Frequent Flyer Program Revamp

[ioki]

But I wonder how many points "any seat" will cost?

just finished watching CNBC's "inside AA a week in the life" and it mentions how AA has recently introduced a redeem for any seat anytime, however it'll cost double the miles.. will QF go the same path?

btw, if anyone is interested in watching segment, whim me and i'll either put it up as a torrent or provide a secure file transfer method for download etc.

the size of file is around ~400MB and show runs for 1.5 hours

 

[simongr]

IIRC previous invites to complete a survey were sent out over a period of a few days, so don't rule yourself out as yet.

I'm not sure I'll be invited again, I made some comments about why I avoid using Jetstar wherever possible that they may not have wanted to hear.

Just completing the survey and got to the question "you could earn 1 point on QF but 6 points/dollar on JQ." WTF? Its a QF program damnit - thank god I am in AA

Survey then crashed so I dumped it

 

[d15.in.oz]

This email is going out "group-wide"... JQ customers are getting them as well!

Dear d15.in.oz,
We at Jetstar would greatly appreciate your assistance, as a valued Qantas Group customer, by filling out the attached survey to determine what your thoughts are on the Qantas Frequent Flyer program...

These are not changes that will definitely be made to the program; rather we want to get feedback from all Qantas Group flyers to help develop the program so that it suits the changing needs of all kinds of Qantas flyers. The Qantas Group takes the results very seriously and will use them to drive improvements.

 

[jakeseven7]

I got the Jetstar one as well but not Qantas (kind of funny since I've only flown Jetstar about 8 times / Qantas... hundreds lol)

Anyway, I have heard around that they are looking to pump out these changes quite quickly - and they will form a part of the counter attack on Tiger (I mean the new Jetstar cheapest fare deal is a GREAT offer - my sister has already used it twice!) giving people another reason to fly both QF and JQ I guess.

I reckon with all the fall out from the failed takeover, QF will be looking to do something good - not change for changes sake so I'm quietly optimistic about some changes for the better.

 

[oz_mark]

Qantas have flagged before that they intend to grow the program. Did these surveys give much indication of how they might go about doing that?

The 6 points per $ thing is interesting from Jetstar, just wonder what they will do with SC earn f they do go down this path? (Hmm, and I wonder where the idea for 6 points per $ came from?)

Certainly looks that Tiger has shaken them a bit, and it will be good if Tiger can inject a bit of life back into the market rather than the cosy arrangements we seem to have got back to of late.

 

[littl_flier]

The 6 points per $ thing is interesting from Jetstar, just wonder what they will do with SC earn f they do go down this path? (Hmm, and I wonder where the idea for 6 points per $ came from?)

I can only presume that the 6 points per $ is based on DJ earning for Velocity. Definitely an interesting concept. eg. The BNE-BKK jetsaver fares are $1200 return, generating 7200 points, just slightly less than those flying a JetFlex. Surely if this is the case, they would offer the points, but you would only earn SC's on JetFlex or Star Class. :?:

 

[oz_mark]

I can only presume that the 6 points per $ is based on DJ earning for Velocity. Definitely an interesting concept. eg. The BNE-BKK jetsaver fares are $1200 return, generating 7200 points, just slightly less than those flying a JetFlex. Surely if this is the case, they would offer the points, but you would only earn SC's on JetFlex or Star Class. :?:

At one point it was flagged that Jetstar might create its own FF program, but none of what I read about this survey seems to indicate that this is in their current thinking. Was there any indication of this, or were they just getting feedback on different ways of working out how many points should go to the QFF program?

Will be interesting to see how Tiger fares without a FF program...

 

[Reggie]

The survey asked for a rating to be given (1 to 10) for 10 different types of frequent flyer scheme. They made it very clear these are purely idea's and are definitely not proposals.

Different options for Jetstar earn included, points for $, every 10th flight free, points as per current.

There were options for earning points at supermarkets, department stores, clothing stores, electrical stores. They were quite specific with store brands. Such a scheme seems more likely to include coles rather than woolies, DJ's over others, clothes shops like jeans west, just jeans. Also earning points at petrol stations.

Redeeming options included shopping vouchers and/or gifts from the previously mentioned retailers.

Options for free joining or the current pay to join.

And as mentioned in their board release, any seat options on QF and JQ, but limited seat options on one world.

The survey was extremely long and the options were very similiar and then changed it around a bit later and gave 4 other option types, almost like a correlation to previous answers. So it is very hard to remember exactly what had been asked throughout the survey.

