Article: Latest Changes May Not Fix Qantas’ Reward Availability Problem

[jase05]

Have dropped back to lowly no status with QF but still do earn points via various methods but it’s been a fair while since I’ve flown QFi and have no real interest in flying with them but the points come in handy for other carriers on various routes

 

[cove]

The value of Qantas points has continued to slump because so many points holders compete for too few seats.

 

[levelnine]

On a related note, I found it interesting to read about Emirates' president defending the airline's high carrier charges and the fact that he's refused to make Premium Economy redemptions/upgrades available at all:

While Emirates might not care if customers disengage from their program, I'm guessing Qantas doesn't have the same luxury. If it didn't have loyalty lock-in, it'd likely be a smaller company because it doesn't have an overly competitive international product in terms of cabin/service or network. (Domestic is a different story.)

So how will Qantas keep growing its loyalty program?

1. The ban on debit surcharges (if implemented) will make Qantas credit card use less appealing.
2. The new restrictions on credit card churning imposed by banks are going to slow down the rate of points issuance.
3. The value of Qantas points settling at 1-1.5c for most people will make on-the-ground partner earn less attractive (eg it makes more sense to take Woolworths cash back than Qantas points earn).
4. The large new taxes and fees are going to disincentivise points earn (ie they no longer feel like 'free' flights).
5. The lack of classic award availability is going to keep fuelling discontent with the program.
6. Qantas has already saturated the on-the-ground partner earn market. What's left? Earn Qantas points on your next next visit to the GP?

I have some thoughts on areas for growth based on what's happened in Europe, but interested if I'm missing any obvious ones.

 

[Neil64]

Qantas already has a solution to the problem, but it is not one that you'll like, as the article notes.

As my quick calculations demonstrated in the other thread, Qantas has reduced the value of a point when redeemed for classic rewards, significantly closing the gap between classic rewards and classic plus. In the most typical of flight booking scenarios (SYD-LHR, SYD-MEL), it is now only a slight up-charge to book classic plus in economy (1 vs ~1.1c/pt) and the up-charge for business class has significantly decreased (1.5 v ~2.1c/pt).

That up-charge will reduce even further during sale periods where the classic plus price falls. As a result, there will now be substantial parts of the year where it will be cheaper to book classic plus than it will be to book classic rewards.

And there's ample classic plus availability.

So I expect Qantas will release fewer classic reward seats, not more, because they have solved the problem: book classic plus.

If I'm correct, the big question, as the articles notes, is: should you still collect Qantas points?

Here's my broad answer:
- If you're Platinum or higher: yes, because you can still attain classic rewards via release.

- If you can attain your points for under 0.5c/pt (through non-surcharged card spend, credit card sign-up bonuses, manufactured spend, etc): yes, because you're still getting a good return on spend — purchase $1000 worth of points & get $2000+ worth of flights.

- If you're paying 1c/pt or more for points through Woolworths conversions, paying a 1% credit card surcharge & only earning 1 point per dollar: no, because you're converting liquid cash to an illiquid point for no uplift.

One last thought. The elephant in the room is the looming ban on debit card surcharges. If debit card surcharges are banned & credit card surcharges are not, credit card usage in Australia is going to take a big hit. Why pay 1-2% in credit card surcharges only to get 1-1.5c in points when one can pay 0% with a debit card and keep the cash?

In this opinion piece, I explain why I think Qantas has a Classic Reward availability problem, and why the latest changes - while they may have a positive effect overall on availability - probably won't be enough to fix it in the longer term.

Opinion: Latest Changes May Not Fix Qantas' Reward Availability Problem

Qantas Frequent Flyer has an availability problem. The recent program changes including Classic Reward price hikes, the introduction of Classic Plus and expanded partner airline rewards try to fix this. But they might not be enough.

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

You can leave a comment or discuss this topic below.

‘Qantas still claims to offer at least five million Classic Reward seats per year’
If only Qantas could prove this.

 

[Youfah Mizzum]

have finally made the decision to disengage from the QFF program

Same here, 2025 will be the first year in 15 years I disengage with the QFF program

I've been looking at alternative airlines and associated reward programs. Is Velocity the only viable alternative for Aussies? A program where points earn is as easy as QFF? And reward seat in premium cabins (ideally long haul) is plentiful or at least predictable drop times?
Personal issue for me is that MrsMizzum is almost "its Qantas or nothing". She's very interested in an Airlines safety record and feels most at ease flying Q metal.

 

[big_RED]

I've been looking at alternative airlines and associated reward programs. Is Velocity the only viable alternative for Aussies? A program where points earn is as easy as QFF?

