Visiting China outside of Beijing, Shanghai and Xian

[casanovawa]

As always, after returning from a trip I am thinking about the next couple and while it had been Vietnam next i am thinking of shifting to China or adding China to Vietnam.. While originally thinking about the main places of Beijing, Xian and Shanghai i saw a scoopon tour that goes through the Yangtze/Three gorges area... While not wanting to shell out multiple thousands and preferring if possible to do it on my own, has anyone gone and seen this area by say bus or ferry or train rather than paying for an expensive tour boat cruise or is that really the best and only way to do it? And is it worth it??

One response from talking to someone was to be careful because outside of Beijing, Shanghai and Xian english may not be very common and make it hard to get around the place....

 

[Isochronous]

As always, after returning from a trip I am thinking about the next couple and while it had been Vietnam next i am thinking of shifting to China or adding China to Vietnam.. While originally thinking about the main places of Beijing, Xian and Shanghai i saw a scoopon tour that goes through the Yangtze/Three gorges area... While not wanting to shell out multiple thousands and preferring if possible to do it on my own, has anyone gone and seen this area by say bus or ferry or train rather than paying for an expensive tour boat cruise or is that really the best and only way to do it? And is it worth it??

One response from talking to someone was to be careful because outside of Beijing, Shanghai and Xian english may not be very common and make it hard to get around the place....

Don't expect any English outside the 5 star hotels. Even there only a few of the staff will be fluent.

 

[smit0847]

I visited Hangzhou last year which is south of Shanghai. I didn't encounter a single person who spoke decent English the entire time I was there. Taxis will refuse to take you if they don't like your destination.

 

[casanovawa]

Ok, so it sounds like a guided tour or don't bother for a bit??

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Taxis will refuse to take you if they don't like your destination.

Don't like your destination or don't understand your chinese I've never had a taxi driver refuse to take me anywhere in China.. the only time is when they didn't understand what I was saying.

Ok, so it sounds like a guided tour or don't bother for a bit??

I think for an initial visit outside of a major city you might be on the right track with a tour. I'd double (or triple) check the credentials of the tour (tripadvisor and any other available sources) to make sure it's not a 'shopping' tour... they take you everywhere as per the itinerary, but the hotels are often out of the city centre and you spend a lot of time in shops... with the tour unable to leave until they have spent a minimum amount in the store. There are supposedly penalties if you don't go to the shops.

 

[casanovawa]

Yeah i'm not a fan of tours overseas and where they take you to all sorts of cultural events and shops and restaurants that give kickbacks, am usually much happier picking the places I want to go, I did a safari through central Africa as having not been to these countries before and not not knowing about local customs or corruption etc i went with the organised tour, but like i say, most other places its cheaper and better for me to do things on my own...

I do often look at some of the itineraries of these tour companies and then just make my own way through the cities and sites when visiting places so good intelligence in that respect...

There is a travel expo in Perth this weekend so maybe I'll make a few enquiries...

 

[Mogul]

I visited Hangzhou last year which is south of Shanghai. I didn't encounter a single person who spoke decent English the entire time I was there. Taxis will refuse to take you if they don't like your destination.

We spent 3 days in Hangzhou last year and had no problems at all. English definitely not as common as Shanghai, taxis weren't a problem, would like to go back for a week or so.

 

[moa999]

Done Hangzhou before, nice enough and I agree English was average.

Guilin/Yangshuo however which is absolutely stunning scenery is even worse -- but with common sense can still get around - makes it more fun!

 

[Denali]

We went to Chengdu to see the Pandas and even the 5 star hotel staff were struggling with English. We also went a couple of hours into the mountain region to Yaan (more pandas) and we stopped an entire restaurant from talking by just walking in, apparently they don't see westerners often. For restaurants, a few of them had picture meal books for us to pick and choose and hope for the best (food was amazing) but otherwise we got by with awkward smiles and hand signals.

We hired a guide and driver, the guide spoke very good English and did a great job. We usually use a guide/driver as we don't like large tour groups.

 

[teaHSRn]

I've travelled the 3 gorges without a guide and it was no problem; simply rock up at the docks at Chongqing and a tout will find you soon enough. Bargain hard. On board go with the flow and you will be fine.

Personally I think Yunnan province is a better option than the 3 gorges. Beautiful scenery, Kunming is nice and Tiger leaping gorge is spectacular. Also, not so much pollution.

In terms of getting around without Chinese or a tour - I think this depends on the person. I've spent 2.5 months in China over 4 trips and my Chinese is limited to: Hello, Beer, How Much, Toilet, Thank you and 1-10. Never had a problem with pointing and non-verbal communication and in fact I love the experience. Others will find this uncomfortable and unpleasant.

 

[footy99]

If you just learn some really basic Mandarin, you'll be fine. I like the Michel Thomas speaking courses for the plane on the way over - a few hours of that is enough to get by.

I spent a bit of time in Lijiang Old Town, Shuhe Ancient Town, the Tiger Leaping Gorge and Lugu Lake regions in Yunnan last time I was there. Also spent 2 weeks in Chongqing nearby, Dunhuang up north, Guilin, Yangshuo, Hainan, etc. No tours - just travelling and checking out the place. I'd recommend doing it that way - China is an extremely affordable destination - the overnight sleeper trains are fantastic - and you'd be surprised how far you can get with some really basic Mandarin and if worse comes to worse, Google Translate on the phone!

