Tokyo Haneda slot - how will Virgin Operate it?

[jakeseven7]

Looks like the Tokyo Olympics are going ahead, so that's a plus, for both VA and QF.

Tokyo Olympic Games will go ahead despite coronavirus threat, IOC says, as WHO urges patience

International Olympic Committee president Thomas Bach gives his unequivocal backing to the Games going ahead, with the event set to run from July 24 to August 9.

www.abc.net.au

What else are they going to say right now.... I would put money they will be cancelled or at least significantly scaled back.

There's nothing oh dear about it. Promos like this (actually far more generous) have been available over the past few years.

On brand new routes that were supposed to be a gravy train - don't think so mate!

 

[ja1]

What else are they going to say right now.... I would put money they will be cancelled or at least significantly scaled back.

How do you 'scale back' an Olympics ? Run fewer events ? It's possible they could be cancelled since I think they could make that decision as late as May (given the event is in July).

 

[jakeseven7]

How do you 'scale back' an Olympics ? Run fewer events ? It's possible they could be cancelled since I think they could make that decision as late as May (given the event is in July).

I suspect a number of countries will pull out.

Therefore less heats, less events for people to see.

Japan might limit physical attendees to events / not allow at all (like fashion week).

Who knows.... uncharted territory.

 

[rapitts]

I suspect a number of countries will pull out.

Therefore less heats, less events for people to see.

Japan might limit physical attendees to events / not allow at all (like fashion week).

Who knows.... uncharted territory.

Probably pushed to Oct at the latest.

 

[jase05]

I suspect a number of countries will pull out.

Therefore less heats, less events for people to see.

Japan might limit physical attendees to events / not allow at all (like fashion week).

Who knows.... uncharted territory.

Yeah, who knows. I have heard that China think they have the virus under control and some of the Chinese airlines are resuming flights soon.
With more and more cases around the world perhaps we will just see open borders in a months time and some normality return to travel

 

[AIRwin]

VA has been scheduling A330s on the following BNE-MEL flights:

VA309 MEL 07:00 - BNE 09:10

It's VA303 instead after the end of daylight savings...

 

[Must...Fly!]

Virgin Australia Won't Delay New Tokyo Route

simpleflying.com

They must be in a use it or lose it situation with the Haneda slot.

 

[Mattg]

Virgin Australia Won't Delay New Tokyo Route

simpleflying.com

They must be in a use it or lose it situation with the Haneda slot.

Indeed. Qantas' entire case for getting the second Haneda slot was that Virgin couldn't be trusted to get the necessary approvals on time, and not to cancel the route. Subsequently, VA put a lot of effort into assuring the IASC that they were capable and willing to operate as soon as the slot became available at the end of March. It would be embarrassing and also a poor long-term strategy to withdraw now - even if the route is a loss-maker for the first several months.

If it's any consolation, you'd have to imagine that VA will lose less by flying to HND than HKG at this point.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Maybe the fact that ANA is happy to link from incoming international VA flights, onto ANA dom flights to put pax onto them (ANAdom) could work in VA's favour, revenue sharing wise.
The HK uprising, if we can call it that, and the Coronavirus also did not help VAi's case flying into HKG.
Because with HK flights, once you arrive into HKG, thats it, you will be using ground transport after that, but with VA's HND slot, there is still money to be earnt by pax going ANA dom, all the better if the pax is able to buy the ANA dom tix at the same time, with the same PNR, to onlink from VA straight onto ANA dom via the dedicated int to dom transfer, like what QF have at SYD from T1 to T3, via the internal roadway.
In the end tough, I am not sure where to put my support, for VA being very ambitious in flying internationally, far and wide.
Not forgetting what happened to AN as in Ansett, didn't they go to HKG, and Japan too, and they had their deep link to SQ and (Air)NZ, then (Air)NZ bit them, just like what (Air)NZ did to VA.
Granted that VA and (Air)NZ are still in a code share agreement with (Air)NZ dom within NZ, no FF points earnt or course, just VA carrying the (Air)NZ flight # in the same PNR as incoming VAi flight.
In the end, I don't know, though, bravo VA for going far and wide, and giving it a try, or are they just throwing good money after bad.
Should they (VA) just in the end, put all its emphasis on Aust dom flights only, as a rival to QF.
Will the VA HND flights, last or not, (financially wise), 6 months/12/18 months?
Edit: > If you go to the ANA Aust website, and type in Au - Japan flights, you will see that on the ANA website, where the flight compnay is VA, it already carries an NH flight number, to link flyers to PER/SYD.

 

[HS-TQE]

Maybe the fact that ANA is happy to link from incoming international VA flights, onto ANA dom flights to put pax onto them (ANAdom) could work in VA's favour, revenue sharing wise.
The HK uprising, if we can call it that, and the Coronavirus also did not help VAi's case flying into HKG.

The HNA purchase didn't help matters.
The sister airlines wanted access to AU but wasn't able to due to "bilaterals" being full on the HK end, hence their purchase of their VA stake to access the AU-HKG market via VA.
I would guess if HNA didn't purchase the stake, VA would've largely left HK alone.

