5,000 bonus points booking holiday online

[AnonymousCoward]

I am sorry but I do not agree. Whether you have 5 stops, 7 stops or 11 stops, the DONE4 is worth ~$11,000 so if I redeem a Oneworld RTW award in business then I am getting that value.

There are cheaper RTW business class tickets you can purchase if you want to only make 3 stops or 5 stops.

Yes, you can buy an $11k ticket /if you want/ (just as no one is stopping you from buying a $100k ticket), but if you can buy the same trip for $6k, then I would value the 285k points against a $6k cost (because that's what it would cost to buy a ticket) rather than a theoretical $11k for a DONE4.

Really? Is a point to point business class airfare SYD-LHR worth $14,000 or SYD-JFK worth $16,000?

If that is the cheapest that a regular passenger can buy such a ticket, then that's the market rate for that ticket. And you can then work out the value of your "points".

What I'm saying is /not/ valid is comparing a $20k ticket for SYD-LHR to the points *if* you can buy the same ticket for $14k.

 

[JohnK]

There are cheaper RTW business class tickets you can purchase if you want to only make 3 stops or 5 stops.

How do you get a cheaper RTW business class ticket for only 3 stops or 5 stops?

Do you make 15 stops on a DONE4? Technically I can make 15 stops on a Oneworld RTW award with the only restriction being a maximum of 5 stopovers and the other 10 have to be transits of <24 hours.

I have a draft itinerary for my trip next year. It will more than likely be in business class. So it will require 280,000 FF points not including the +++.

SYD-LAX-(BOS)-MAD-(ATH)-MAD-(CPH)-LHR-(GLA)-LHR-HEL-(PVG)-NRT-HKG-PER-CNS-SYD

Is this itinerary worth ~$10,499 not including the +++? If I were to purchase this trip in Australia how much would it cost? My preference is Oneworld and I want to start in Australia. I really have no desire to travel Star Alliance or SkyTeam or even spend money to travel overseas to purchase a ticket from there.

If the trip is worth ~$10,499, which appears to be the case judging by some posts on AFF, then I am getting a return of ~3.75 cents/FF point....

 

[simongr]

It's been a while since we had a good/bad debate on the value of FF points

I think it is dodgy ground to value points based on comparative air fares. If you would not pay the cash yourself for the air fare then you do not value the product at the same rate as the vendor. For example I know JohnK thinks that J fares to the US are horrendously overpriced - so although a J return to the US retails for $10-14K as he would not pay that for the fare then the benefit he is getting in his eyes is less than the retail price.

It might be better to compare a product that he will pay for and compare the reduction in oportunity cost that he is experiencing. Or maybe compare marginal utility vs. marginal cost. Similarly when valuing time spent on chasing small numbers of points - the marginal cost may be negligible as the time spent may in fact may not be costing anything - a call made at work between meetings, a call made watching the golf with the sound turned down. There is no marginal cost to the individual but there is marginal utility thus one should keep chasing points until marginal cost exceeds marginal utility.

For me I have just burned something like 600K point on a combination of J and F around the world flights but at this precise point I can not afford J/F flights - only whY. So in theory I should value the award at the price of a whY ATW trip but I am only taking the additional flights (I have only one destination I have to go to for a family thing) because I have the points - if I didnt have the points I wouldn't be taking such a long trip.

The only way to value the points that is objective I think is to use a blended rate of what it costs the FFP to provide the service - and that itself is fraught with complications.

Oh and the time spent arguing with JohnK whether your time is too valuable to chase small numbers of points is probably greater than the time he spent chasing the points - although as you obviously enjoy the debate then for you the marginal cost (opportunity cost of time lost) of the debate is less than the marginal utility...

Now where did I put that Game Theory book from uni...

 

[JohnK]

I think it is dodgy ground to value points based on comparative air fares.

Why not? I have accumulated all these FF points and they have no value? Surely they must be worth something. I think they are actually worth the value I place on them not the value that someone else places on them.

If you would not pay the cash yourself for the air fare then you do not value the product at the same rate as the vendor.

So all the people that put a high value on business class upgrades using FF points are wrong because they are not prepared to pay for a business class seat.

For example I know JohnK thinks that J fares to the US are horrendously overpriced

Horrendously overpriced. So I am not entitled to an opinion and I should just take your word for it that the pricing is fair.

Oh and the time spent arguing with JohnK whether your time is too valuable to chase small numbers of points is probably greater than the time he spent chasing the points

That is so far out of line. Who the hell are you, or anyone else, to judge how someone values their time or FF points? You look down on people and now you buy into a debate that does not concern you and throw insults at me.

Now where did I put that Game Theory book from uni...

I wouldn't expect anything else from you....

 

[simongr]

For a start JohnK - I was agreeing with you...

Why not? I have accumulated all these FF points and they have no value? Surely they must be worth something. I think they are actually worth the value I place on them not the value that someone else places on them.

I didn't say that they had no value - just that valuing them based on a straight comparison of a payable fare was in my opinion a risky proposition.

So all the people that put a high value on business class upgrades using FF points are wrong because they are not prepared to pay for a business class seat.

No - but for example if a oneway in Y SYD-LAX costs $1500 and the J fare is $6000 then it does not necessarily imply that the value of the points upgrade from Y to J for someone who would not pay $6000 for a J seat is not necessarily $4500 as that person does not value the J fare at $6000. If they were willing to pay $3,000 for the J fare then the marginal cost to them is $1,500 and that is equal to the marginal utility (i.e. the marginal additional satisfaction) that they will receive.

Horrendously overpriced. So I am not entitled to an opinion and I should just take your word for it that the pricing is fair.

