French long-term visas

[Jacques Vert]

Many countries are introducing “digital nomad visas” however, France isn’t one of them; at least not exactly. So, if you want to stay in France for an extended period of time, you have to apply for a long-term visa.

I thought I would start a thread on French long-term visas so that I could share what I have learnt from my research in this area and to allow others to add their own knowledge and experience (and answer any remaining questions I have).

For a bit of background, +1 & I are looking to travel to Europe for 6 to 12 months starting in July this year (2023). We have one-way tickets booked and intend to spend most of our time, at least for the first six months, in France.

Of course, most visitors to France obtain a Schengen visa on arrival at the airport. These allow you to stay in the Schengen area (not to be confused with the EU which is slightly different) for up to 90 days out of 180. You can find a current map of the Schengen area versus the EU here. (Note that most maps are out of date as they show Croatia as being outside of Schengen whereas it became part of Schengen on 1/1/2023.)

This webinar gives a great overview and introduction to French Visas, immigration and taxation rules.



I’ld be interested to know if anyone has had success, or otherwise, in applying for a 6- or 12-month visa and who they obtained their health/travel insurance through.

More specifically, has anyone used Europ-assistance?

 

[ZigZagWanderer]

Just for reference, as Australians, we can stay an additional 90 days in France after our initial 90 days in the Schengen area. Only in the one country, however. This is because we have a bilateral agreement with France, and a few other Schengen countries.

Edit: Yeah, nah. Sorry, I was wrong, France isn't one of them.

 

[craven morehead]

Following

 

[Jacques Vert]

Just for reference, as Australians, we can stay an additional 90 days in France after our initial 90 days in the Schengen area. Only in the one country, however. This is because we have a bilateral agreement with France, and a few other Schengen countries.

That's very interesting. I hadn't come across this in any of the research I've done so far.

Would you have a link or reference for this so I can check out the details.

 

[FlyingFiona]

Just for reference, as Australians, we can stay an additional 90 days in France after our initial 90 days in the Schengen area. Only in the one country, however. This is because we have a bilateral agreement with France, and a few other Schengen countries.

Not sure that's correct... see: Particular situations | Australia.

 

[FlyingFiona]

Further to my previous post, there are some countries that seem to allow what you describe @ZigZagWanderer (see here: Visas and entry requirements in Europe and the Schengen Area) but France isn't one of them.

 

[ZigZagWanderer]

That's very interesting. I hadn't come across this in any of the research I've done so far.

Would you have a link or reference for this so I can check out the details.

Try this

Visas and entry requirements in Europe and the Schengen Area

This page has general information on visa-free travel to European countries.

www.smartraveller.gov.au

Edit: Oooops. I may be wrong. I was certain that France was on that list, but it appears it isn't. Sorry about the mistake.

 

[ZigZagWanderer]

Further to my previous post, there are some countries that seem to allow what you describe @ZigZagWanderer (see here: Visas and entry requirements in Europe and the Schengen Area) but France isn't one of them.

Yes, sorry about that. I was convinced France was, but I seem to have misremembered.

 

[Jacques Vert]

Further to my previous post, there are some countries that seem to allow what you describe @ZigZagWanderer (see here: Visas and entry requirements in Europe and the Schengen Area) but France isn't one of them.

Thanks for the links @FlyingFiona and @ZigZagWanderer. Although France is not on that list, it does give me another option.

The French long-stay visitor visas are considered a separate document to a Schengen Visa. So one can stay in France for 6 (or 12) months on a long-stay visitor visa, then after leaving France for at least a day, return on a Schengen visa. Looking at the details of the bilateral visa waiver in that link, you could then stay in one of the listed countries for up to another 90 days giving you year in total (183 + 90 in France + 90 in one of the countries on that list).

 

[esseeeayeenn]

Further to my previous post, there are some countries that seem to allow what you describe @ZigZagWanderer (see here: Visas and entry requirements in Europe and the Schengen Area) but France isn't one of them.

