AMEX not accepted or surcharge

[Walter Plinge]

Agree, then Amex can to go the hell and life will be much easier. But as I said you get what you pay, the more points you get from AMEX, the more merchants will charge you. AMEX charges more from merchants in order to give you generous points, merchants must charge you more in order to cover the cost from AMEX and finally we (consumers) are the only one who pay for that.

Whatever. In June I flew to New York business class and return premium economy thanks to my Amex points. Next June I'm off to the UK, premium economy, booked and paid for on Amex points. It's early days but for 2012 Hong Kong and Tokyo are looking good.

I don't mind if merchants charge extra or prices are higher as a result of credit card use, as long as I can get a long-haul overseas trip every year or two.

 

[drewbles]

My comment about Allianz accepting Amex may have been premature. I rang them again on an unrelated matter and slipped in 'oh can I update to Amex yet with you?' and explained what the girl had told me earlier about it being available online but not yet via the phone and was told "oh that was a web developer issue. They were not meant to allow that to go to the web page we don't accept Amex".

Perhaps it's something to do with the Mercedes deal that they accept it for them, but don't offer it to any 'pleb'.

Has anyone ever listed Allianz as a merchant that doesn't accept Amex? Would be interested to see if you got the 'Allianz already warmly welcomes Amex' which of course is bs (like several i've had responses from saying that, yet the merchant says 'nope no amex').

 

[simongr]

The trap there is that if the cost of earning points is tax deductible then the benefit would be taxable. I can't see the ATO letting you have your cake and eat it.

Its not the cost of earning points it is the cost of paying by card. If you have a card you use for business purchases you will be charged irrespective of whether you get the points. The ATO will not examine your CC charges deduction and say that you used the card to earn points - you can pay your tax bill by card now with a surcharge.

 

[Moopere]

Its not the cost of earning points it is the cost of paying by card. If you have a card you use for business purchases you will be charged irrespective of whether you get the points. The ATO will not examine your CC charges deduction and say that you used the card to earn points - you can pay your tax bill by card now with a surcharge.

Yes, its interesting this. I have not checked, but expect there must be a Tax ruling on points .... in business terms they sound awfully like a fringe benefit, or other derived benefit at the very least. This must have come up as the FF points economy is much like the alternative economy that things like BarterCard provide.

 

[Stephen65]

The issue whether FF points are income or a fringe benefit was litigated by the ATO ages ago and they lost the case. Generally speaking they are not income or a fringe benefit.

 

[Mal]

Got one of those emails today from Amex regarding Medibank Private:

Thank you for contacting American Express® regarding your recent experience at MEDIBANK PRIVATE LIMITED - VIC.

American Express is currently in negotiations with the management at this establishment to address their policy on acceptance of the American Express Card. Please be assured American Express is addressing the issue and we will advise you once we have received an outcome.

I'm not going to hold my breath...

 

[sparoy]

Got one of those emails today from Amex regarding Medibank Private:



I'm not going to hold my breath...

I've received the same email too.

 

[lovestotravel]

merchants must charge you more in order to cover the cost from AMEX and finally we (consumers) are the only one who pay for that.

No merchants don't HAVE to charge more to cover the cost, they choose to if they are greedy more than anything.

I don't pay a surcharge that often, so I am not paying for it.

I will shop at places that don't surcharge for Amex as a rule.

If they do it's VERY unlikely I will return as there is always another business who won't

 

[Walter Plinge]

No merchants don't HAVE to charge more to cover the cost, they choose to if they are greedy more than anything.

I don't pay a surcharge that often, so I am not paying for it.

I will shop at places that don't surcharge for Amex as a rule.

If they do it's VERY unlikely I will return as there is always another business who won't

I run a business (8 employees) that accepts credit card payments via MYOB M-Powered Invoices. I don't surcharge. The reasons is the cost of the surcharge is more than offset by the saving in staff time going to the bank - they can add more value dealing with new clients, and me tracing unidentifiable direct deposits in the bank account.

Surcharging is illogical. If, say, everyone paid by cheque staff costs for banking would increase and yet there would be no surcharge for cheque payments. Credit card payments save time and money for business -- they should just absorb the cost.

As an aside I just paid the GST/PAYG bill to the ATO using Amex (love those points!). The surcharge was $137, billed separately.

 

[kpc]

Just back from 6 days in NW Tasmania....I don't think AMEX exists here!! In the 6 days, apart from the car hire, I found only ONE (petrol station) that accepted AMEX!!!

 

[Stephen65]

I've received the same email too.

I got the same one too.

 

[docjames]

Submitted for Optometrist a Couple of months ago, email this week Amex now accepted without surcharge. Now to go and use it!

No response at all for vet / Ikea / couple of others...

