Will you remain loyal to Qantas following the new changes?

[NM]

The new changes to the Qantas FF program have created quite a stir. Many new members have come out of lurkership and posted their thoughts on the subject. It seems to me that current Qantas FF members have a few choice regarding their ongoing flying business.

 

[Mr Smith]

absolutely NOT, i will be cashing in my points and telling QF and OW to stick it where the sun won't shine, this is twice in 11 months they've jacked the awards up, to put it mildly, they can get F#$%&@. i just took in a fully cash paid ticket for a refund, next week on my trip to LA will be the last time i use them for longhaul, i'll cash in the points and cut the card.

 

[dajop]

You should add two options: "Yes, I don't like the changes but my travel is mainly domestic and I still prefer earning pts to not earning at all" and "No, because I travel internationally a lot and there are lots of other choices for me"

 

[markis10]

Great time for Virgin to rollout a program!

 

[Ray2153]

Screwed again by Qantas

I regularly fly to Europe and mainly use my points to upgrade (I'm a Gold Qantas FF and also Gold (premier Executive) on United). I've started flying United to Europe, even though it costs a bit more and takes a bit longer, because I can usually upgrade using my points, unlike Qantas. This latest devaluation of my points by Qantas tips the balance - I'll use up my 400k qantas points and then move 100% to United.

I'd much rather fly Qantas, and used to always fly with them, but when they keep screwing their "most loyal" customers like this, and are just so uncompetitive, the loyalty wears a bit thin after a bit.

 

[shillard]

Just the usual howling you can expect whenever the programme changes - not so different to the last change, when supposedly 50% of the customer base was going to abandon QF.

And they just got stronger - it happened before, it will happen again. You just watch.

No shortage of people wanting to pay for J seats on long-haul flights, so why tie them up by allowing discount economy customers to burn points and upgrade?

Of course you can do this easily with United - that's why United is broke.

 

[Warks]

For domestic I'm stuck with Qantas no matter what after my dummy spit with Virgin a while back (look for the thread "I'll never fly Virgin again - what a debacle!") Haven't flown with the since and I even have a credit with them I haven't used.
Despite all the horror stories with QF I've never had a truly bad time with them. Suffered from surly staff on the odd occasion but who hasn't with an Anglo airline? Always felt I was going to get there and that's the main thing. Can't say I've felt that with UA or AA!

No I don't like what they are doing - who does? Let them stand up! But the economic rationalist in me sees why they are doing it. Until we go all socialist and nationalise the banks and transport again we're not going to see any change. Still love the use of 1984-style Newspeak - wrap bad news in sugar and make out that they are doing you a favour!

Will vote "No go and stick it QF!" in the poll even though it's not true. Just want to send a message!! :wink:

 

[essjay66]

its a shame

Yes, well I'm in much the same boat as many in that I fly mostly domestic with the exception of the odd SYD > AKL. Its dissapointing, but I use most of my points on domestic upgrades and the odd full redemption flight. The upgrades don't seem to have been affected too much (except the discount economy restriction which I can probably live with) but this biz-o with full ticket redemptions going from say 45,000 pts to 72,000 (IF I'm reading the changes correctly) really is quite a difference. Its a shame. BUT ... what do you do?

Also, the proposed change to the international "waitlisting" really is quite silly. It was one of the few good qualities of the international versus domestic upgrade system. If they implemented the "waitlisting" thing with domestic instead I'm sure it would have to save them a ton of work. Before at least you knew a few days before you flew whether or not you got it - which you nearly always did anyway I guess.

It's all very sad.

 

[macca]

I fly domestic an average of 9-12 times per month and 5-6 times per annum internationally. We really have little choice but to fly QF, unless of course we want to go on OneStar or Virgin on the ridiculous. The best way to get revenge on QF is to book ahead as much as possible and get the cheapest possible fares. I frequently get return fares Melb-Syd for less than $200. I currently have 650,000 points and find the biggest problem is being able to use them for flights, the removal of upgrade priveledges for discount economy tickets will be a real pain however. I asuggest that there is little point in complaining to Qantas as a flyer (after all they don't even give a phone number to do so) but become a shareholder and you will find they take much more notice of you.

