Air France and KLM awards on the way?

[MEL_Traveller]

I asked both KLM and Air France via Twitter if they could inform me of the benefits they offer Qantas Gold status holders when flying on their airlines.

KLM sent me a link to the Qantas website page about Gold status telling me to contact Qantas for further info, ironically that page only mentions KLM one in the lounge section saying you get access to the Amsterdam lounge when flying on a KLM flight with a QF flight number.

Air France took over two days to respond. They informed me that Qantas is not a part of the Skyteam alliance and that I should contact Qantas directly to check the benefits with them.

At least KLM knew that Qantas was a partner but I get the impression that Air France doesn't actually know that Qantas is a partner.

Oh Seems nothing has changed. I messaged them pre-pandemic to ask if you got a free bag on KL/AF 'lite' fares being QF silver. They responded in the same way with a link to the QF website (which didn't answer the question).

 

[Jack_OC]

I asked both KLM and Air France via Twitter if they could inform me of the benefits they offer Qantas Gold status holders when flying on their airlines.

KLM sent me a link to the Qantas website page about Gold status telling me to contact Qantas for further info, ironically that page only mentions KLM one in the lounge section saying you get access to the Amsterdam lounge when flying on a KLM flight with a QF flight number.

Air France took over two days to respond. They informed me that Qantas is not a part of the Skyteam alliance and that I should contact Qantas directly to check the benefits with them.

At least KLM knew that Qantas was a partner but I get the impression that Air France doesn't actually know that Qantas is a partner.

Yes I decided to contact Air France about my issue and got a similar response. They said my QFF number is in fact in my booking, but Qantas status does not qualify me for any seating benefits. They said only Flying Blue or SkyTeam status pax get preferred seating, so I can either pay to select seats down the back in advance, or wait until OLCI opens and then select seats for free. When I told them that the Qantas website clearly states that QF Gold or above get preferred seating with Air France, they said that is incorrect, and told me to take it up with Qantas.

 

[Mattg]

Yes I decided to contact Air France about my issue and got a similar response. They said my QFF number is in fact in my booking, but Qantas status does not qualify me for any seating benefits. They said only Flying Blue or SkyTeam status pax get preferred seating, so I can either pay to select seats down the back in advance, or wait until OLCI opens and then select seats for free. When I told them that the Qantas website clearly states that QF Gold or above get preferred seating with Air France, they said that is incorrect, and told me to take it up with Qantas.

Please do take this up with Qantas and see what they say!

 

[Jack_OC]

Please do take this up with Qantas and see what they say!

I have emailed QF. I'm genuinely curious to find out if it's a case of AF not knowing/ignoring what the terms of the deal are, or QF making a mistake on their website. Based on prior experience, it could well be either!

It's not a huge issue either way for me as I'm on a short flight, and AF claim they will always seat families together, so hopefully at least that holds (even if it means being seated together in row 31!).

 

[henrus]

AF not knowing/ignoring what the terms of the deal are

100% Not knowing!

My conversation with them on twitter is getting quite amusing.

I asked about checked bags, sky priority and seat selection for Qantas Gold (and specifically which ones apply - in theory they all do according to the Qantas website). I just got back the response:

Apologies for the delay on our response as we are receiving a high volume of inquiries. We would like to advise you that since Qantas is not part of the Skyteam Alliance, the benefits that you have mentioned will not apply on our flights. We hope this clarifies.

 

[Jack_OC]

100% Not knowing!

My conversation with them on twitter is getting quite amusing.

I asked about checked bags, sky priority and seat selection for Qantas Gold (and specifically which ones apply - in theory they all do according to the Qantas website). I just got back the response:

TBH, I'm starting to suspect that AF have never actually implemented this part of the agreement.

I found an old AFF article from May 2020, which states:

When flying with Air France and KLM, all benefits are system generated. This means you’ll need to add your Qantas Frequent Flyer number to your booking in order to receive tier recognition.

