Aussie/NZ Snow/Skiing holiday for a family

[jgm]

Don't forget to factor in resort entry fees in Australia. If driving - these will add between $6 - $8 per person per day for a family of 4, and don't change much if you are staying on mountain or traveling daily.

For beginners, you are far better off hiring on mountain. If you have a problem (especially with boots), & hire off-mountain, you can lose a full day's skiing trying to change them. I can still remember hiring boots that seemed OK in the ski hire, but nearly crippled me after the first run.

With the current exchange rate, lift tickets in NZ are about 40% of Australian prices, accommodation costs are lower, and even allowing for airfares, you will still probably be better off than staying in Oz.

Check out here for more info.

 

[Bundy Bear]

The NMs are considering a winter skiing holiday this year and as we have little experience in their area, I am looking for some suggestions around the following topics:

1. The best time to go, keeping in mind we have two kids in high school. This always raises the debate of holidaying in school holiday periods vs taking the kids out of school for a week or so. The best time for the snow is August; but no school holidays then; beginning of July may be a bit early, early September is a little warmer but the snow can still be ok.
2. How long to go for? I am thinking around 5 days in the snow and a some travelling time to get thee and back from Qld. The passes usually work in blocks, either Friday and Saturday night or Sunday night through to Thursday night; I would look at a 5 day option so arrive Sunday night and leave Friday afternoon.
3. Where is best for a family of beginner skiiers, including 5yo and three teenagers? We are happy to drive the NM family b*s to NSW or VIC fields. Should we be considering NZ? For a family your size don't go to NZ or Victoria; I would suggest driving the b*s, look at somewhere in NSW Perisher would probably be the best for 5 days. Thredbo is not as big as Perisher which has around 50 lifts compared to Thredbo 13 or so.
4. Suggestions for accommodation. Stay on the mountain vs off-mountain and commute. "Family" rooms acceptable and we don't need 4/5* accommodation. Stay on mountain is expensive; usually for NSW you can stay at Jindabyne and drive up to Perisher ski fields about 30 minutes drive away, look at the option for Skirider.
5. Where is best to hire skis, boots etc? At the skiing location (so can exchange if any problems), in the towns around the ski fields, or here in Brisbane before leaving? Hire the gear in Jindabyne, or where you are staying.

So any suggestions will be welcomed .

The carry chains rule applies for vehicles INSIDE the National Park, and Thredbo is inside the park. Get caught by a Yogi (park ranger) and you will be fined.

But if you are going to try skiing in NSW an option that hasn't been mentioned here is a place called Ski Rider Motel at Wilson's Valley Perisher Ski Holidays at Ski Rider Hotel
They have Accom, Ski Hire, and a regular (runs all day) shuttle bus and are inside the park and well located for skiing in Perisher Blue. They have some good packages too I believe.

Wherever you go, GET FAMILY GROUP LESSONS and have fun. Also hope that your kids don't decide they love the sport, as it is bloody expensive !!!!

I would recommend looking at skirider as per the link above; I stayed there in 2001 which was the first place I went for a snow holiday, you could drive from Brisbane and park the car at the accommodation and then you catch the bus up to the snow; or drive. So you could drive down from Brisbane on a Saturday get as far as Canberra then drive to Jindabyne and pick up your gear and then have Monday-Friday skiing; get a ticket with lessons and then head back to Canberra or Friday night.

I have skied Perisher the most but have been to Victoria and Japan; never looked at New Zealand due to the logistics of flights and stuff but might consider Queenstown this year.

 

[coolumbla]

From an owner of teenagers now but who started down the ski route when youngest delinquent was 4

If you can go to Queenstown do it

Land costs for accomodation wont be much different
There is other stuff to do in Queenstown when the weather is cough
Lifts are WAYYYYYY cheaper in NZ
If no one skis then the family lesson is the way to go on day 1 so that the kids can laugh at mum and dad
Rent skis there as you get to change them if they don't fit
Ski packages are cheapest so you get it all rolled into one
Helmets are de rigeur! (i never wore one until this year in Italy when there were all sorts of other idiots out of control running into people)
Book a rental car now!
Miss the last week of school if teh kids arent in year 12 because it is so much better
Hope they dont like it (i have a daughter whose 2 sports are skiing and equestrian~)

C

 

[samh004]

There is other stuff to do in Queenstown when the weather is cough

I usually drink, but not always alcohol (there’s a good chocolate shop near the wharf). There’s also plenty of other outdoor activities and good shopping too as I’m sure QF009 would attest to.