I've been doing a lot of exploring over the weekend looking to answer this same question. I feel for ease of use, ease of acquiring points, ease of sign up bonuses.... Velocity is the way to go. The 1.55:1 transfer to KrisFlyer is also attractive I feel. Disappointing

 

[jase05]

And reward seat in premium cabins (ideally long haul) is plentiful or at least predictable drop times?

Not sure there is a program here that does that.
I find better availability for my needs with VFF but plenty of complaints on here regarding awards disappearing completely or numbers dwindling. End of the day airlines aren’t obligated to release seats especially in Premium. QR are cutting award availability on plenty of their own routes lately too it seems

 

[Mr H]

I've been doing a lot of exploring over the weekend looking to answer this same question. I feel for ease of use, ease of acquiring points, ease of sign up bonuses.... Velocity is the way to go. The 1.55:1 transfer to KrisFlyer is also attractive I feel. Disappointing

It's your call. I find availability of premium cabins on Velocity to be so rare they are not worth considering. Their routes are quite restricted too - basically down to SQ, UA and QR routes only. And they seem to charge flight by flight in many cases rather than allowing through ticketing and end-to-end pricing. Their website is very difficult to search by cabin class. Some people love them, but I prefer chocolate teapots.

 

[levelnine]

It's your call. I find availability of premium cabins on Velocity to be so rare they are not worth considering.

It's worth underscoring that very few people would fit into your travel pattern — solo travel on round-the-world bookings to clusters of esoteric locations.

Almost everyone else in this thread is much closer to the norm, by which I mean the typical Australian international traveller, even if they are not representative of the entire QFF member base as you've noted.

The norm is bookings for 2-4 people round-trip to Europe/Asia/North America with a strong preference for 1-stop to Europe and non-stop to Asia/North America, often in peak or semi-peak periods.

Yes, there's a few people in this thread who will make Qantas work for them now and into the future, but once you dig a bit deeper, you find they are almost all solo travellers (or dual at most), all willing to do inconvenient things to get their destination (stop multiple places, combine cash & points bookings, etc) and almost all able to travel outside of peak periods. There's nothing wrong with being outside the norm, but it does undercut the applicability of statements like 'Qantas works for me'. It also works for Vanessa Hudson — that's not much use to anyone but Vanessa Hudson.

 

[drron]

I've been looking at alternative airlines and associated reward programs. Is Velocity the only viable alternative for Aussies? A program where points earn is as easy as QFF? And reward seat in premium cabins (ideally long haul) is plentiful or at least predictable drop times?
Personal issue for me is that MrsMizzum is almost "its Qantas or nothing". She's very interested in an Airlines safety record and feels most at ease flying Q metal.

But virgin is well within the top 10 airline in safety in the world. Qantas s number 2 behind NZ. Surely if VA is not safe to fly she will have little choice of airlines to fly internationally.

 

[Mr H]

It's worth underscoring that very few people would fit into your travel pattern — solo travel on round-the-world bookings to clusters of esoteric locations.

That’s fair.

 

[BenP]

‘Qantas still claims to offer at least five million Classic Reward seats per year’
If only Qantas could prove this.

I'm pretty sure that they could prove this claim, they aren't saying that 'We have X amount of reward seats from a major capital city to another major international capital city' which is how most people interpret it. Let's be honest a majority of the five million are most likely to and from places no one is or want to go to and I'm pretty confident the ACCC would have asked this question already.
I think part of the problem is also that people are now conditioned that CR tickets are released 353 days out but as per one of the links in the article they are now releasing in batches therefore relying on a bit of luck (is this fair? probably not)

 

[Valdek]

I have finally made the decision to disengage from the QFF program it is just near impossible to redeem a premium seat X Australia. The entire FF program is big business now and flying with the said carrier (Loyalty mean nothing). In the process of switching credit cards I have saved on annual fees and found one I can get some points to the KF program which I think is probbly the most fair program in our region. I tried to give up my electricity provider but they said all their products come with points but there are saving on offer so switched now looking at heath funds. I will keep my Amex plat card as it lets me hedge but no longer going to actively pursue QF FF points. I am done! On a side note if the program is suppose to encourge you to fly with them and knowing redemption seats near impossible (And many people have noted here they would not if there was a 1% CC free) why would I fly Qantas when the like of SQ, JAL and other top tier airlines are at least a couple of 100 to a 1000 less in Business on most European legs, if a flat bed was all that mattered you could be saving a couple of thousand on second tier airlines...I am not there yet but certainly will fly the likes of SQ, TG , MH .

