a very sweet deal on a SFO/SYD flight, when I graciously agreed to delay my departure by 24 to 48 hours.

 

[elbarto]

The other point is Qantas has no other (viable) way to get you to Hong Kong, other than direct. If they sent you via Singapore, Cathay is the only OneWorld option to get you to Hong Kong - they aren't going to pay Cathay to carry a passenger who 'paid' using points.

They will I they have to. CX paid for me to fly hkt-bkk when they changed the schedule after I booked and would have missed my connection in hkg.

 

[drewbles]

Seems like it might be an American thing to be bumped?

More like an American thing to hopelessly overbook by stupid numbers

Of course they can get away with it more as they have the frequency to be able to shuffle people around without making a lot of people wait overnight.

They are also very generous with compensation. Part of me thinks that if they employed some QF yield managers, their bumps would reduce along with the compensation payouts.

I never understood why you'd just oversell by a heap to compensate and re-book. I guess the compensation is less than the amount they make from the bookings so it isn't an issue from a financial point, and because all the carriers there do it similarly, pax complaining just becomes background noise as all of them would have similar bumping policies.