Current Qantas First Lounge Menu (SYD/MEL) and relevant topics

[Cloud9]

You're not missing out on much. I just ordered it.. very average. Overnight take home roast duck from a Chinese BBQ place tastes better.

The snapper was pretty decent on Monday.
Yet to have any game in a lounge that was worth waiting for, sadly.

 

[Mal P]

The wine list (and other drinks) menu is now in a separate binder. Great idea. And no more Penfolds Max thank god.

 

[CaptainCurtis]

The wine list (and other drinks) menu is now in a separate binder. Great idea. And no more Penfolds Max thank god.
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I still find $20 wines in an F lounge absolutely horrifying.

 

[anat0l]

The wine list (and other drinks) menu is now in a separate binder. Great idea. And no more Penfolds Max thank god.
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Is the main (food) menu simplified in presentation as a result?

 

[Warragul]

I still find $20 wines in an F lounge absolutely horrifying.

Why? The price of a bottle is not proportional to the vagaries of taste or, perhaps more importantly in a lounge setting, popularity.

 

[Mal P]

Is the main (food) menu simplified in presentation as a result?

Yes! With wine pairings (ironically).

 

[sudoer]

CopperTree farms salted butter is interesting - I guess the partnership with Pepe Saya has finished

 

[Daver6]

Why? The price of a bottle is not proportional to the vagaries of taste or, perhaps more importantly in a lounge setting, popularity.

The problem isn't the price....just the utter cough quality of the wines for what's meant to be a first class experience. Those wines would barely be passable in a J lounge IMHO.

 

[anat0l]

The problem isn't the price....just the utter cough quality of the wines for what's meant to be a first class experience. Those wines would barely be passable in a J lounge IMHO.

That seems to imply that there are some sort of $ thresholds for what is the given quality of a wine, or rather a bottle must cost this much for Business and this much for First.

 

[Daver6]

That seems to imply that there are some sort of $ thresholds for what is the given quality of a wine, or rather a bottle must cost this much for Business and this much for First.

My comments are about the quality, not the price of the wines on offer. I think it's reasonable that you'd expect better wines in a first class lounge than a business class lounge. There is a strong correlation between price and wine quality below the $100 mark.

 

[anat0l]

My comments are about the quality, not the price of the wines on offer. I think it's reasonable that you'd expect better wines in a first class lounge than a business class lounge. There is a strong correlation between price and wine quality below the $100 mark.

And how do you measure the quality of a wine?

One poster above was attempting to qualify this by stating the price. That goes against your main idea that price is not an automatic proxy for quality. And then further - how do you tell a quality of a wine is fit for Business and/or First? What is the threshold? Or is it one of those nebulous things like freedom (i.e. it's hard to define precisely, but it is easy to judge when you don't have it)?

If you can't tell two wines apart from each other, but they both taste high quality, would you care how much they cost, be it cheap or expensive?

I suppose it's inescapable that we are creatures of materialism. We are more likely to believe someone wearing a suit compared to civvies. If a sparkling white isn't from Champagne, it's not fit to drink.

 

[CaptainCurtis]

Why? The price of a bottle is not proportional to the vagaries of taste or, perhaps more importantly in a lounge setting, popularity.

That seems to imply that there are some sort of $ thresholds for what is the given quality of a wine, or rather a bottle must cost this much for Business and this much for First.

There is absolutely a correlation between price and quality. Not a perfect correlation, but directionally. The quality of wines is poor because Qantas refuse to spend the money for an acceptable quality. Draw a comparison to other F lounges, and you'll likely find the quality in QF F is lower. Either they have poor sommeliers, or insufficient budget allocated to F wines.

 

[anat0l]

There is absolutely a correlation between price and quality. Not a perfect correlation, but directionally. The quality of wines is poor because Qantas refuse to spend the money for an acceptable quality. Draw a comparison to other F lounges, and you'll likely find the quality in QF F is lower. Either they have poor sommeliers, or insufficient budget allocated to F wines.

You still haven't fundamentally answered what is First quality wine.

The only factor you have is price and price alone.

You seem to have some authority on the quality of wine. What are some good First quality Australian wines that should make it on the menu?

 

[CaptainCurtis]

You still haven't fundamentally answered what is First quality wine.

The only factor you have is price and price alone.

You seem to have some authority on the quality of wine. What are some good First quality Australian wines that should make it on the menu?

I'm not going to engage further in trying to make this an academic discussion. I don't think the quality of wine offered in the F lounges is acceptable. There isn't some arbitrary threshold that makes the quality acceptable, no, but I would hypothesise that the quality is unacceptable (in my opinion) because Qantas won't allocate appropriate budget towards it, rather than it being because someone in Qantas head office thinks Wynns The Gables is a high pedigree wine. You are, of course, entitled to disagree with my expectations of quality in the lounges.

I won't be commenting further on this discussion.

 

[Daver6]

And how do you measure the quality of a wine?

One poster above was attempting to qualify this by stating the price. That goes against your main idea that price is not an automatic proxy for quality. And then further - how do you tell a quality of a wine is fit for Business and/or First? What is the threshold? Or is it one of those nebulous things like freedom (i.e. it's hard to define precisely, but it is easy to judge when you don't have it)?

If you can't tell two wines apart from each other, but they both taste high quality, would you care how much they cost, be it cheap or expensive?