Hope this helps.

 

[oz_mark]

The survey asked for a rating to be given (1 to 10) for 10 different types of frequent flyer scheme. They made it very clear these are purely idea's and are definitely not proposals.

As would be expected from a market research survey. Get a feel for where you should focus your energies if you need to prioritise, understand what the market wants and so on,

Different options for Jetstar earn included, points for $, every 10th flight free, points as per current.

Hmm, wonder what people would go for. I thing the every tenth flight one would probably come with caveats around how long the free flight could be

There were options for earning points at supermarkets, department stores, clothing stores, electrical stores. They were quite specific with store brands. Such a scheme seems more likely to include coles rather than woolies, DJ's over others, clothes shops like jeans west, just jeans. Also earning points at petrol stations.

Not sure there is much point in getting hung up on which particular supermarket they go with - realistically there are only a few possibilities. Given woolies is not really connected to a loyalty program at the moment (since the demise of ezybank), I would have thought them more likely. But, they have never really embraced the loyalty concept.

Redeeming options included shopping vouchers and/or gifts from the previously mentioned retailers.

Depending on the burn rates, might be good, might be bad.

Options for free joining or the current pay to join.

Not that it would make much difference to me any more! If they link into supermarkets, department stores and petrol stations I dare say it would be easier to get more to sign up if it were free.

And as mentioned in their board release, any seat options on QF and JQ, but limited seat options on one world.

The survey was extremely long and the options were very similiar and then changed it around a bit later and gave 4 other option types, almost like a correlation to previous answers. So it is very hard to remember exactly what had been asked throughout the survey.

Hope this helps.

Yep, thanks. An ineresting surevy by the sound of it.

 

[d15.in.oz]

Yep, thanks. An ineresting surevy by the sound of it.

...Actually, very long... And frankly, the only thing I think they learnt from me, was that I like the idea of DJ joining Star Alliance. (Oh, and also that the lack of "rewarding my QAN group loyalty" when flying on JQ Jet Saver has annoyed me.) They are nowhere near understanding what I want from a Frequent Flyer program.

Anyway, just for you oz_mark, as you seem so interested, I copied and pasted the whole bloody thing, if you really want to read it. Beware it's a huge word file! And it is not neatly formatted…

Box.net - Free Online File Storage, Internet File Sharing, RSS Sharing, Access Documents & Files Anywhere, Backup Data, Share Files

 

[Keith009]

I must admit that I have burnt about 200,000 points in the past 8 months or so on J upgrades (LAX-MEL, MEL-HKG-MEL) as well as some whY awards between MEL and BNE, so cannot really fault availability either.

I've had no problems using my AA miles to redeem flights on QF either. Given that they come out of the same inventory, and QFF members would have access to the seats earlier than the rest of oneworld, I don't really see inventory as an issue.

 

[simongr]

I've had no problems using my AA miles to redeem flights on QF either. Given that they come out of the same inventory, and QFF members would have access to the seats earlier than the rest of oneworld, I don't really see inventory as an issue.

How many premium routes in J/F have you requested out of interest?

Not meaning to be critical but I guess that's what people are thinking about.

 

[Keith009]

How many premium routes in J/F have you requested out of interest?

Mainly MEL-SIN and MEL-LHR. All U in a comination of QF and BA. And I just ticketed MEL-HKG-NRT QF/CX in U for Jan 2008 3 weeks ago - QF29-CX504, got both flights on the exact dates I wanted even though it's quite late by my standards to be booking award flights.

I don't always get seats right away - but never had to move my date of travel much. And if I already know my dates I'd ring up at the 330 day mark.

It does sound like QF only releases one U seat on the LHR flights because each time I call up and if there's availability - the AAgent goes 'oh you're very lucky there's 1 seat available.'

Almost impossible to get CX for long haul though.

 

[munitalP]

I like the idea for a buy any seat program however, being the wanker platinum that I am, I would also like to see x number of seats on any flight dedicated to each class of FF up until say 30min's of departure. Fare class should not matter using this pecking order then at the 30 min mark, first in best dressed. That levels the playing field for all - xx_ seats for Platinum, XX for Gold and X for Silver.

Also the class of ticket (except non upgradable internet fares) should not matter towards OPUPS. THe status of the flyer should be of the upmost concern for the OPUP - annoy enough preimum customers flying on lower class fares and they don't stay premium customers for very long. As far as I'm concerned, a platinum flyer on a low cost fare should get an OPUP over a silver flyer on the highest cost economy everytime.