I did not type "JohnK thinks incorrectly that J fares are horrendously overpriced" - I just said that you think they are horrendously over-priced. I didn't suggest you shouldn't/couldn't have an opinion just stating what I understand your opinion to be based on other comments you have given in these fora.

That is so far out of line. Who the hell are you, or anyone else, to judge how someone values their time or FF points? You look down on people and now you buy into a debate that does not concern you and throw insults at me.

Umm again I wasn't insulting you - I was saying that anonymouscoward had probably spent more time arguing with you on the value of FF points then you had spent on chasing the points themselves thus his argument that one should not chase small numbers of points was a tad flawed.

I think it's a tad rude to say that this does not concern me, I have chased small numbers of points myslef and was in fact lending support to you in agreeing that small points are worth chasing - that 50-60 points might push you into a bracket to secure the award you want thus the 50-60 points could be considered to be worth as much as all the other points that you had earned.

For example I was short 30K points to make my AAward into a OW190 which would have enabled me to get home on a single award rather than using more points by getting an additional award when I got more points. I would happily have traded the 90K future points for 30K at the time.

I wouldn't expect anything else from you....

I have no idea what this means. I was making reference to one of the books I read at uni on Game Theory, referring to the theories on how people made decisions. For example you make a decision about chasing small numbers of points - anonymouscoward doesn't make the same decision. I personally find that an interesting process and often apply the decision making process in my work.

I do find it a bit disappointing that when I in principle agreed with you, expressed a personal opinion on how one might value FF points during a discussion on how people value FF points that you elected to rant at and abuse me.

 

[JohnK]

I do find it a bit disappointing that when I in principle agreed with you, expressed a personal opinion on how one might value FF points during a discussion on how people value FF points that you elected to rant at and abuse me.

I sincerely apologise if I misunderstood your post but it did feel like another person was questioning the value I place on my time and how I value points and insulting me in the process. We can argue until the cows come home but we all value things differently. There really is no right or wrong.

I put off, or neglected, travel for 9 years and now I am going to make up for it. I am saving FF points to have an opportunity to travel round the world and go back to Greece. All FF points are important, even 50-60 FF points. How much time I spend will depend on how quickly the issue is resolved by QFF service centre or any QFF partners. There is no backing off saying I have wasted too much time the FF points are now not important.

I am not prepared to pay for a Oneworld Explorer but will use the accumulated FF points to derive that benefit. It may well be that comparing business class was not the best example but that is the comparison that was thrown at me. Why can't I base a value on the redemption at the retail price? How else could you value it? If I redeem an award SYD-HKG return on QF/CX then the value of the redemption is the cost of the airfare less any taxes and surcharges that are imposed. Someone can't tell me that my valuation is wrong because Viva Macau has cheaper airfares on that route.

A lot of curious friends asked me how much my previous Oneworld RTW award cost. Now what can you say? I used up accumulated FF points and paid ~$935 in taxes and surcharges. So they ask how much the airfare is worth. I mention that a Oneworld Explorer in peak season is worth ~$3,500 plus any taxes and surcharges. It does not matter that a Oneworld Explorer allows 15 stopovers but a Oneworld RTW award only allows 5 stopovers. If I wanted to purchase a Oneworld Explorer with 5 stopovers it will still cost ~$3,500 plus any taxes and surcharges. Whether I can get a RTW airfare cheaper elsewhere or I can piece together an array of LCCs cheaper is irrelevant. The value of the accumulated FF points used on the Oneworld RTW award to me is ~$3,500.

 

[QF WP]

[moderator hat on, having just read entire thread]
and now that things have calmed down, can we go back on topic (which as I recall was "5,000 bonus points booking holiday online"), or should we close the thread??
[hat off]

 

[albatross710]

Can I suggest leaving this thread open so that we can update progress on getting Qantas Holidays to come through with their offer(s) we've originally mentioned.

 

[bambbbam2]

I did read the t&c's of the offer, and it specifically said "bonus points will take at least 6 weeks to appear on your account"

so maybe they are just covering themselves well.

 

[QF WP]

albatross710, thank you for bringing back on topic and my thoughts exactly. We Moderators are not wanting to close threads when the OP's question or comments have not been finalised. However if threads go off topic and slanging starts, sometimes we have no other way.

Frankly, I'm of a mind to delete all the offending posts to tidy up the thread ....but would need to confer with my fellow Mods and admin.

 

[simongr]

I think the posts should stay - it would set a bit of a benchmark to delet posts just because it got off topic and heated - we would lose a lot of posts...

 

[serfty]

... - we would lose a lot of posts...

lots of laughter

 

[bambbbam2]

Offer now revived (sort of). Extra points for booking a Broome holiday from Perth.
The extra 5000 points offer is only valid for flight + hotel holidays packages booked online to Broome ex Perth. To qualify for points a customer must be a member of the Qantas Frequent Flyer program. Membership and points are subject to the Terms and Conditions of the Frequent Flyer program. A joining fee applies. Valid for all new flight plus hotel bookings made online between 6 and 10 May 2008. All travel must depart and return before 31 August 2008. Include your Frequent Flyer number when booking. Qantas Frequent Flyer points are awarded at least 6 weeks after departure. Cancelled bookings will not be eligible for the extra 5,000 points. If there are multiple Qantas Frequent Flyer members in the same booking, the Qantas Frequent Flyer points will be spilt evenly between all those members. To be sure of earning your Qantas Frequent Flyer points, always remember to quote your membership number when making a booking and at hotel check-in. Consecutive nights at the same hotel will be considered as one stay, regardless of the number of check-ins. Extra points are earned per booking only and are in addition to the 1 point per $1 spent on flight plus hotel bookings made online only with Qantas Holidays. General booking conditions apply, please visit: http://www.qantas.com.au/content/dyn/holidays/info/generalBookingConditions