Galleries access... NOT quite 'reinstated'?

[Scarlett]

Hello folks, long time lurker, but can finally add some info:

QP access to Terraces lounges in the UK definitely still remains. I have accessed the NCL Terraces twice this year with QP card with no problem, but have been turned away from the Galleries lounges in LHR T5.

Also, for those conspiracy theorists out there, the rebranding of BA lounges from Terraces to Galleries isn't just a name change. The product on offer in Galleries is vastly superior. In Terraces there are basic snacks available only (coffee, biscuits, some apples, chips...sorry 'crisps'! and pre-packaged cake) but nothing substantial. There is also a fairly basic bar. However in Galleries (when I used to be able to access them) there is proper hot food (such as a really delicious chicken korma in the T5 South lounge); a wider selection of drinks and newer chairs / fittings.

Next time I'm in back in the UK I'll hopefully be SG / OWS so the issue won't affect me like it does now.

 

[medhead]

So many arguing about the T&C. Perhaps it might be worth actually reading them. The issue here is not changing the terms! The T&C clearly say refunds are available if qantas makes certain, defined changes. The issue is that qantas hasn't made this change to lounge access.


Sent from the Throne (80% chance) using Aust Freq Fly app

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So many arguing about the T&C. Perhaps it might be worth actually reading them. The issue here is not changing the terms! The T&C clearly say refunds are available if qantas makes certain, defined changes. The issue is that qantas hasn't made this change to lounge access.


Sent from the Throne (80% chance) using Aust Freq Fly app

But the Ts and Cs do talk about any changes to club rules which substantially change the intended benefits. In this case, lounge access to BA is substantially changed, whether this is because BA changed their interpretation of access, or because Galleries are not included, or because the current contract for access to BA lounges ceased and was not renegotiated. The very basic elements were lounge access in australia, when flying AA, and when flying BA + priority check-in and extra baggage. One element has now substantially changed - that of BA access.

You have to look at what was offered (access to every BA owned lounge when flying BA) to what is offered now (access to half a dozen lounges still branded as Terraces or Exec Club). I would think this comes under the relevant clause.

Anyway - it seems that is a moot point as it has been reported that QF is offering refunds.

As for the communication to members of any changes... still waiting 5 months on...

 

[medhead]

But the Ts and Cs do talk about any changes to club rules which substantially change the intended benefits. In this case, lounge access to BA is substantially changed, whether this is because BA changed their interpretation of access, or because Galleries are not included, or because the current contract for access to BA lounges ceased and was not renegotiated. The very basic elements were lounge access in australia, when flying AA, and when flying BA + priority check-in and extra baggage. One element has now substantially changed - that of BA access.

You have to look at what was offered (access to every BA owned lounge when flying BA) to what is offered now (access to half a dozen lounges still branded as Terraces or Exec Club). I would think this comes under the relevant clause.

Anyway - it seems that is a moot point as it has been reported that QF is offering refunds.

As for the communication to members of any changes... still waiting 5 months on...

That is specific what I was referring to, so no idea why you started with a "but". In any case, refund is available as mentioned, if the change is made by Qantas. That is exactly the out that qantas have reportedly used to no give refunds due to this change, as it was BA that made the change.


Sent from the Throne (80% chance) using Aust Freq Fly app

 

[MEL_Traveller]

That is specific what I was referring to, so no idea why you started with a "but". In any case, refund is available as mentioned, if the change is made by Qantas. That is exactly the out that qantas have reportedly used to no give refunds due to this change, as it was BA that made the change.


Sent from the Throne (80% chance) using Aust Freq Fly app

Qantas Club T&C:

4.4 If Qantas closes a Qantas operated airport lounge in a Member's registered city of residence without replacing it, or amends these Terms and Conditions or the Club Rules in a way that deprives the Member substantially of the intended use of the membership, the Member will have the option of cancelling their membership and receiving a pro rata refund of the membership fee for the remaining period of membership.
​

Even though the change may be caused by BA, Qantas will have to amend the terms and conditions and formally remove the benefit. Therefore the change to the terms and conditions is made by qantas (it physically has to do it). Therefore the option should apply.