Because with HK flights, once you arrive into HKG, thats it, you will be using ground transport after that, but with VA's HND slot, there is still money to be earnt by pax going ANA dom, all the better if the pax is able to buy the ANA dom tix at the same time, with the same PNR, to onlink from VA straight onto ANA dom via the dedicated int to dom transfer, like what QF have at SYD from T1 to T3, via the internal roadway.
In the end tough, I am not sure where to put my support, for VA being very ambitious in flying internationally, far and wide.
Not forgetting what happened to AN as in Ansett, didn't they go to HKG, and Japan too, and they had their deep link to SQ and (Air)NZ, then (Air)NZ bit them, just like what (Air)NZ did to VA.
Granted that VA and (Air)NZ are still in a code share agreement with (Air)NZ dom within NZ, no FF points earnt or course, just VA carrying the (Air)NZ flight # in the same PNR as incoming VAi flight.

Air NZ and VA do not "codeshare" within NZ, they only interline. In other words, they will sell a through fare where they will transfer their bags. That's as far as the co-operation goes. IIRC, the NZ/VA interline was only re-instated after Luxon and Borghetti left their posts at NZ and VA.

In the end, I don't know, though, bravo VA for going far and wide, and giving it a try, or are they just throwing good money after bad.

Should they (VA) just in the end, put all its emphasis on Aust dom flights only, as a rival to QF.
Will the VA HND flights, last or not, (financially wise), 6 months/12/18 months?
Edit: > If you go to the ANA Aust website, and type in Au - Japan flights, you will see that on the ANA website, where the flight compnay is VA, it already carries an NH flight number, to link flyers to PER/SYD.

This was discussed many times before, a takeover by an investor with deep pockets is required. Which isn't likely to happen for the foreseeable future. Taking into consideration "the so-called saviour SQ" is currently writing off their losses in their VA investment and is likely to remain hands-off for the foreseeable future. I would not be surprised if SQ are also looking at reducing their stake if not sell out of VA.

If VA was to primarily focus on Domestic, the closest they're going to get is likely under a scenario where the (potential) owners are DL, with NZ and LAX being their only international with a reduced wide-body fleet of 7-8 A359s or 789s for East Coast-LAX operations.
Under DL, VA is likely to get the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK" with the reduction of VS international to focus on their bread and butter routes of UK-USA Atlantic flying.

 

[Bagpuss]

Under DL, VA is likely to get the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK" with the reduction of VS international to focus on their bread and butter routes of UK-USA Atlantic flying.

(Yes slightly off topic)
With FlyBE going into administration, which was owned by a consorium which was partly owned by VS, the intention was to rebrand as Virgin Connect.

It's going to reflect losses for VS and also any thought of A VA partnership which included deeper connections with Virgin Connect are out the window.

Richard Branson pulled out of selling down part of Virgin's stake in VA to KLM-Air France. He's probably made a mistake there now.

As per a previous comment, I think we will see a lot of airline consolidation and cutting very soon.

 

[jakeseven7]

Virgin Australia Won't Delay New Tokyo Route

simpleflying.com

They must be in a use it or lose it situation with the Haneda slot.

Great so they'll use it and lose millions hoping that everything blows through quickly and people start travelling again. hmmmmm

 

[jase05]

Great so they'll use it and lose millions hoping that everything blows through quickly and people start travelling again. hmmmmm

What options do they have though unfortunately?
I guess they are hoping to ride it out and hope for the best

 

[odysseus]

Great so they'll use it and lose millions hoping that everything blows through quickly and people start travelling again. hmmmmm

So if you ran the airline, you'd:
- give up the slot
- terminate/abandon your agreement with ANA, and create bad relations there, as well as lose the market both ways
- increase your perception with regulators, and your market, of being unreliable and unlikely to commit long term
- give up any claim to that market when recovery arises.

Ok....

 

[Must...Fly!]

It's not a problem to burn millions on the route - let's be honest, they've been doing that for years and years on various ventures. If the cash from domestic really dries up then they are going to be in a bad way and then it becomes an issue. Scurrah hasn't pulled any master strokes but there are steady steps toward turning the business around.

That said I've been perpetuating some really negative stories here. How about a positive?

Imagine the B737-MAX aircraft never was grounded and the deliveries were on track per the original schedule....now that would be bad.

 

[Bagpuss]

That said I've been perpetuating some really negative stories here. How about a positive?

I believe it's almost the weekend

 

[AIRwin]

(Obviously I chose VA322 )

I noticed it's changed to VA324 after the end of daylight savings... Hope your flight is before then?

 

[serfty]

I am booked HND-BNE in Z class for June - I hope it operates but as insurance have booked QF26 in U at the risk of a cancellation fee.

 

[Must...Fly!]

With the WHO officially declaring a pandemic overnight, I wonder if that will trigger slot rules to be relaxed at various airports...it wouldn't surprise me if the official declaration is what is required.

Edit: FAA has now also relaxed slot rules as of a few hours ago.

 

[ja1]

I am booked HND-BNE in Z class for June - I hope it operates but as insurance have booked QF26 in U at the risk of a cancellation fee.

Did you book HND-BNE because you needed to be in HND or is it some other type of flight ?