Helmets are de rigeur! (i never wore one until this year in Italy when there were all sorts of other idiots out of control running into people)

I agree, it’s not just the fact that beginners seem to have no control of where they ski, but in NZ the trees are replaced by rocks and sometimes there’s a little ice, so a fall on your head can really do some damage.

Book a rental car now!

Depending on where you stay and what your activities are likely to be, a rental car is probably not needed in Queenstown. As I said before, getting to and from the airport will probably be the longest trip. The Crowne Plaza is right next to the steamer wharf, about 50m from the centre of town and all lift tickets you buy come with free transport on and off the mountain. Driving up the mountains is good fun, but not necessary, last year some tourists (dunno what nationality but could probably guess) managed to drive off the road and roll their car, luckily they didn’t go far. Also, parking on the ski fields can sometimes mean a long walk if you don’t like leaving the house while it’s still dark.

Hope they dont like it (i have a daughter whose 2 sports are skiing and equestrian~)

Wow, bet that costs a fortune.

 

[odysseus]

With the current exchange rate, lift tickets in NZ are about 40% of Australian prices,

It's a bit hard to generalise, but pricing I've seen in NZ is around low 90s NZD for a daily lift ticket, whereas Australia tends to be around low 100s. Convert to AUD and the difference is NZ lifts are about 65% of the cost of the Australian ones.

That said, from what I've been able to tell, the Australian resorts (Perisher in particular) are much bigger, so you get more lift access for the same money. I'm used to AU resorts so was surprised when comparing recently that some NZ resorts only have 3 or so lifts for that money - Perisher has 45 lifts.

Accomm and lifts in NZ are definitely cheaper, but when you add on airfares and car hire (may not be required in OZ) I'm not sure if there's much difference in it.

 

[samh004]

That said, from what I've been able to tell, the Australian resorts (Perisher in particular) are much bigger, so you get more lift access for the same money. I'm used to AU resorts so was surprised when comparing recently that some NZ resorts only have 3 or so lifts for that money - Perisher has 45 lifts.

I don’t want to get too far off topic here, but 45 lifts covers a range of terrain for different levels of skiers. I hear it’s pretty flat, so probably good for beginners in that sense, for me I doubt I’d get much out of it. I prefer my black and double-black runs.

That said, I see it’s actually rated as 22% beginner, 60% intermediate and only 18% advanced.

 

[coolumbla]

samh
i like the flexibility of the car
I hated standing in front of the hotel waiting for the bus and what did it for me was the day we arrived on top of the mountain and you couldn't see a thing with the weather forecast that it would get worse!
9 out of the 10 people in teh group wanted to go back down but one person wanted to stay so the bus stayed there until the fanatic decided that it was useless

Add in kids and the flexibility of the car wins!


the horse stuff is only expensive every other day!

 

[samh004]

samh
i like the flexibility of the car
I hated standing in front of the hotel waiting for the bus and what did it for me was the day we arrived on top of the mountain and you couldn't see a thing with the weather forecast that it would get worse!
9 out of the 10 people in teh group wanted to go back down but one person wanted to stay so the bus stayed there until the fanatic decided that it was useless

Add in kids and the flexibility of the car wins!

We have a car while we’re there too, actually own one and just leave it with friends when we’re not there, but I hate how every tourist has a car there these days, the roads get so busy, and half of them can’t drive up the road at a reasonable speed so you get long lines.

I remember a few years ago when Avis bought all those Rav4’s. Was an eyesore, and they weren’t the best for up the mountain anyway

I was just suggesting that if NM is looking to keep costs down, he shouldn’t need a car as his lift ticket for each day comes with free transport. What he values the flexibility of driving up at his own time and driving down at his own time I don’t know.