 

[shillard]

I asuggest that there is little point in complaining to Qantas as a flyer (after all they don't even give a phone number to do so) but become a shareholder and you will find they take much more notice of you.

And as a shareholder, do you want the airline to make MORE, or LESS profit?

 

[NM]

I think the changes are very much alligned with maximising sharholder returns. And also greatly reflect the lack of options and competition in Australian domestic serivces and Australian-based FF programs.

I think the majority of shareholders would be happy with the changes. Its the FF program members that are less impressed by the devaluation of their account balance. Shareholders who are also elite status FF members will be torn emotionally. I suspect their feelings will be determined by the respective balance of their QF share portfolio vs their FF account.

 

[macca]

Qantas shareholders

As a shareholder I am frankly disappointed that Qantas seems to regard its most loyal (and potentially) lucrative customers wioth such contempt. In line with other previously Govt owned businesses like Commonwealth bank and Telstra they pay their execs huge salaries and bonuses, yet fail to deliver on profit projections . Qantas is universally regarded as being one of the safest airlines in the world, unfortuantely it is also building on its reputation for being arrogant and dismissive of passenger complaints. Just try and find a phone number where you can actually speak to someone at qantas to express an opinion. As a shareholder I am concerned about return on investment, as a FF I get ignored, at least as a shareholder my communications are not ignored!

 

[tinkybelle]

I think i may have the best of both worlds

I mainly earn points with credit cards I will be giving all my business to american express maximiser and joining the asiamiles program and transferring all points to them.
I find the flexibility of asiamiles more to my liking as at least they do not charge points to change award tix.
They are also extremely pleasant on the phone and cannot do enough for you when you call.( I did a swap for CX points last year and changed the flights at least 6 times)
I will leave my anz visa and westpac earning qantas points as the hnl BC award has actually gone down to 142500 so I will save for that.
I will also get AA plat points when I travel except N class.
I have transferred my 100k to a gold ff and can use the points there more effectively.(availability and no cost to change)

 

[Guest]

For shareholders:

One question: does the return you get on your stock justify the negative changes you need to put up with as a frequent flyer?

I'm sure if you had a nice 1%+ slice of the pie you might like the changes regardless.. but for most of us with a few G's invested - honestly, ask yourself if it's really worth it.

 

[willyroo]

[flameproof suit]
I'm OK with the changes.

[/flameproof suit]
NM you'll have to buy me a beer at the QP to find out why...

 

[NM]

NM you'll have to buy me a beer at the QP to find out why...

I think I can guess :wink: , but that won't stop me taking you up on the offer. Missed you there last week when the HP's were flowing.

 

[Bob]

I know this is why AC are broke and QF is rolling in money, but my typical overseas trip in J costs $9000 with QF and $4000 with AC, because I get guaranteed upgrades at the time I book full economy with AC.

So as a QF shareholder I am happy, and as an AC Elite I am happy. As a QF Plat I am unhappy. Maybe we all need multiple personalities.

 

[QF WP]

Well, a good reason why you joined the rest of your family to AA, Bob....does that mean you have 3 personalities??

Broadly speaking, like Willyroo I'm happy with some of the changes that QF have made (given my changing travel pattern to mostly Dom flights (after 21 January 2005) and generally will be V outbound and K inbound) - this should help me retain Plat (unless they decide to change the goalposts for earning Plat in the future).

I'm going to discuss the program with Mrs LW soon - we'll probably transfer her 100K points to me, burn her 2 tier credits sometime soon and we'll live off my 8 remaining tier credits and 465K points (until I burn 4 by 21 Feb 05). I'm Plat to 28 Feb 06, so roll on the next changes.

 

[Bob]

Bob....does that mean you have 3 personalities??

As long as we don't have to buy three seats each time we fly, we are happy to have multiple split personalities. :?