Interesting.
Unfortunately the links to Italy and Spain respectively don't provide any more details of how this works!

 

[Mattg]

Of course, most visitors to France obtain a Schengen visa on arrival at the airport. These allow you to stay in the Schengen area (not to be confused with the EU which is slightly different) for up to 90 days out of 180.

Just want to clarify for the avoidance of confusion that most Australians don't obtain a "Schengen visa" on arrival. Australians (and many other nationalities) can stay in the Schengen Area as tourists for 90 out of every 180 days without a visa. A Schengen Visa is required if you're from certain countries other than Australia or travelling for a reason other than tourism/business/etc.

Just for reference, as Australians, we can stay an additional 90 days in France after our initial 90 days in the Schengen area. Only in the one country, however. This is because we have a bilateral agreement with France, and a few other Schengen countries.

Edit: Yeah, nah. Sorry, I was wrong, France isn't one of them.

I'm not sure about France, but Germany is one country that definitely allows this. I don't think it will help JV though, unfortunately.

(There's some info about this in an article that I wrote elsewhere - How Australians Can Stay in Germany For 90 Extra Days)

 

[Jacques Vert]

Just want to clarify for the avoidance of confusion that most Australians don't obtain a "Schengen visa" on arrival. Australians (and many other nationalities) can stay in the Schengen Area as tourists for 90 out of every 180 days without a visa. A Schengen Visa is required if you're from certain countries other than Australia or travelling for a reason other than tourism/business/etc.

Fair call.

 

[ZigZagWanderer]

Interesting.
Unfortunately the links to Italy and Spain respectively don't provide any more details of how this works!

Yes, the details are sometimes vague. It's a problem for Schengen because they have a blanket rule, but individual states have previous agreements that they still honour. It's a bit of a bureaucratic mess.

Basically, it's typically that you can stay an extra 90 days in that particular country, but not to go to any other Schengen country. The time you are allowed in the Schengen area then 'resets' so you need to be out for 90 days before returning.

Also, you normally need to actually ask permission from somewhere. Unfortunately, I suspect that many officials won't know about the rules. I just manage it by going to Europe for 85 days on my UK passport, visit the UK for a month, then go back to Italy on my Australian passport, leaving for Australia directly from there. I don't think the Italian immigration cares, anyway.

 

[Jacques Vert]

I'm not sure about France, but Germany is one country that definitely allows this. I don't think it will help JV though, unfortunately.

(There's some info about this in an article that I wrote elsewhere - How Australians Can Stay in Germany For 90 Extra Days)

Hey Matt,

Have you ever tested, or have personal experience of, the Bilateral and Visa Waiver Agreement with Austria?

 

[Mattg]

Hey Matt,

Have you ever tested, or have personal experience of, the Bilateral and Visa Waiver Agreement with Austria?

To be honest, I'd never heard of it before. However, the Austrian embassy in Canberra has published some information on this agreement and it does seem to still be in force.

https://www.bmeia.gv.at/fileadmin/user_upload/Vertretungen/Canberra/Austria_Australia_Bilateral_Agreement_on_Visa_Free_Short_Stays_-_Fact_sheet.pdf

It looks pretty similar to the German agreement, although I can't say with any certainty whether the Austrian border officials would be any more or less familiar with it. (The German border police generally seem to know of the existence of the Germany-Australia agreement without any issues.)

 

[Amanad78]

I just manage it by going to Europe for 85 days on my UK passport, visit the UK for a month, then go back to Italy on my Australian passport, leaving for Australia directly from there.

I never even thought of doing that with my 2 passports. Very good! Means my kids can also do that when they want to go backpacking.

 

[Jacques Vert]

To be honest, I'd never heard of it before. However, the Austrian embassy in Canberra has published some information on this agreement and it does seem to still be in force.

https://www.bmeia.gv.at/fileadmin/user_upload/Vertretungen/Canberra/Austria_Australia_Bilateral_Agreement_on_Visa_Free_Short_Stays_-_Fact_sheet.pdf

It looks pretty similar to the German agreement, although I can't say with any certainty whether the Austrian border officials would be any more or less familiar with it. (The German border police generally seem to know of the existence of the Germany-Australia agreement without any issues.)