There are those of us who do spend a lot of the time in the air in these cheaper seats and should be looked after better.

If Qantas revamps the FF scheme, all I can hope is that premium customers don't get treated any worse than what they do now. A preimum customer is not always the F or J seated customer either.

I would also say to Qantas, you have mucked the FF scheme around so much in the last few years that leaving well enough alone would be good. I for one will start looking at the AA scheme before too long if QF don't start doing right by me.

:idea:

 

[serfty]

Revamp from Mid 2008

Received a newsletter for "The Business Traveler" from Qantas.

One part read:

From mid 2008 exciting new benefits are planned, including increased seat availability for when you want to fly with our new Any Seat Awards. We're also planning to expand our extensive family of partners and our reward range, so you'll be able to earn and redeem points in a variety of new ways.

Given this part of the Terms & Conditions:

3.2 Qantas will use best efforts to advise Members of material changes to these Terms and Conditions and, where such changes will limit Benefits:
(a) where the Benefit is provided by Qantas, to give Members at least 6 months' notice;
(b) where the Benefit is provided by a third party, where possible give Members at least 30 days' notice.

So expect an announcement six months earlier; I guess any time from November.

 

[simongr]

Also the class of ticket (except non upgradable internet fares) should not matter towards OPUPS. THe status of the flyer should be of the upmost concern for the OPUP - annoy enough preimum customers flying on lower class fares and they don't stay premium customers for very long. As far as I'm concerned, a platinum flyer on a low cost fare should get an OPUP over a silver flyer on the highest cost economy everytime.

There are those of us who do spend a lot of the time in the air in these cheaper seats and should be looked after better.

Not sure I agree with you from a business perspective - the flier that is more valuable to the airline is the person paying the higher fare surely? Sue you may fly a lot and deliver more sales revenue to the business but your contributin to the bottom line could be less than the silver flier.

In fact high fare silver fliers are probably very profitable - they dont provide lounge access and significant extra weight allowances so they could be making a motza on them...

 

[NM]

Re: Revamp from Mid 2008

So expect an announcement six months earlier; I guess any time from November.

That is exactly the notice provided before the changes that took effect in May 2005.

 

[Alanslegal]

As far as I'm concerned, a platinum flyer on a low cost fare should get an OPUP over a silver flyer on the highest cost economy everytime.:idea:

My logic would be for QF to opup the PS in order to keep the "carrot dangling in front of the PS" and keep his / her loyalty.... whereas a WP has already that assumed loyalty in reaching WP level and no need for any further 'carrot dangling'.

Further, if only rewarding based on status, I assume WPs may book cheaper fairs knowing that they would be op-up at the 1st instance, and if this did not work, a request for upgrade using points and based on status would probably get it too?

 

[munitalP]

My logic would be for QF to opup the PS in order to keep the "carrot dangling in front of the PS" and keep his / her loyalty....

Loyalty should be to the Platinum flyers! We are the ones who spend the money! Just because one has already reached Platinum status does not mean that Qantas should then wash their hands of us and concentrate their efforts on silver flyers. This month alone I would have achieved silver status and then some. All of my destinations except Armidale in country NSW are serviced by more than one airline so who should Qantas be "being loyal" to, old mate who flies 8 - 10 times a year and gets a silver card or me who at times flies 8 - 10 times a week? I have a choice and Qantas knows that, hell, even the pilots remind us of that every now and again.

Loyalty to your most frequent flyers is the only way it can be. My other half will get comp Gold in a few weeks time - she deserve's the loyalty more than the silver flyer due to her hubby spending 8-9 months of the year away from home sleeping in hotels...:evil:

 

[serfty]

Not sure I agree with you from a business perspective - the flier that is more valuable to the airline is the person paying the higher fare surely? Sue you may fly a lot and deliver more sales revenue to the business but your contributin to the bottom line could be less than the silver flier.

In fact high fare silver fliers are probably very profitable - they dont provide lounge access and significant extra weight allowances so they could be making a motza on them...

Whether it makes Business sense or not, Qantas generally appear to use Status in determining op-op priority.

I'm not even sure the people at the gates can see the fare paid, if so it may be with some difficulty. (Consider someone on a LLONE4.)

My last "hen's tooth" op-up came earlier this year on a NZD199 Q-class AKL-BNE flight - certainly it was my WP status that was the determining factor.