In my case, AF staff confirmed that my QFF number is in the booking, but it makes no difference. That suggests that their system is not currently set up to recognise QFF status, and if all benefits are system generated, that means there won't be any benefits. It's also interesting that there seems to be no mention of any benefits for QF status on the AF website - at least not that I can find.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

100% Not knowing!

My conversation with them on twitter is getting quite amusing.

I asked about checked bags, sky priority and seat selection for Qantas Gold (and specifically which ones apply - in theory they all do according to the Qantas website). I just got back the response:

Maybe tweet them this? Air France-KLM Group steps up cooperation with Qantas Group

It's their own press release... they can't argue with that!

Third sentence of the first section says: Flying Blue elite members will also have access to additional benefits such as priority airport services and additional checked baggage allowance when traveling on Qantas.

 

[Mattg]

Maybe tweet them this? Air France-KLM Group steps up cooperation with Qantas Group

It's their own press release... they can't argue with that!

Third sentence of the first section says: Flying Blue elite members will also have access to additional benefits such as priority airport services and additional checked baggage allowance when traveling on Qantas.

Or this press release:

QANTAS ANNOUNCES NEW FREQUENT FLYER PARTNERSHIP WITH AIR FRANCE – KLM ROYAL DUTCH AIRLINES

Keep up to date with Qantas' latest news and information, media releases, articles, images and more with the Qantas News Room.

www.qantasnewsroom.com.au

Frequent flyers with Gold status or higher will also be able to access tier benefits including priority boarding, priority check-in and extra baggage allowance on any Air France and KLM operated flights.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Yeah - I found the QF press release too... but I didn't think AF/KL would give any weight to that!

 

[Jack_OC]

Maybe tweet them this? Air France-KLM Group steps up cooperation with Qantas Group

It's their own press release... they can't argue with that!

Third sentence of the first section says: Flying Blue elite members will also have access to additional benefits such as priority airport services and additional checked baggage allowance when traveling on Qantas.

Interestingly, that doesn't say anything about preferred seating. "Priority airport services" sounds like priority check-in and possibly priority boarding. And to be somewhat pedantic, it also doesn't say anything about what QFF elite members are entitled to when travelling with AF!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Interestingly, that doesn't say anything about preferred seating. "Priority airport services" sounds like priority check-in and possibly priority boarding. And to be somewhat pedantic, it also doesn't say anything about what QFF elite members are entitled to when travelling with AF!

It doesn't, but it confirms that there *is* a partnership, something which the twitter team doesn't seem to accept.

It does appear a bit one-sided in terms of QF proclaiming the benefits.

 

[henrus]

Interestingly, that doesn't say anything about preferred seating. "Priority airport services" sounds like priority check-in and possibly priority boarding.

This is the page that mentions the seating benefit.

https://www.qantas.com/au/en/frequent-flyer/partners/air-france.html?tabId=tier-recognition

From what I understand other things like priority check-in, baggage and boarding fall under SkyPriority so any QF gold and above should get SkyPriority automatically printed on their boarding pass.

I'm more interested in the luggage and seating benefits. Lite fares are cheaper than the rest but don't include seat selection or luggage. Apparently as QF Gold I should get them regardless although no one can confirm that to be the case. At this point I'm looking at flights (within Europe) in late January/Feburary so not urgent in booking but I'd like a solid answer before I book otherwise I'd lean towards a star alliance carrier due to holding gold status.

 

[Jack_OC]

This is the page that mentions the seating benefit.

https://www.qantas.com/au/en/frequent-flyer/partners/air-france.html?tabId=tier-recognition

From what I understand other things like priority check-in, baggage and boarding fall under SkyPriority so any QF gold and above should get SkyPriority automatically printed on their boarding pass.

I'm more interested in the luggage and seating benefits. Lite fares are cheaper than the rest but don't include seat selection or luggage. Apparently as QF Gold I should get them regardless although no one can confirm that to be the case. At this point I'm looking at flights (within Europe) in late January/Feburary so not urgent in booking but I'd like a solid answer before I book otherwise I'd lean towards a star alliance carrier due to holding gold status.

