Can you have too many Frequent Flyer points?

[cove]

Recently I was talking with another AFF member about frequent flyer points. His belief is that points are travel currency and there could never be a position where you could have too many.
The last time I lost any was 2001 which is long,long time ago.
Is he correct?

 

[Sequel]

If you want to use the points, you can never have too many.

However, every time they "enhance" the program, or worst case there is no longer a program ala Ansett, the even 1 point left in the account is too many.

Like any currency, there are fluctuations in value over time, but I dont recall the value of a rewards point ever appreciating.

Sent from my MB526 using AustFreqFly

 

[Austashes]

FF points are travel currency if you use them for travel. I recently used 305,000 points for an OTW trip (Business Class) that would have set me back $17,000 had I booked normally. 305K is a lot of points - so you cant ever have too many.

You'll lose your points after your account is inactive for 18 months: that means no points coming in and no rewards going out.

Expiring Points:

Here's what Qantas says about Frequent Flyer points expiring (it's section 9.2.2 of the QFF Terms and Conditions):
All Points held in a Qantas Frequent Flyer account of a non-Active Member will expire at the end of the 18th consecutive month for which the Member has not earned Points or Status Credits or redeemed Points (excluding any transfer of Points to or from an Eligible Family Member).
(There's an exception: if you had your Qantas Frequent Flyer account before 1 July 2010, you have an additional three-year grace period from your last "activity".)

Keeping an Account Active

The trick to keeping your points alive is this: you don't have to fly to earn Qantas points. There are hundreds of ways you can earn Qantas point - esiest is to link a credit card to your account.

 

[Reggie]

Yes - from someone who lost 500K points when NZ bankrupted AN.

Lessons earnt, I never transfer points to QF from cards (EDR excluded), I spend them within the program, free goods, prepaid credit cards or hotel rooms.

 

[Boris spatsky]

I just burnt 400k on the hedge that QF will devalue their points for international redemptions in the next year (pulling out of many routes). So yes, i think you can have too many.

 

[harvyk]

Yes, you can have too many points... All it would take is for the airline to shut down their points programs (and I believe most of them can do so with no penalty, just a few months notice / the airline goes belly up) and those points are now worthless.

I'm personally of the opinion that they are there to be used (which is why my points balance is always so low), as they do not accrue interest and a large points balance simply = you have a lot to lose if they become worthless.

 

[cove]

I have noticed that points have been getting devalued a little bit but for domestic runs it has not been too bad. Runs to MEL and SYD out of PER are now just under 50k each way on JASAs with QF to maintain status with a recoup depending on your status.
QF has been very tight on international redemptions unless you are thinking and planning almost a year ahead.
I cannot comment on Velocity as I have never redeemed a flight with them.
i do think the answer is "probably not" on too many FF points but yes we are in the "safe hands" of the airlines.

 

[tuapekastar]

Fortunately QF usually gives lots of notice when 'enhancing' the scheme. This does give one some opportunity to utilise some or all outstanding points before their value diminishes (notwithstanding that you may be competing with thousands of other QFFers trying to do the same thing).

I love having a biggish points balance (well, biggish by my standards) but it does not remain big too long. They are usually used to assist in status retention (eg. ASAs). And then it is amazing how quickly they can accumulate again with the benefits of that status ie. 100% bonus points.

Should the airline show any signs of imminent demise I would try like crazy to use all my points prior to that happening. If it dies, then I did well, if it doesn't, well no real harm done and just start accumulating again. I only lost ~21K points in AN, but I don't wish to lose any more in similar circumstances.

That's a roundabout way of saying, for me at least, that I cannot have too many points!

 

[JohnK]

I have close to 700,000 QFF points and I think that is too many.

That being said though I am not going to spend any until the balance hits 1,000,000 QFF points. I hope that is sooner rather than later....

 

[cove]

2 commas in a QFF account does seem to have a lovely ring to it JohnK.
I was just looking at the 747-400 to Sydney from Perth in J for 2 so that would cost a few points on JASAs so I am in reverse gear today for New Years Eve booking.

 

[Sprucegoose]

No just not possible.

 

[Hvr]

I have close to 700,000 QFF points and I think that is too many.

That being said though I am not going to spend any until the balance hits 1,000,000 QFF points. I hope that is sooner rather than later....

Sounds a bit like Ryan Bingham.

I have about 60,000 points having spent 256,000 in May on a JASA.

I am looking forward to increasing the balance and will have >130,000 by the end of the year. I think that is a good number and hope to increase it next year for a JASA in 2014.

I think you can have too many, especially if you're not really sure what you want to do with them.

 

[Katie]

I think you can have too many, especially if you're not really sure what you want to do with them.

Hmm, I guess by that logic, I should (try to) use some of my 730k points on Y+ to J upgrades on my Oct Aus-Us rtn flights ... have no other plans for them, apart from potential family upgrades for three of us from disc Y to J on some flight some time to somewhere OS.