 

[smit0847]

Don't like your destination or don't understand your chinese I've never had a taxi driver refuse to take me anywhere in China.. the only time is when they didn't understand what I was saying.



I think for an initial visit outside of a major city you might be on the right track with a tour. I'd double (or triple) check the credentials of the tour (tripadvisor and any other available sources) to make sure it's not a 'shopping' tour... they take you everywhere as per the itinerary, but the hotels are often out of the city centre and you spend a lot of time in shops... with the tour unable to leave until they have spent a minimum amount in the store. There are supposedly penalties if you don't go to the shops.

We spent 3 days in Hangzhou last year and had no problems at all. English definitely not as common as Shanghai, taxis weren't a problem, would like to go back for a week or so.

We had each address written in Chinese. It would often take us 4 or 5 taxi drivers before one who would agree, including one driver who tried to throw us out midway when some girls hailed him down.

Hangzhou was quite pretty, especially the lake. Wouldn't need to go back though.

 

[Mogul]

We found Tripadvisor invaluable as we would look up where we needed to go and it would translate it into Chinese and we would just show it to the taxi driver or anyone else.

 

[andmiz]

Done Hangzhou before, nice enough and I agree English was average.

Guilin/Yangshuo however which is absolutely stunning scenery is even worse -- but with common sense can still get around - makes it more fun!

Likewise, have done Guilin/Yangshuo/Longji and through the entire trip English was not an issue and the hospitality was impeccable.

 

[casanovawa]

I've travelled the 3 gorges without a guide and it was no problem; simply rock up at the docks at Chongqing and a tout will find you soon enough. Bargain hard. On board go with the flow and you will be fine.

Personally I think Yunnan province is a better option than the 3 gorges. Beautiful scenery, Kunming is nice and Tiger leaping gorge is spectacular. Also, not so much pollution.

In terms of getting around without Chinese or a tour - I think this depends on the person. I've spent 2.5 months in China over 4 trips and my Chinese is limited to: Hello, Beer, How Much, Toilet, Thank you and 1-10. Never had a problem with pointing and non-verbal communication and in fact I love the experience. Others will find this uncomfortable and unpleasant.

Yeah I've been to 60 or so countries and while knowing a bit of high school German I have gotten by in most places with pidgeon English and a bit of pointing and laughing etc... In places like China and the Middle East where the street signs etc are in a different alphabet in can be a bit hard to navigate or find where you want to go etc, probably found the people in Russia the least helpful or easy to develop a rapport with....

With Google translate and some of their things for photographing signs and translating etc there are probably tools to help, not sure if you need access to data over your sim to use much of it...

I'll have a look at those other places you mention...

 

[casanovawa]

If you just learn some really basic Mandarin, you'll be fine. I like the Michel Thomas speaking courses for the plane on the way over - a few hours of that is enough to get by.

I spent a bit of time in Lijiang Old Town, Shuhe Ancient Town, the Tiger Leaping Gorge and Lugu Lake regions in Yunnan last time I was there. Also spent 2 weeks in Chongqing nearby, Dunhuang up north, Guilin, Yangshuo, Hainan, etc. No tours - just travelling and checking out the place. I'd recommend doing it that way - China is an extremely affordable destination - the overnight sleeper trains are fantastic - and you'd be surprised how far you can get with some really basic Mandarin and if worse comes to worse, Google Translate on the phone!

I used google/maps and put in Xian and Chongqing and asked me to show direction by trains and there was like about 4 changes of train, that would be a little daunting as it would only take one miss at a station where everything is in Chinese, timetables, names of trains, which platform, no help etc... If there were options where there was like one direct sleeper train that could be a goer...

I might book this for April so I guess I have a little bit of time to make some investigations before also having to send off for a visa...

 

[JK1964]

Guilin, including Li river, is stunning. Also Lijiang. English not widely encountered anywhere, but you could try hiring a local guide if required.

 

[Dino84]

We went to Chengdu to see the Pandas and even the 5 star hotel staff were struggling with English.

I had the same problem in Chengdu, English was ok for the usual exchanges but ask anything out of the ordinary and we started to really struggle to understand each other. Fortunately google translate helped a lot.

Scott.

 

[footy99]

I used google/maps and put in Xian and Chongqing and asked me to show direction by trains and there was like about 4 changes of train, that would be a little daunting as it would only take one miss at a station where everything is in Chinese, timetables, names of trains, which platform, no help etc... If there were options where there was like one direct sleeper train that could be a goer...

I might book this for April so I guess I have a little bit of time to make some investigations before also having to send off for a visa...

Use this site: China Trains Schedule: Tickets Booking Delivery Service

There are numerous direct trains with various seat/sleeper options. Just searching random dates in Feb brings up 6-10 direct trains per day.

But don't be daunted by changing trains anyway, especially from major centres. At those cities there is an English window at the station so it is all very simple. And often you'll meet other English speakers in the waiting area doing similar things.

 

[Mal]

I found navigating trains ok in China, although had a major ticketing issue (booked online through online travel agency , either the travel agency or myself entered one digit incorrectly - invalid ticket when attempting to collect). So be careful when booking.

See also Train travel in China | A beginner's guide | How to buy tickets for excellent background information and tips.