Tokyo Haneda slot - how will Virgin Operate it?

[eastwest101]

Reportedly the DL partnership was the primary factor why VA's LAX operations stood for so long before the COVID shutdowns and the subsequent VA 1.0 administration.
The DL partnership was also a 'pre-Borghetti' initiative when then-VB CEO Brett Godfrey switched codeshare partners from UA to DL when setting up V Australia. The partnership was subsequently upgraded to a JV under Godfrey with Borghetti renewing that in 2015.

The only parts of VA 1.0 (apart from Velocity) that was making revenue prior to the COVID shutdowns was the mainline 737 operation, FIFO contracts (old Skywest) and reportedly the joint DL/VA TransPac LAX operations.

The red-ink was also coming from the Regional (ATR), TigerAir and most international with the exception of LAX. There were reports that NAN was covering expenses though.

That sounds believable if we consider that Bain killed off TigerAir, the ATR fleet, most NZ flying pretty quickly (easy to justify with Covid restrictions anyway), the E190 fleet had already been retired (as hangar queens or just bad leasing rates we might never know but other airlines manage to profitably fly E190s). They kept the mainline B737 operation and I am wondering if it was the lease costs of the A330 fleet that sent them away into storage. Remember A330s were planned for HGK just as the initial riots and political instability hit Hong Kong. And the B777's were owned outright but of course not useful with international borders closed from 2020 onwards. Is that correct?

Without Covid, the A330 ops to Japan in an Olympics year should have made money, if the leasing rates weren't so stupid. As did the B777 transpacific operations before Covid.

 

[Saab34]

I don't believe the A330s went into Storage under Virgin, they just returned to the lessor who tied them down.

Looks like the Commonwealth Bank purchased a A330 and A320 to lease to Virgin.

https://www.fedcourt.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/76321/Tab-2.pdf

 

[SeaWolf]

There's one of the A330s still in storage at Perth airport. Just sitting there looking lonely and unloved, still painted in Virgin livery.

 

[Saab34]

The A330 in Perth is apparently broken and needs gear replacement which can't happen due to location/Airport refusal and CASA has said no to flying it out. The fact it has been sitting for approaching 3 years is another engineering problem.

The lessor on the sheet for VH-XFE A330 is Magpie Leasing. Which appears to be a sole investor with no other aircraft on its books globally. Looks like they are now stuck with a lemon. I wonder if Magpie got its return on funds across the 8 years, they sure as hell wouldn't want to spend anything on it anymore, but might have no choice, they own it.

 

[Scarlett]

The A330 in Perth is apparently broken and needs gear replacement which can't happen due to location/Airport refusal and CASA has said no to flying it out. The fact it has been sitting for approaching 3 years is another engineering problem.

The lessor on the sheet for VH-XFE A330 is Magpie Leasing. Which appears to be a sole investor with no other aircraft on its books globally. Looks like they are now stuck with a lemon. I wonder if Magpie got its return on funds across the 8 years, they sure as hell wouldn't want to spend anything on it anymore, but might have no choice, they own it.

Can it be towed somewhere nearby and be converted into an airport hotel of sorts? Pod hotels are a thing: A330 pod hotel! Maybe not enough transit pax through for such a PERfunctory solution.

 

[Sprucegoose]

It's happening quite a bit around the world at the moment. E.g. Finnair is flying A350s on trans-Atlantic routes for Eurowings Discover,

To clarify, is Finnair metal contracted to Eurowings Discover and not the other way around?

In any case, it is interesting as you will probably not know if you are on a subbed aircraft unless the longer-term leasing arrangements are disclosed to the market or alerted by the very good people on this forum.

I booked an AY flight from JFK to HEL to experience, apart from my love of all things Nordic, to try the new game-changing Collins Airlounge Seat, so I guess there is always the possibility of getting subbed.

 

[jase05]

It's happening quite a bit around the world at the moment. E.g. Finnair is flying A350s on trans-Atlantic routes for Eurowings Discover, and Wamos Air will fly A330s on PER-AKL over summer on behalf of Air New Zealand. There are a few more examples here: Book One Airline, Fly Another: The World of Wet Leasing

With VA partnering with QR, Qatar could (for example) fly a DOH-BNE-HND-BNE-DOH rotation with the BNE-HND legs under a VA flight number.

Many years ago, VA actually used to fly a 777 on a SYD-AUH-KUL-AUH-SYD rotation with the AUH-KUL sectors done on behalf of Etihad.

