DJ Premium Economy- Controversial

[Saab34]

I found this on Skytrax, I think it will create some good discussion in terms of how useless this product is.

Melbourne-Perth in Premium Economy. Seems this was a long flight (4hrs) I thought I would try Virgin Blue PE for the first time. It was my first and will be my very last. I normally fly in their exit row seats called Blue Zone. It gives extra legroom but the seats are hard and uncomfortable, but I pay the legroom which compensates. The Premium Economy is no better than the Blue Zone seating exept in colour. You get free Foxtel - mine was not working correctly, It had less than half the programmes that are available. Being 58 I am seriously over childrens programs! The free food is exactly the same as everybody else gets off their inflight menu. You get free drinks, again off the inflight menu. The seating is 2x2 instead of 3x3. All they do is section off the centre seat by putting a cup/tray holder in it. What really made my blood boil was the fact that the person sat in the adjoining seat was not a Premium Economy passenger. I asked him how much he paid for the seat. He paid less than half my cost which was $854.00. If you add up my extras it would only add approx $35.00 to his fare. I worked out that I paid an extra $400.00 for the so called privilege of flying Premium Economy. I feel conned! I will never fly Virgin Blue Premium Economy again nor will I advise people to fly it. It is a product that is not worthy consideration. On the positive side, the FA's were good.

This is just not on..

I also have a friend who did SYD-PER, full sector, and she was the only premium economy guest, and in the only other PE Virgin put someone who obviously wasn't a PE guest, and when questioned, he only paid a $109 Happy hour fare. She paid $960, some of it was used as a voucher, but that is still not the point..

If Virgin want the corporate traveller/PE paying guest, they cant keep this up. The price is also overinflated...fancy paying nearly $2000 SYD-PER-SYD and get this treatment...

In my opinion, the front 4 seats should just be PE, not transferable to normal economy, and what sells in each zone, is what sits in that zone.

 

[oz_mark]

I don't know - on QF people complain about not getting upgrades and the seats being empty!

BUT, perhaps if DJ are going to 'upgrade' people into these seats then they need to look at who they are upgrading. QF use status, and maybe DJ needs to look at the same.

 

[SeaWolf]

I don't know - on QF people complain about not getting upgrades and the seats being empty!

I agree, people on these forums are always talking about ways to get that legendary op-up, it seems silly to me that there are now complaints that people are getting them!

 

[dajop]

Sheesh it's a dangerous business asking people what they've paid on planes. A few years back I paid $180 for return flights MEL-SYD-CFS. So arguably each sector cost $45. And was upgraded to J on the MEL-SYD and SYD-MEL sectors, yet I am sure a person who'd paid $400-$500 for the privilege of sitting in J wouldn't have been happy had they known that.

And what we don't know did the other PE guests have status with DJ and was the remainder of the cabin overbooked? Why should DJ be berated for something that is normal practice on many airlines with some form of premium cabin.

And as for the comment "The free food is exactly the same as everybody else gets off their inflight menu", well der that's what it says in the advertising. The main difference is that everyone else is paying for it. It does highlight how spoilt we are in this part of the world, I have flown business class on BA & IB in Europe, and I've flown DJ on a PE promo (prior to the free food) and frankly PE is up there or probably better than the European version of J, with IFE (if it is working) and a wider variety/better quality food and drinks. BUt it doesn't seem to be getting the travellers in, as it isn't quite up there with QF J (except against QF's 734). Maybe a better strategy would be to charge say $75 (for shorter sectors) and $150 (for longer sectors) like they do with bluezones.

 

[comint]

The free food is exactly the same as everybody else gets off their inflight menu.

I think that this (while true) is quite problematic, in terms of customer expectations.

A comparison to QF J on the same route - and food-wise you can expect; nuts, a bread roll, very small salad, choice of 2 main meals or 1 lighter option, small chocolate and small ice cream with biscotti or cheese or fruits. Realistically QF has a set menu, with little room for deviation or seconds! Where as on Virgin Blue, you might like - Italian-style Lamb Shank (hot dish), Vegetarian pasta (hot dish), 2 styles of sandwiches, a Chicken Caesar Wrap, Noodles, Soup, various chocolates, cookies, muffins, nuts & chips. Plus you can create as many courses as you like (pending them running out). So, in terms of comparative premium seat "food options", DJ is number 1 IMO.

However, the way it is served on QF J, with table cloths set down, clean white napkins over the arms of black uniformed waiters and nice crockery (cutlery is ok too, except for the knife) is much more posh than DJ.

Anyway, maybe it’s indicative that people who are willing to pay the premium price, aren’t being made to feel premium enough?!

 

[notzac]

A comparison to QF J on the same route

It's not a J product though, so that's never going to be a fair comparison.

I'll be the first to agree that DJ's domestic W product is not structured (or priced) as well as it could be - but you can't compare it to a true domestic J product.

 

[comint]

It's not a J product though, so that's never going to be a fair comparison.

LOL, even though I went on to say they won on food options!?

As dajop points out, it is similar to many European carriers' business class.

But I accept that DJ W was probably created to target QF full fare economy customers. However, that is problematic because for 10,000 points (4000 of which might be generated from the flight, status & paying with a selected credit card anyways) those passengers can upgrade to QF Business Class on MEL-PER! (i.e. just 6000 points* in real terms.)

* and get QF J, which is so good, that you suggest it is incomparable to DJ W

 

[notzac]

As dajop points out, it is similar to many European carriers' business class.

I absolutely agree with you there - it's definitely closest to Euro J, at least in terms of seating.

 

[StevePER]

BUT, perhaps if DJ are going to 'upgrade' people into these seats then they need to look at who they are upgrading. QF use status, and maybe DJ needs to look at the same.