Same here, 2025 will be the first year in 15 years I disengage with the QFF program (apart from using remaining points - won’t be earning any more) and with that decision goes approx 4 seperate international fully paid J tickets per year over to a competitor. Don’t want to have to do it, but the value in staying with QFF just isn’t there any more.

Welcome to the club. I'm another who divorced Qantas some time ago when I realised that finding international QFF bookings using points had become difficult, then very difficult, and more recently, next to impossible.
One by one, I have given up all credit cards accumulating QFF points for the simple and obvious reason that they no longer hold any measurable value as an airline partnership loyalty programme.
I've moved my shopping to Coles (apologies, Woolworths, I know it's not your fault).
My Club Point membership will expire soon and this will be the end of the 20+ year loyalty relationship with Qantas.
However, things did not end up all that bad.
As a souvenir, I am left with many fond memories of what was once one of the best airlines in the world and almost 3M QFF points, with the possibility of opening a shop with heavily discounted coffee machines and toasters. Thank you.

 

[Anjan]

I am 33 year member with 4 million points between me and the Mrs and no where to go!

Welcome to the club. I'm another who divorced Qantas some time ago when I realised that finding international QFF bookings using points had become difficult, then very difficult, and more recently, next to impossible.
One by one, I have given up all credit cards accumulating QFF points for the simple and obvious reason that they no longer hold any measurable value as an airline partnership loyalty programme.
I've moved my shopping to Coles (apologies, Woolworths, I know it's not your fault).
My Club Point membership will expire soon and this will be the end of the 20+ year loyalty relationship with Qantas.
However, things did not end up all that bad.
As a souvenir, I am left with many fond memories of what was once one of the best airlines in the world and almost 3M QFF points, with the possibility of opening a coffee machine and toaster shop. Thank you.

 

[Gold Member]

So how will Qantas keep growing its loyalty program?

6. Qantas has already saturated the on-the-ground partner earn market. What's left? Earn Qantas points on your next next visit to the GP?

I have some thoughts on areas for growth based on what's happened in Europe, but interested if I'm missing any obvious ones.

“Qantas Classic Reward Insurance”. Pay an additional variable amount of points on each award booking to ensure that you don’t end up paying Classic Plus.

 

[MelbFlyer]

From the article:

"Previously, Gold and Platinum frequent flyers could log in to the Qantas website at 11am, 353 days before departure, and snap up those sought-after Business reward seats on long-haul international flights as soon as they were released. But Qantas no longer releases premium cabin reward seats this far ahead on its most popular routes.

Instead, Qantas is now releasing award availability in batches, and much closer to the departure date. Rather than releasing a set number of seats on each flight as soon as it goes on sale, Qantas’ revenue managers now manage the release schedule on a route-by-route basis."

No wonder I can't find any classic reward QF seats from MEL to SIN (except via QF1 / SYD) for October. Only JQ CR reward seats are coming up.

I can however, find Classic+ reward seats and the amount of points is actually okay (31k compared to a regular CR at 25.2k).

Still though, 6k points is valuable and even moreso when the changes come through later this year when things will go through the roof.

 

[Tiki]

I continue to earn QF via Woolies and the occasional AirBnb or hotel. I'm finding that moving forward, they will be of use for shorthaul flights to Pacific Islands in Y. I just wish they would bring Solomon Islands Airlines on as a partner. Domestic flights within Pacific Islands are ridiculously expensive!

For the annual longhaul to IST I am looking at QR via Amex and Chase cards and/or Aeroplan via Chase cards because I want J.

Velocity also for Pacific Islands, Y is ok.

 

[Anjan]

I meant to say I was at the classic plus launch at QF head office last year and met the head of loyalty and I offered my thoughts not that he cared! He stated there were lots of business owners who had a significant stash of points that they accrued during Covid and CP+ was good for them failing the fact the entire premise of FF is to reward flying and loyalty to an airline! It is now basically a spend based free for all program. I like many have alluded to think CP+ is the new norm and QF sold it as a new avenue as they were still copping some flack and did not want to cop any more. The CP and CP+ levels are getting closer..For domestic and Pacific CP+ may have some value..but 500k to Europe why bother when Kris Flyer is 154k at the advantage level and if flexible with city there is generally availability.

 

[Mr H]

For domestic and Pacific CP+ may have some value..but 500k to Europe why bother when Kris Flyer is 154k at the advantage level and if flexible with city there is generally availability.

KF points are much harder to acquire

 

[Anjan]

KF points are much harder to acquire

HSBC .5 and Amex .75 yes harder but less points required.