Yeah I know it’s on the Qantas website. My point is that I can’t find anything on the Air France website about it. Your comment about SkyPriority is the same as my understanding from the Qantas website, but my concern is that the AF system has not been set up to recognise QFF status. If that is the case, I doubt if we will receive any benefits of any description. FWIW, when I check my existing booking with AF online or in the AF app, it does not appear that we have any additional baggage allowance either.

 

[Danger]

Nothing's changed. And I'm not remotely surprised.

Qantas reciprocal relationship with KLM/Air France (2020 onwards)

Hi all, We've booked DUB-BLQ via AMS with KLM in Y. I'm QF Gold and was wondering if I c an seat select via QF rather than pay e10 per seat booking on the KLM site? I was able to add our QF numbers and I’m LTG so was hoping to select seats - should I be able to do this? thanks for your help

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

KLM Inconsistently Honouring Qantas Frequent Flyer Benefits

In December 2019, Qantas expanded its partnership with Air France and KLM.

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

Qantas Clarifies Air France, KLM Tier Benefits

Last year, Qantas introduced a new frequent flyer partnership with Air France & KLM.

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

 

[Matt_01]

it's refundable without a fee (up to the end of Feb at least)

A little OT, as long as you book the flight with points before the end of Feb 22 you can actually change or cancel up to Dec 22. I noticed you are P1 have you called VIP to see if they can help?

TBH, I'm starting to suspect that AF have never actually implemented this part of the agreement.

That wouldn't surprise me. Please do not take this the wrong way I like France as a country I just do not like having to deal with the French people or rules

 

[henrus]

That wouldn't surprise me. Please do not take this the wrong way I like France as a country I just do not like having to deal with the French people or rules

To be fair the problem exists on KLM as well. At least KLM twitter recognises that QF is a partner but directs to QF when asked any questions about the benefits.

 

[Jack_OC]

A little OT, as long as you book the flight with points before the end of Feb 22 you can actually change or cancel up to Dec 22. I noticed you are P1 have you called VIP to see if they can help?

Thanks - I hadn't realised that the flexibility rules were different for international bookings compared to domestic - that's even better

When I emailed QF about this I got a response (very quickly) from the VIP team. They said they are investigating.

 

[Jack_OC]

To be fair the problem exists on KLM as well. At least KLM twitter recognises that QF is a partner but directs to QF when asked any questions about the benefits.

TBH, I think it's a cop out when any airline directs you back to your own FFP to answer questions like this.

AF/KLM are the only ones that can confirm what benefits will actually be provided when passengers are flying on AF/KLM-operated flights. QF can clarify what is supposed to happen, but in practice, QF have little or no control over what actually happens on partner-operated flights. All QF can do is raise a complaint with their partners about failure to deliver agreed benefits - which hopefully they do.

For now, I'm going to assume that the only aspects of this partnership that are real are the ones that QF controls directly - i.e. the ability to use and earn points.

 

[bam71]

Slight side point, found some redemption J seats CDG SIN AF on Expertflyer. Does not show however on the QF site to book using QFF. Is this normal? Same deal as say QF blocking rewards seats from other carriers? Call to book?….

 

[Jack_OC]

Slight side point, found some redemption J seats CDG SIN AF on Expertflyer. Does not show however on the QF site to book using QFF. Is this normal? Same deal as say QF blocking rewards seats from other carriers? Call to book?….

One of the flights that booked (CGD-NRT with AF) was not showing online for me, but when I phoned up the QF guy found it. However, there was another example where reward availability was showing on the AF site, but not on QF, and when I phoned QF, they could not book it either.

So it seems that sometimes AF rewards don't show online via the QF site even if they are available to QFF members; and sometimes AF blocks reward sites from partner FF members.

Here's another quirk: las year I found 4xJ DUB-CDG-SIN with AF on the QF site, but I could not find availability for the CDG-SIN leg on its own, or indeed from any other starting point that I tried other than DUB. I called QF about that too, thinking it was just a glitch, but it was exactly the same for them - i.e. the only option was to start in DUB. I assume there is some sort of "married segment" issue there.