 

[odysseus]

I don’t want to get too far off topic here, but 45 lifts covers a range of terrain for different levels of skiers. I hear it’s pretty flat, so probably good for beginners in that sense, for me I doubt I’d get much out of it. I prefer my black and double-black runs.

That said, I see it’s actually rated as 22% beginner, 60% intermediate and only 18% advanced.

For sure, it's not to suggest that one person would use them all, but that you have a lot more choice as to where you want to go (and ideally less waiting as people can be more spread out on lifts, though total patronage and lift type plays a part as well).

In NM's case, I suspect beginners-intermediate would be of more benefit at this stage than black.

 

[Maca44]

NM,
I have used Value Tours on three occasions thus far for ski trips to the south island of NZ, however, I have also skiied the north island many times also. Great Skiing north island, but as much to do/see for a family vacation and being beginners I don't think it is really going to matter that much which mountains have the best black runs. All beginner slopes are pretty much the same, but check out Australia's largest & most professional international Ski Tour and even if you don't use them it might give you some ideas.

 

[jgm]

It's a bit hard to generalise, but pricing I've seen in NZ is around low 90s NZD for a daily lift ticket, whereas Australia tends to be around low 100s. Convert to AUD and the difference is NZ lifts are about 65% of the cost of the Australian ones.

That's only for full adult prices. The OP is a beginner, & rates at Coronet & Remarks are NZ$45 for adults & NZ$25 for juniors. Also, NZ youth rates (under 17) are around 1/2 of a full adult ticket. Most OZ resorts charge full price for kids over 14, and the junior rates are typically around 2/3 of the adult rate. Also, the Remarkables has a family ticket for NZ$117 for 1 adult + 1 youth

That said, from what I've been able to tell, the Australian resorts (Perisher in particular) are much bigger, so you get more lift access for the same money. I'm used to AU resorts so was surprised when comparing recently that some NZ resorts only have 3 or so lifts for that money - Perisher has 45 lifts.

I've skied all over Australia as well as NZ, Canada & USA for many years. The number of lifts really isn't an issue. eg. Whistler-Blackcomb has 38 lifts compared with Perisher's 47, but has nearly 3 times the skiable terrain and almost 4 time the vertical; and Whistler is 10 times the resort that Perisher is. It is more to do with the queueing time (ie the number of people the lifts can move compared to the numbers on the mountain - NZ resorts have far less numbers than Australia), and the variety of the terrain suitable for members of your party.

Accomm and lifts in NZ are definitely cheaper, but when you add on airfares and car hire (may not be required in OZ) I'm not sure if there's much difference in it.

nzski has package deals for under NZ$1500 for 6 nights for a family of 4 in Queenstown which includes 3 days lift tickets, free shuttles and more. I haven't seen anything in Australia for less than double that. As I said previously: in Australia you have to pay to get into a ski resort. It is either a daily charge for car entry, or else you cop it in the bus fare. If you shop around, you can probably get a car hire in NZ for around the same price as Oz resort entry prices. Add another $800 for ski hire (save around $200 off that if you are in NZ), & you're probably around the mark in that there isn't much difference unless you can get cheap airfares.

For me, price isn't the main consideration, so I will most likely ski in Australia again this year. I'm more concerned with the overall experience, & my last visit to NZ (Mt Hutt) in 2009 left me a bit disillusioned. My issues in order of importance to me are:
1. Slope preparation - the grooming staff concentrated on their race teams and terrain parks. The piste preparation for the general public was amateurish at best.
2. The staff attitude & cleanliness of cafeteria area was bad. There are signs up all over saying "No Bags", and bags are stacked around nearly every table & left there all day.
3. The "road" resembles a goat track, and is worse now than it was in my previous visit there 5 years before. That said, Coronet is OK, but it is the only sealed road to an NZ ski resort.
4. Mt Hutt is colloquially known as Mt Shut for a very good reason. The place closes down for wind and snow, & you usually have to get there to find out.

Also, apart from some limited accommodation at Cardrona, none of the commercial fields have on-snow accommodation. You will have anywhere from 20+ minutes driving each way, or double that on the bus. If you go by car, you will be a lot more likely to have to fit chains than you would in Australia.