QR are still leasing 4 of the three class CX 777’s aren’t they?
They also had a wet lease agreement with WY on a couple of A330’s for memory

 

[HS-TQE]

The financier that bought VH-VPF (ex-VA 77W) off VA during Voluntary Administration has sold the aircraft to a lessor and the lessor has subsequently leased it out to VA's partner QR.
The aircraft has subsequently flown from VCV to DOH for storage.

We may see ex-VPF back on Australian shores under QR colours in a few months time.

On a related note, a shame that ex-VPE is likely to be facing scrapping due to numerous issues ferrying over to VCV and potentially ex-VOZ (repo job from Russia) may also be facing scrapping as well.

 

[sqrt()]

To clarify, is Finnair metal contracted to Eurowings Discover and not the other way around?

In any case, it is interesting as you will probably not know if you are on a subbed aircraft unless the longer-term leasing arrangements are disclosed to the market or alerted by the very good people on this forum.

I booked an AY flight from JFK to HEL to experience, apart from my love of all things Nordic, to try the new game-changing Collins Airlounge Seat, so I guess there is always the possibility of getting subbed.

Finnair is operating their own metal under 4Y (Eurowings). I.e. 4Y55 FRA-LAS. Look it up and its an AY flight in all but name.

I would think getting subbed for a 330 would be very unlikely for a flagship route like HEL-JFK. Maybe a 350 with the old layout, not that its bad imo.

 

[Sprucegoose]

There's one of the A330s still in storage at Perth airport. Just sitting there looking lonely and unloved, still painted in Virgin livery.

As is this 777 sitting lonely at WTP plus another.

Swinging back OT, could these be utilised if the economics allow?

 

[henrus]

Are those MH A380s still for sale?

A380s at Haneda are a pain because they limit it to one on the ground at a time.

 

[Sprucegoose]

A380s at Haneda are a pain because they limit it to one on the ground at a time.

Yes that’s interesting and was well discussed in 2019. It's a policy position taken by airport management. Post covid may have altered that somewhat and I am not sure of their present position?

 

[jase05]

Are those MH A380s still for sale?

Recent transit through KUL
The one on the right has had all MH branding removed from it

 

[HS-TQE]

As is this 777 sitting lonely at WTP plus another.

Swinging back OT, could these be utilised if the economics allow?

Although both 777s in question is still registered to "VB Leasing" (a wholly owned 'shell' subsidiary of Virgin Australia Holdings), the two aircraft are under custody of UMF Bank and another financier.

 

[OZDUCK]

Recent transit through KUL
The one on the right has had all MH branding removed from itView attachment 305818

They supposedly have a new owner - Airbus.

Malaysia Airlines A380s Find New Owner

After a series of attempts to sell the Airbus A380, Malaysia Airlines (MH) has found a new owner, Airbus.

airwaysmag.com

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

SeaWolf said:
There's one of the A330s still in storage at Perth airport. Just sitting there looking lonely and unloved, still painted in Virgin livery
Another member on here, or another thread mentioned that that particular A330 that VA used to fly, currently sitting at PER has had problems with it.
And (probably) no one wants to spend money flying it out.

 

[HS-TQE]

I suspect the registered owner of VH-XFE (Magpie Leasing) may be a shell company of a larger organisation. Not sure if "Orix Aviation" is the 'actual' owner of XFE.

It is speculated (not confirmed) that XFE had the registered owner moved to 'Magpie Leasing' to attempt to write the aircraft off the books of the parent owner.

Our Fleet - ORIX Aviation

www.orixaviation.com

 

[HeavyElectricity]

There's one of the A330s still in storage at Perth airport. Just sitting there looking lonely and unloved, still painted in Virgin livery.

Sad to see it there, in quite a prominent position from the international terminal viewing area. I had a lot of great trips in "The Business" on that aircraft!

 

[jase05]

I must stress this bit of gossip came from a QF Exec so take it with a grain of salt but he has heard whispers that VA and NH are in the process of going through a wet lease agreement and hoping to have something in place by February.
I do t know the legalities or feasibility around it so will be interesting to see if it eventuates or it’s just a wild rumour

 

[HS-TQE]

Whether if the rumour is true or not that's probably going to open a can of worms with the IASC considering the original application did not allow for wet-leases (assumably in the medium term - as there has been some temporary short term wet lease precedents in the past lasting 2 months at most for QF and AN) and it stated it was supposed to be operated on VA's own aircraft.