Thanks for the fact sheet Matt. We have a friend who flys to Austria every year to visit her son who lives in Salzburg and would like to stay longer than 90 days. She could possibly get a family reunion type visa but initial enquiries suggest there will be lots of bureaucracy to negotiate. The Visa Waiver agreement may be a more efficient process for her.

Thanks again.

 

[Jacques Vert]

For a bit of background, +1 & I are looking to travel to Europe for 6 to 12 months starting in July this year (2023). We have one-way tickets booked and intend to spend most of our time, at least for the first six months, in France.

Well, due to some unexpected medical issues, we have postponed our big Europe adventure. We now depart Australia in June 2024.

Time to start planning some of the detail.

 

[Jacques Vert]

Well, due to some unexpected medical issues, we have postponed our big Europe adventure. We now depart Australia in June 2024.

Time to start planning some of the detail.

So the time arrived for us to apply for our Visas. I've previously successfully applied for visas for Russia, Cuba, Vietnam, China and India; all without any major issues, although they were for short-term tourist visas. However, this time we are applying for a long-stay tourist visa...what a nightmare. Following are some comments to assist anyone else applying for a long-stay Visa; these are general comments based on my experience and are not intended to be a technical discussion, nor can I guarantee that everything is 100% correct.

Firstly, if you wish to visit countries in the Schengen area, you are allowed 90 days out of 180, counting backwards. It's a little more complicated than it appears at first but, as a simple example, if you haven't been in a Schengen country in the past 180 days then you can stay for 90 days before needing to leave and travel to a non-Schengen country. Of course, there are some exceptions as noted in some of the previous posts in this thread. If you want to stay longer than 90 days you need to apply for a long-stay visa and you are supposed to apply to the country where you are intending to spend the majority of your stay. You also need to apply in your home country as I understand it, although there are suggestions on some parts of the website that this may not be the case; it is not clear and this is a major part of the problem: very little on the website is clear!

Secondly. for a long-stay visa, you cannot apply until three months before your arrival date which restricts your ability to plan and book accommodation, etc. as you don't know whether your application will be successful. You also need to book an appointment for an interview but you can't book the appointment until you have submitted your application online (the appointment and interview are done through VFS Global). So, in our case, we applied online exactly three months before the date of our arrival in France and then attempted to book an appointment. We had to set up an account so we could login and book, and they send an email to activate your account; mine arrived but +1's never came. I tried to log in but the system wouldn't let me. I tried various things, changed passwords, changed IP addresses, cleared cookies, etc.; I even went and sat outside Hungry Jack's to log in through their address but no luck. All I managed to do is to have my account locked!

So the next step was to call their hotline number; an Australian number which diverts to one of VFS Global's call centres in the Philippines or India. (I now know what happens to those applicants who miss out on working in the Qantas call centres). The agents' accents were so strong that it was almost impossible to understand a word they said so after the 4th call I sent an email. We submitted our online application on 20/3 but by the time we were both able to log in, all the appointments for the remainder of March and April were taken, and appointments for May had not been released.

More phone calls and emails and we were eventually told that appointment times for May would be released on the 15th of April and to try and book then (of course, as we are due to arrive at CDG on 20/6, timing was becoming an issue). Of course, in typical o/s call centre fashion, this advice was incorrect; the appointments for May were released around 8/4 (and by 15/4 all were booked). Luckily we had checked regularly and noticed the release and were able to grab two appointments; in fact, +1's appointment is on 26/4 and mine is on 3/5. More on the appointment process to follow...

 

[FlyingFiona]

(I now know what happens to those applicants who miss out on working in the Qantas call centres).

More seriously, what a nightmare! I'm even more grateful I have EU citizenship now. Hope the rest is plainer sailing for you.