 

[samh004]

I’ll preface this by saying I’ve never skied at Hutt, but know a patroller there and know they got a heck of a lot of snow there last year, though other places got a lot too.

2. The staff attitude & cleanliness of cafeteria area was bad. There are signs up all over saying "No Bags", and bags are stacked around nearly every table & left there all day.

This happens at The Remarks too, generally though you just sit where you like, be there a bag or not. If they come back while you’re in the middle of a meal they’ll just ask to remove their bags and find somewhere else to sit. Not run into anyone yet that’s claimed the seats were reserved for them.

3. The "road" resembles a goat track, and is worse now than it was in my previous visit there 5 years before. That said, Coronet is OK, but it is the only sealed road to an NZ ski resort.

I don’t know what the locals views are on The Remarks, but I’d think they’d be the same as mine that I’d rather not see the road sealed, as it’ll just bring more cough drivers up to the field, there’ll be more accidents and the car park space is already pushing it on blue-bird powder days.

It’s not hard to drive the road safely and properly, and the fact it’s got scary drops off the side and is unsealed I hope scares quite a few of the bad drivers over to Coronet

TC is also a particularly scary road

Also, apart from some limited accommodation at Cardrona, none of the commercial fields have on-snow accommodation. You will have anywhere from 20+ minutes driving each way, or double that on the bus. If you go by car, you will be a lot more likely to have to fit chains than you would in Australia.

Snow tires and a good 4WD generally see me shooting past the buses and other cars on the way to first tracks, but I’d love it too if there was on field accommodation, just I can’t imagine it’d be much fun up The Remarks late at night, compared to in a bar in town

I think Snow Farm also has on-field accommodation, but a different kind of skiing that is too.

 

[odysseus]

That's only for full adult prices. The OP is a beginner, & rates at Coronet & Remarks are NZ$45 for adults & NZ$25 for juniors. Also, NZ youth rates (under 17) are around 1/2 of a full adult ticket. Most OZ resorts charge full price for kids over 14, and the junior rates are typically around 2/3 of the adult rate. Also, the Remarkables has a family ticket for NZ$117 for 1 adult + 1 youth

Hadn't seen those beginner passes as we don't have them here. However, as you compared with Coronet I tried to find out the difference/how you qualify. The distinction seems to be that it's only valid for "surface lifts." I can't find a definition - or even an easy to find map of the mtn for that matter - but on another map, it seems like it would only qualify you for 4 lifts, 3 carpet and one T-bar from what I can tell. At that restricted price with those limitations, I would expect he would need to move on to the proper pass by the second day if he takes things seriously. There only appear to be a total of 7 lifts, with the other 3 chair lifts, so presume those chairs are the ones excluded.

I've skied all over Australia as well as NZ, Canada & USA for many years. The number of lifts really isn't an issue. eg. Whistler-Blackcomb has 38 lifts compared with Perisher's 47, but has nearly 3 times the skiable terrain and almost 4 time the vertical; and Whistler is 10 times the resort that Perisher is.

It's not an absolute measure, and I wasn't claiming that Perisher beats all slopes with fewer lifts. However, as mentioned it gives you a lot more choice and variety in what you can do. If you're going for a weekend, you probably don't need that, but if you're there for a week as it sounds likely here, I'd suggest greater choice and variety are beneficial.

 

[samh004]

Hadn't seen those beginner passes as we don't have them here. However, as you compared with Coronet I tried to find out the difference/how you qualify. The distinction seems to be that it's only valid for "surface lifts." I can't find a definition - or even an easy to find map of the mtn for that matter - but on another map, it seems like it would only qualify you for 4 lifts, 3 carpet and one T-bar from what I can tell. At that restricted price with those limitations, I would expect he would need to move on to the proper pass by the second day if he takes things seriously. There only appear to be a total of 7 lifts, with the other 3 chair lifts, so presume those chairs are the ones excluded.

To clarify for you, at Coronet the magic carpets and the handle-tow are the beginner areas. I’m not sure about the double (although the 2010 map seems to have it replaced) as it’s really old and doesn’t go far, but generally it’s not any chairlifts and is just the beginner areas. The T-bar is next to the race track and in an advanced area, it’s definitely not included.