 

[hgwells01]

Thats weird. Mercedes Benz insurance which is, so far as I can tell, nothing more than a team inside Allianz has accepted Amex for at least 2 years - but the kicker is that they try for 2.5% surcharge. I'll be speaking with Amex about that before renewal this year

Let me know how you go with this one, i'd be very interested to know, have you charged either a car or car service with no fees to them? just in the process of negotiation with them over a car purchase and they want 2.5% so i'm haggling for it all!

 

[Moopere]

Let me know how you go with this one, i'd be very interested to know, have you charged either a car or car service with no fees to them? just in the process of negotiation with them over a car purchase and they want 2.5% so i'm haggling for it all!

My insurance is not due for a couple of months, so, too late for your current negotiations. Service has been free, part of the corporate program which I'd strongly encourage you to use if you are able as it represents immediate as well as long term savings/benefits.

Mercedes-Benz Australia - Corporate Sales - Overview

 

[hgwells01]

Moopere, thanks for the tip and the link, will make the call tomorrow and see if I can qualify somehow.

 

[docjames]

Visited a local locksmith today.

Sign on counter: "We regret due to increased backing charges American Express will incur a surcharge of 6%". :shock:

Incredible - there's no way it would cost them 6%, similarly, who'd bother?

 

[Moopere]

Visited a local locksmith today.

Sign on counter: "We regret due to increased backing charges American Express will incur a surcharge of 6%". :shock:

Incredible - there's no way it would cost them 6%, similarly, who'd bother?

In such cases you'd think the business would ultimately just be better off not accepting the card they perceive they are having trouble with.

These sorts of transaction and surcharges are almost 100% seen in small business I've noticed. Whether it be a corner milk and break shop or a franchised chain .. in almost all cases there is an owner not too far from the action who is annoyed, probably with good reason, at the merchant cost of providing this method of payment to his customers.

I do realise that airlines + hotels also do this, but I feel its only because competition is not sufficient and somehow they'd managed to make such surcharges look like the normal way to do business... in their own minds at least.

In many cases businesses are likely to save money by using cards as payment mechanisms. Imagine if we all had to front a QF desk and pay cash. They'd need an armoured convoy to truck away the cash at the end of the day and with that comes risk and additional cost. Same with Hotels. They don't really want you to use cash and they certainly don't want a cheque.

Anyway, at some stage we'll see such surcharges disappear as astute businesses come to realise that its just annoying customers and allowing their competition an opportunity (to not charge and thereby gain customers). In the meantime the only way to subtly help change things is to vote with your wallet.

 

[Walter Plinge]

In such cases you'd think the business would ultimately just be better off not accepting the card they perceive they are having trouble with.

These sorts of transaction and surcharges are almost 100% seen in small business I've noticed. Whether it be a corner milk and break shop or a franchised chain .. in almost all cases there is an owner not too far from the action who is annoyed, probably with good reason, at the merchant cost of providing this method of payment to his customers.

I do realise that airlines + hotels also do this, but I feel its only because competition is not sufficient and somehow they'd managed to make such surcharges look like the normal way to do business... in their own minds at least.

In many cases businesses are likely to save money by using cards as payment mechanisms. Imagine if we all had to front a QF desk and pay cash. They'd need an armoured convoy to truck away the cash at the end of the day and with that comes risk and additional cost. Same with Hotels. They don't really want you to use cash and they certainly don't want a cheque.

Totally agree. You don't get charged a fee for paying by cash or cheque yet the staff costs of processing these are quite high.

I recently decided to sign up a business to use MYOB M-Powered Invoices. Credit payments attract a fee and there's an MYOB fee too. But staff don't have to take 30-45 minutes to walk to the bank (and do their own shopping on the way) and money gets in the bank faster. And customers can get some points if they like -- and good on them.

 

[hgwells01]

Well I had a small win with Mercedes, they let me put 11k on the card fee free, the rest is @ 3.2% but the earn is still good for the points so i'll live with that. Not accepted the Mercedes insurance quote yet, will chat to them tomorrow about it and say if they will do it fee free i'll swap to them, otherwise I will go shopping.

 

[Moopere]

Not accepted the Mercedes insurance quote yet, will chat to them tomorrow about it and say if they will do it fee free i'll swap to them, otherwise I will go shopping.

MB Insurance probably won't respond positively to that I'm guessing. I found them happy to stand firm on their pricing when I didn't have competitive alternatives. I went out and got some pricing and came back to them. Ultimately, they do want your buisness and I found their policy seemed to align well with the idea of keeping your MB in good and reasonably original shape should the worst happen.

I find it quite funny, but sometimes you have to approach these things from a different angle. If they end up not being prepared to offer you the Amex transfer fee free then instead you may well succeed in asking for a 2.5% discount first.

So, get your best price from them, make sure its competitive with other similar insurance (or they won't budge in my experience).

Ask for 2.5% discount on top of that

They charge you the obligatory 2.5% Amex exchange

Both of you are happy