It seems that all you have to do for an upgrade is to ask nicely once you're on board. It would be better if you could use Velocity points to upgrade, or make it status based, or just oversell Blue Zone. Having said that, whenever I've seen people get upgraded (or received an upgrade myself) it has always been once they're already on board, and they're only getting the seat (without any of the extras).

I was thinking the other day that maybe the high prices for Premium Economy are a result of including things that people don't need - lounge access for people who are already members, extra flexibility that people don't need, Foxtel channels that people don't want to watch. Would it be more profitable if it was offered as an add-on, like Blue Zone or extra luggage? Maybe it would devalue the product, but surely it would beat flying around with empty seats.

Steve

 

[codash1099]

I think that this (while true) is quite problematic, in terms of customer expectations.

A comparison to QF J on the same route - and food-wise you can expect; nuts, a bread roll, very small salad, choice of 2 main meals or 1 lighter option, small chocolate and small ice cream with biscotti or cheese or fruits. Realistically QF has a set menu, with little room for deviation or seconds! Where as on Virgin Blue, you might like - Italian-style Lamb Shank (hot dish), Vegetarian pasta (hot dish), 2 styles of sandwiches, a Chicken Caesar Wrap, Noodles, Soup, various chocolates, cookies, muffins, nuts & chips. Plus you can create as many courses as you like (pending them running out). So, in terms of comparative premium seat "food options", DJ is number 1 IMO.

However, the way it is served on QF J, with table cloths set down, clean white napkins over the arms of black uniformed waiters and nice crockery (cutlery is ok too, except for the knife) is much more posh than DJ.

Anyway, maybe it’s indicative that people who are willing to pay the premium price, aren’t being made to feel premium enough?!

But the food in QF J is not the same stuff they serve up in Y.

 

[comint]

But the food in QF J is not the same stuff they serve up in Y.

LOL... interesting that you say this, 'cause I really can't tell the physical difference between the main course & salad that gets served in QF Economy and what gets served in QF Business!

 

[dajop]

LOL... interesting that you say this, 'cause I really can't tell the physical difference between the main course & salad that gets served in QF Economy and what gets served in QF Business!

What are you talking about What gets served in J is definitely different.

They take the Y meal out of the foil try, halve the quantity, put it on a plate and decorate with some salad and the odd drizzle of olive oil or some sauce and wallah you have a J meal It's all in the presentation .......

 

[ishkaban]

Am pretty sure that DJ PE was created to compete with QF Full economy,

 

[brissyflyer]

Maybe introduce a Premium Economy Saver or Lite Fare. Have the same restrictions as a blue saver but with all the extras of a normal PE fare. Maybe charge Blue Saver Fare + 50%.

So for example a BNE-PER Blue Saver is $289, Charge $435 for a PE Lite fare, given the cost of Lounge access, luggage, food, live2air and blue zone that would be a pretty decent fare.

Peter

 

[ANstar]

II also have a friend who did SYD-PER, full sector, and she was the only premium economy guest, and in the only other PE Virgin put someone who obviously wasn't a PE guest, and when questioned, he only paid a $109 Happy hour fare. She paid $960, some of it was used as a voucher, but that is still not the point..

A bit cheeky asking someone what they paid for their seat isn't it?

I wonder if your friend would do the same if they flew J in QF and thought someone may not "look" like they had paid business?

 

[Evan]

Maybe introduce a Premium Economy Saver or Lite Fare. Have the same restrictions as a blue saver but with all the extras of a normal PE fare. Maybe charge Blue Saver Fare + 50%.

So for example a BNE-PER Blue Saver is $289, Charge $435 for a PE Lite fare, given the cost of Lounge access, luggage, food, live2air and blue zone that would be a pretty decent fare.

Peter

But i guess 50% is not enough because 3 seats into 2 seats is going to result in a 50% increase in cost of the ticket without the extras, and if you get less than 50% you may as well just keep your aircraft all the same, ok there is some advantage in gaining customers looking for more premium but i dont think DJ went into this hopeing only for 50%.

Of course i agree with you all about the costs, it was just that our expectations do not really meet with the same thoughts of the person selling the product.

E

 

[oz_mark]

Bear in mind that the PE tickets have the flexibility of the Corporate Plus fare. Which says something about where they are targetting it!

 

[wallacej]

I don't know - on QF people complain about not getting upgrades and the seats being empty!

BUT, perhaps if DJ are going to 'upgrade' people into these seats then they need to look at who they are upgrading. QF use status, and maybe DJ needs to look at the same.

Yes - totally agree with this statement. I don't know if DJ actually consider status at all when upgrading passengers.

 

[crazydave98]

Yes - totally agree with this statement. I don't know if DJ actually consider status at all when upgrading passengers.

At this stage our backend systems are not integrated enough to be able to automatically search out highest value guests and give them priority for upgrades, which is obviously unfortunate. It limits our ability to do guest recognition in several other ways too (e.g. disrupt management). But we are replacing the entire system this year with one that has been spec'd to do all this.

I'm quite happy to see comparisons with QF J class in this thread because as some of you have picked our target is full Y travellers. If someone regards PE as a substitute for QF J then that's a bonus.

cheers

CrazyDave98

 

[rwatts]

I'm quite happy to see comparisons with QF J class in this thread because as some of you have picked our target is full Y travellers. If someone regards PE as a substitute for QF J then that's a bonus.

For business travel my employer provides economy transport with fully flexible fare conditions. For DJ that means Corporate Plus fares with its included bonus of lounge access. However, with QF I can use personal FF points to upgrade to J, which I do whenever possible - primarily for the room (both width and length). I'm not terribly fussed about meals on short-haul flights.

The ability to upgrade to PE using Velocity rewards points would clinch many of the flight decisions that currently go Qantas's way.

Richard.