At The remarks they have 2 magic carpet slopes.

Depending on how fast you advance through the levels, you could be on a chair lift in the afternoon, or at the end of the week for the first time. The big idea is that when you’re an absolute beginner, it costs much less to learn as you’re just on 2 “lifts”.

 

[markis10]

Got to say that snow is not my idea of a holiday, not sure why but I have always thought it would equate to standing under a cold shower ripping up $100 bills no matter where you go, must have spent too much time in Victoria , I seem to have picked up a cold weather allergy.

 

[jgm]

Hadn't seen those beginner passes as we don't have them here.

Not true. Mt Buller has a beginner pass which INCLUDES a lesson, but restricts you to novice areas.

 

[odysseus]

Depending on how fast you advance through the levels, you could be on a chair lift in the afternoon, or at the end of the week for the first time. The big idea is that when you’re an absolute beginner, it costs much less to learn as you’re just on 2 “lifts”.

If it's only the two carpet lifts, that's even more restrictive. As you say, it's not uncommon for people to progress off those in a few hours. As such, I don't think it's realistic to use the $45 price as a reasonable comparison for a beginner - they'll need to pay full adult price by the next day if not the first day in many cases. At Perisher lessons, beginner groups would normally go beyond carpet lifts on their first 3 hour lesson.

I'd actually feel pretty annoyed if I'd bought such a ticket on my first day.

 

[odysseus]

Not true. Mt Buller has a beginner pass which INCLUDES a lesson, but restricts you to novice areas.

True in NSW (Perisher + Thredbo), which had been the focus of discussion. There are beginner passes, including a lesson, but you get full access to all lifts.

How does the Mt Buller novice access compare? Is it carpets only?

 

[jgm]

True in NSW (Perisher + Thredbo), which had been the focus of discussion. There are beginner passes, including a lesson, but you get full access to all lifts.

How does the Mt Buller novice access compare? Is it carpets only?

To start with: NSW has NOT been the focus of the discussion. The OP was requesting information about low cost skiing holidays & wether to go to NZ or AUSTRALIA (last time I looked NSW wasn't the only place in Australia despite what some Sydney residents may think).

There is also plenty of information about ALL ski resorts. I posted a link to the closest slopes to Queenstown (also includes Mt Hutt), which you need to check before you make incorrect statements.

If you don't know which names to google, here are the main Australian & NZ resorts:
Australia:
Mt Baw Baw
Mt Buller
Falls Creek
Mt Hotham
Perisher
Thredbo
Charlotte Pass
Selwyn

NZ:
Mt Hutt
Treble Cone
Cardrona
Coronet Peak
The Remarkables

Actually, the OP may well be advised to check out Selwyn. Their lift prices are A$60/35 for peak season and children's prices are to age 15. I haven't skied there, but it is supposedly a good beginner field, and now has a 2nd chairlift.

 

[samh004]

If it's only the two carpet lifts, that's even more restrictive. As you say, it's not uncommon for people to progress off those in a few hours. As such, I don't think it's realistic to use the $45 price as a reasonable comparison for a beginner - they'll need to pay full adult price by the next day if not the first day in many cases. At Perisher lessons, beginner groups would normally go beyond carpet lifts on their first 3 hour lesson.

I'd actually feel pretty annoyed if I'd bought such a ticket on my first day.

I said it can vary. I’ve found, by watching the beginners, most of them stay on the beginner slopes a while and don’t advance at all really. Not in their first day at least.

A child who has roller-bladed before might be on the chairlift quickly, and a child that has skate-boarded or surfed might be on the chair quickly too, but the vast majority aren’t. And I’m sure if you bought a learners pass and in the afternoon decided you could ride the chair, the upgrade fee would at most be the difference, not a whole new ticket.

It’s easy to move to chairs at Perisher when the whole place is flat!

So, for the vast majority of “never-seen-snow-and-never-skated-in-any-shape-and-form” people, paying for a lift pass for the whole mountain is a good waste of money. Especially when the first lift you can get on actually rises quite high.