I suppose it's inescapable that we are creatures of materialism. We are more likely to believe someone wearing a suit compared to civvies. If a sparkling white isn't from Champagne, it's not fit to drink.

I'll answer this in two parts.

Firstly, wine is incredibly subjective in terms of what one person likes and another doesn't. If someone really enjoys a wine that only costs $10 then they're truly winning (not sarcasm here).

However, wine quality is a combination of factors. They are in no particular order:

• Balance – The harmony between acidity, tannins, alcohol, sweetness, and fruit. No single component should overpower the others.
• Complexity – Layers of aromas and flavours that evolve over time, rather than being one-dimensional.
• Length – The persistence of flavours on the palate after swallowing. A long, lingering finish is a sign of high quality.
• Typicity – How well the wine reflects the characteristics of its grape variety and region (terroir).
• Structure – The wine's body, mouthfeel, and how its components interact. Well-structured wines tend to age better.
• Purity – The clarity and precision of flavours without flaws or off-putting notes.
• Ageing Potential – Some wines improve over time, developing new complexities rather than fading.

Which leads to the question, why would a higher quality wine general be more expensive. Some of the reasons include:

1. Vineyard Location & Terroir

• Premium wines come from vineyards with exceptional soil, climate, and altitude, often in renowned regions like Bordeaux, Napa Valley, or Barossa.
• These prime locations have limited land, increasing demand and cost.

2. Low-Yield Vines

• High-quality wines often come from vineyards that intentionally produce fewer grapes per vine.
• Lower yields concentrate flavours, improving the wine’s depth and complexity but reducing total production.

3. Harvesting & Production Methods

• Hand-harvesting is more labour-intensive and ensures only the best grapes are selected.
• Small-batch production, extended barrel ageing, and traditional winemaking techniques increase costs.

4. Oak Barrels & Ageing

• Ageing in high-quality French or American oak barrels adds complexity but is expensive, as barrels can cost thousands of dollars each.
• Wines aged for years before release require storage and capital investment.

5. Expertise & Reputation

• Renowned winemakers, generational expertise, and prestigious wineries command higher prices due to their track record of quality.

6. Scarcity & Demand

• Limited production wines or those from sought-after vintages become collector’s items, driving up prices.
• Fine wines from legendary estates appreciate in value over time, adding an investment aspect.

 

[RooFlyer]

You still haven't fundamentally answered what is First quality wine.

The only factor you have is price and price alone.

You seem to have some authority on the quality of wine. What are some good First quality Australian wines that should make it on the menu?

Let me have a stab from a different direction. First is First. It should be tops - the pinnacle of flying and lounging experience. QR's F lounge in Doha serves some truly outstanding wines from around the world. People know the wines/wineries there and they are award winners by their peers (and, yes, they cost a lot - abt A$250 the one I had there). Other airlines serve award-winning, outstanding champagnes. In no competition are Qantas' wines in its First cabin 'First Class'.

Its not like Qantas doesn't know what a great wine is - there is often some excellent wines for P1s and sometimes very good wines in the 'off menu' decanter in the F lounge (as reported here). Other airlines serve 'global or national greats' in their First lounges and First Class cabins. Its not just that Qantas doesn't, its that they don't even try - the quality is 2 or 3 steps down.

 

[DejaBrew]

First is First. It should be tops - the pinnacle of flying and lounging experience.

And even from the perspective of simple optics, I don't think it's an unreasonable expectation that we should be able to experience higher end wines (i.e. wines we may not otherwise have the means - or opportunity - to drink) in a "First" Lounge instead of a wine we could pick up for a tenner at Dan's. The wine from Dan's might be quite ok, but it certainly doesn't exude the "First Class" experience.

 

[Captain Halliday]

My comments are about the quality, not the price of the wines on offer. I think it's reasonable that you'd expect better wines in a first class lounge than a business class lounge. There is a strong correlation between price and wine quality below the $100 mark.

Generous.

A couple of those are QP at best.

 

[Vic]

I'm not going to engage further in trying to make this an academic discussion. I don't think the quality of wine offered in the F lounges is acceptable. There isn't some arbitrary threshold that makes the quality acceptable, no, but I would hypothesise that the quality is unacceptable (in my opinion) because Qantas won't allocate appropriate budget towards it, rather than it being because someone in Qantas head office thinks Wynns The Gables is a high pedigree wine. You are, of course, entitled to disagree with my expectations of quality in the lounges.

I won't be commenting further on this discussion.

Ok, you don't think the quality is acceptable.

So what would be an acceptable for desert then, besides the Noble One Boytrytis?
Hve you tried the Ulithorne Dona GSM? What is an acceptable quality GSM if that isn't?
Maybe I might like a Rockford Moppa Springs GSM instead. But then if they started serving that in the first lounge I'd image I'd have an allocation of that along with the basket press and black shiraz and the price might increase greatly.

 

[QFFHntrGthr]

Referring to the food menu, the current MEL & SYD F lounges are offering Steamed Snapper with Jiangxi sauce. I have had, in the SIN F lounge, Steamed Barramundi with Jiangxi sauce. I found the barramundi version a memorable dish but find the snapper version forgettable. Barramundi I thought just paired better with the sauce.
I was curious about the impression of others who have had both steamed fishes with the same sauce?