 

[JohnK]

Sounds a bit like Ryan Bingham.

I wish!

I think you can have too many, especially if you're not really sure what you want to do with them.

I know exactly where my are going when I get to 1,000,000 QFF points unless there are "enhancementss" along the way.

The plan is to book 7 economy Oneworld awards or 1 business Oneworld and 5 economy Oneworld awards....

 

[Deleted member]

Just blew most of my points on two fares to LHR. For me and ALH in 2013.
After a couple of other closer bookings I am now a points pauper.
So he long hard slog to accumulate is on again in Ernest.
It was nice to have 1,000,000 points balance, even if only briefly........

 

[cove]

You mean RTW (around the world )JohnK?
With golf clubs ?

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Can you have too many? = no.

However once you have enough for your needs, what you can do is get more discriminating in how you earn them, and what deals you pass up on. I still avidly collect, but only when it is great value to do so. I also still enjoy the buzz of collecting as a hobby, and gain satisfaction from knowing that I can do so better than most. The family certainly enjoys the perks !!! have just booked SQ in J for next July School holidays for for 3 from MEL-CDG_FRA-MEL. Will shortly book for eldest daughter to return in J from Togo next February.

With still a balance of several million in various accounts while I am still very much an active points runner, I only now collect those points that are "free" or very low cost in $ + time to collect. I pass up on quite a number of opportunities as I do not need the points, but if I was low in balance would take them as it would still be vastly cheaper than actually having to buy a long-haul fare (shudder..horror!!!!!). My balance still grows faster than I can spend despite redeeming long-haul J (and occasional F) for a family of five with one or two international holidays per year.

A bit of cunning keeps the points rolling in though. ie My Woolworths grocery spend I gain 3 Amex points and am averaging over 4 QFF Points per $ spent there since the scheme came in and i the main only buy items on sales or at clearance, thus also save $$$ up front......I just pick off the best deals, walk several cards.....and avoid points on most full price promos as I can normally gain a better deal by only buying on sale/clearance.

Having a large spend does allow indulgences. For example for one of my daughters friends I said that if she paid me for the price of economy tickets, that I would supply a Business Class Seat on flights to MEL- Singapore- Cairo- Amman- Johannesburg - MEL. (Note that I also paid the taxes out of what she paid me...and was the main reason I asked that she pay the economy price)

 

[JohnK]

You mean RTW (around the world )JohnK?
With golf clubs ?

Yes the Oneworld award can be a round the world but does not have to be.

Not all my trips will involve golf clubs but what better opportunity to add to the 200+ golf courses I have already played if I take the golf clubs with me.

Golf and travelling go hand in hand. The 2 best things in the world by far....

 

[RWJ777]

The answer is yes.The reason for this is two-fold, both derived of economics which underpins loyalty programs.1. Having too many stagnant, or unproductive points, causes what's called an opportunity cost -- you could be using them for something else from which you would derive value. Those who design frequent flyer programs rely on the economic maxim that many consumers display nesting behaviours -- ie they 'save' points for a rainy day.2. Frequent flyer points -- and the ritual of acquiring them -- undoubtedly distorts behaviours. This is a well-known psychological factor derived of microeconomic theory and operationalised in marketing. We shop at Woolies, buy our goods on points-linked credit cards, eat at affiliate restaurants, do status runs etc etc.Both of these factors mean that frequent flyer programs -- and the ongoing acquisition of points -- is undoubedly against the average consumer's interest. And s/he pays for it in both cash terms but also lost amenity.And how do I know all this? Because I am an economist and yet, even though I know it's really quite contrary to my consumer interests, I am also a frequent flyer slave myself! A bit like a doctor who smokes.So, enjoy your points game. There are many worse things to do. But beware that you are probably paying for it so try to minimise the worst excesses of acquiring points..Now, where is my next EDR bonus offer of 100 points if I buy a gallon of yak's milk??!! Oh, and I must use my Qantas frequent flyer credit card to make the purchase.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

T-- and the ongoing acquisition of points -- is undoubedly against the average consumer's interest. And s/he pays for it in both cash terms but also lost amenity.

Well the key here is to not be the slave...but the master...... to think about each and every purchase. But the people that run these schemes rely as you say on the herd mentalities, rather than those on the edge of the bell curve such as I.

Personally I am very mercenary in my shopping and do not just slavishly chase points.

I shop at grocery stores like NQR first..and only use Woolies to top up (and by buying mainly sale clearance items I am purchasing at a third or more off for many items with 3 Amex and QFF points on top to further discount......and do not buy my insurance etc based on points as I can get a better deal elsewhere.

Amex re-rating the earn on their cads is going to cause me to shuffle cards, and to earn less points in future.