Ask The Pilot

[love_the_life]

We took a route from Canberra to Melbourne this morning that I have never seen before. Any idea if this is common or the reason?

 

[OzEire]

We took a route from Canberra to Melbourne this morning that I have never seen before. Any idea if this is common or the reason?

In years of frequent CBR-MEL travel I've taken that/similar route a few times but wouldn't say its common.

 

[Simo]

ATC or maybe some bad weather along the way...I use to fly to TSV every week and the track we took sometimes was a bit strange but we go there and when I asked they would just say ATC

 

[jb747]

We took a route from Canberra to Melbourne this morning that I have never seen before. Any idea if this is common or the reason?

Almost certainly ATC adding track miles to delay the arrival.

 

[love_the_life]

Thanks for the information - confirms what we thought may be the situation.

 

[serfty]

There have some pretty decent high level winds around in the last day or so.

The QF10 I came in on last night flew well south of PER, not crossing the Oz coast until near Portland.

Perhaps L/T/L's SYD flight made use of same for a bit.

 

[serfty]

(It may not have followed the published flight plan greatly - certainly confusing flightstats. )

 

[Boris spatsky]

We took a route from Canberra to Melbourne this morning that I have never seen before. Any idea if this is common or the reason?
View attachment 89904

We get this quite frequently on this route - ATC tell you during climb that it is a 5-6 minute delay (which you can't easily lose enroute unless you hold). They offer vectors to lose the time (which is fine as then they have to manage the timing) and we fly at minimum speed. The vector is normally to the east as there is little traffic out there (whereas to west of track is northbound traffic out of MEL). Once the timings work they send you direct to LIZZI which is the start of the standard arrival.

 

[jpk]

(It may not have followed the published flight plan greatly - certainly confusing flightstats. )

Flightaware seems a little confused too: Qantas (QF) #10 ✈ 30-Jan-2017 ✈ DXB / OMDB - MEL / YMML ✈ FlightAware

 

[love_the_life]

We get this quite frequently on this route - ATC tell you during climb that it is a 5-6 minute delay (which you can't easily lose enroute unless you hold). They offer vectors to lose the time (which is fine as then they have to manage the timing) and we fly at minimum speed. The vector is normally to the east as there is little traffic out there (whereas to west of track is northbound traffic out of MEL). Once the timings work they send you direct to LIZZI which is the start of the standard arrival.

Thanks bs- that info is really interesting. And yes, we seemed to be going very slowly!

 

[serfty]

Flightaware seems a little confused too: Qantas (QF) #10 ✈ 30-Jan-2017 ✈ DXB / OMDB - MEL / YMML ✈ FlightAware

Very little about the route map is correct; maybe the first and last 5-10%. We flew well south of the WA coast. At least the timings are right - but it still took 25 minutes to gate.¹

We had certainly reached the south latitudes already heading due East before being south of Indonesia.

¹ Part of this delay was waiting for a guide vehicle. The Pilot informed us while we were stopped on a taxiway that we had to wait for a lead car to guide the craft though runway/taxiway construction and the vehicle was at that time occupied with another aeroplane.

 

[jb747]

Flightaware seems a little confused too: Qantas (QF) #10 ✈ 30-Jan-2017 ✈ DXB / OMDB - MEL / YMML ✈ FlightAware

That route doesn't look unreasonable. There are numerous possible routes. They won't have sudden turns in them...that's generally an artifact of the computer systems. Last flight I did back on the 10, we were a couple of hundred miles south of Albany, and didn't cross the coast until Victoria.

At the moment taxiway A in Melbourne has works that affect anything with a large wing span. The section north of J is not available, and we have to cross over to S. That puts us, and more importantly, our wing tips, in very close proximity to the Virgin finger of the terminal. So, we have to follow a guidance vehicle, they have observers posted at near the obstacles to help with clearance, and speed is limited to 5 knots.

 

[docjames]

Question re: PA system. Note in the delays thread a cancellation at SFO due to inop PA system (a safety issue).

- Is this a know issue with the 747 (experienced a similar delay way back in 2008 due to inop PA)?
- If the PA is non-functioning in one area (zone), can the aircraft still operate (with no pax in the affected area) or is it "whole lot works or no-go"?

 

[Flying Fox]

At the moment taxiway A in Melbourne has works that affect anything with a large wing span. The section north of J is not available, and we have to cross over to S. That puts us, and more importantly, our wing tips, in very close proximity to the Virgin finger of the terminal. So, we have to follow a guidance vehicle, they have observers posted at near the obstacles to help with clearance, and speed is limited to 5 knots.

How many metres is considered close proximity when driving an A380?

 

[jb747]

Question re: PA system. Note in the delays thread a cancellation at SFO due to inop PA system (a safety issue).

- Is this a know issue with the 747 (experienced a similar delay way back in 2008 due to inop PA)?
- If the PA is non-functioning in one area (zone), can the aircraft still operate (with no pax in the affected area) or is it "whole lot works or no-go"?

Overall, they are extremely rare, especially on the 747.

Whilst I don't have access to a 747 MEL, I'd expect that it would allow sections of the cabin that have a working system to be used. Of course the system isn't just the listening end...you have to be able to transmit from certain points. We don't know how, or how much, was failed, so it's impossible to say if an MEL would have been available.

 

[jb747]

How many metres is considered close proximity when driving an A380?

I think the clearance past the Virgin area is in the order of 5 metres. It looks terribly close. I don't know the tolerance that they design to...if the paperwork says the taxiway is available, I'm not concerned about the exact clearance.

There is a discussion about it here: Wing Tip Clearance Hazard - SKYbrary Aviation Safety

And more than you ever wanted to know, here: http://www.skybrary.aero/bookshelf/books/3090.pdf

 

[andmiz]

Question re: PA system. Note in the delays thread a cancellation at SFO due to inop PA system (a safety issue).

- Is this a know issue with the 747 (experienced a similar delay way back in 2008 due to inop PA)?
- If the PA is non-functioning in one area (zone), can the aircraft still operate (with no pax in the affected area) or is it "whole lot works or no-go"?

Boeing produces an MEL for the PA so the aircraft doesn't require it to be serviceable, regardless whether its just one cabin zone or the entire system. Safety related communication is relegated to the use of the megaphones.

 

[mjt57]

Safety related communication is relegated to the use of the megaphones.

Imagine being the pax directly in front of the FA holding the megaphone!

 

[Franky]

Imagine being the pax directly in front of the FA holding the megaphone!

Thanks, but no thanks..

 

[lastrow]

I think the clearance past the Virgin area is in the order of 5 metres. It looks terribly close. I don't know the tolerance that they design to...if the paperwork says the taxiway is available, I'm not concerned about the exact clearance.

A couple of months ago two Virgin aircraft collided wing tips at Hobart. There is no push back at HBA and aircraft must do a very sharp turn to exit the ramp. The virgin plane was in the process of turning and his wing tip caught the tip of the plane next door. No clearance there.