 

[medhead]

Qnatss Club T&C:

4.4 If Qantas closes a Qantas operated airport lounge in a Member's registered city of residence without replacing it, or amends these Terms and Conditions or the Club Rules in a way that deprives the Member substantially of the intended use of the membership, the Member will have the option of cancelling their membership and receiving a pro rata refund of the membership fee for the remaining period of membership.
​

Even though the change may be caused by BA, Qantas will have to amend the terms and conditions and formally remove the benefit. Therefore the change to the terms and conditions is made by qantas (it physically has to do it). Therefore the option should apply.

Qantas doesn't have to change anything. Access was provided to X BA lounge (X because I can't remember the name right now) that access is still available. Just that BA is closing all the X lounges so there are none available to access. This situation does not involve a change to anything, even if it is a significant reduction.


Sent from the Throne (80% chance) using Aust Freq Fly app

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Qantas doesn't have to change anything. Access was provided to X BA lounge (X because I can't remember the name right now) that access is still available. Just that BA is closing all the X lounges so there are none available to access. This situation does not involve a change to anything, even if it is a significant reduction.


Sent from the Throne (80% chance) using Aust Freq Fly app

I see where you are coming from... however when looking at the benefit, you are not looking at the name of the lounge. You are looking at the concept. Previously QF members were offered access to BA lounges when flying BA. That is the benefit - a lounge.

The lounge is no longer available. Looking at the names is a bit of a red herring.

If someone were to ask a current average QP member about lounge access, they would simply say 'I get access when I fly Qantas', they wouldn't indicudually list the benefits to be Qantas Club, International Business Lounge and Regional Lounges.

That aside, I just looked up the lounge benefits on the QF page - now it simply says (apologies if this has already been mentioned):

Partner LoungesWhen travelling with American Airlines, as a Qantas Club member you and a guest are welcome at American Airlines Admirals Club lounges. Simply present your Qantas Club card together with your boarding pass at the lounge reception. Both you and your guest need to be travelling together further that day on a flight marketed^ and operated by the partner airline whose lounge you wish to visit.

​

​

So any mention of BA has now gone completely. Not even a reference to Terraces or Executive.

Where was the reasonable steps to notify members of this change? ​

 

[ReLoad]

I think you can forget all the legal speak, the reading of T&C etc.

It comes down to basic customer service, which in this instance has been very poor, people had something, it was taken away (rightly or wrongly) they were not notified of it prior, just turned up and said, terribly sorry no more.

It can easily be solved by Qantas by having an official position which may involve refunds or whateer, by not acting or communicating in any way is making the problem much worse.

 

[Danger]

That aside, I just looked up the lounge benefits on the QF page - now it simply says (apologies if this has already been mentioned):

Partner LoungesWhen travelling with American Airlines, as a Qantas Club member you and a guest are welcome at American Airlines Admirals Club lounges. Simply present your Qantas Club card together with your boarding pass at the lounge reception. Both you and your guest need to be travelling together further that day on a flight marketed^ and operated by the partner airline whose lounge you wish to visit.

​

So any mention of BA has now gone completely. Not even a reference to Terraces or Executive.

Where was the reasonable steps to notify members of this change? ​

WOW. I'm flabbergasted. Truly floored.

This clearly suggests Qantas Club members have now lost access to all BA lounges, regardless of their name. (The footnote ^, however, does seem to indicate BA lounge access when travelling on a BA-operated flight with a QF flight number.)

The Qantas Frequent Flyer monthly email is due out this week. It will be very interesting if anything is communicated.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Over on FT someone has posted that it looks like T3 access is still available with QF/BA flight number.

Regardless of FF newsletter coming out, QF specifically say they will notify members in advance (and if you can update your website then you can send out an email).

This one just seems to have come out of the blue (aside from those who read FT or AFF of course)

And no notification from our company rep on this (although I guess they would owe a duty to the wider membership before AFF).

 

[markis10]

T3 is listed in the lounge section which has a new look.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Just thinking about how the communication might come across?

Dear member

Our partner is introducing upgraded lounge facilities across their network. We appreciate this rebranding has caused some confusion for Club members over their entitlement to access lounges.

We are pleased to say that in response to member feedback, we have now streamlined access rules. Effective immediately, members will no longer be able to access lounges on the basis of Club membership, except for special arrangements prior to selected flights~~#***^ from Terminal 3.

We hope you're as excited as we are about these new, simple to remember rules. Please see our brand new look [thanks Markis10] lounge access section for details.

just kidding....

 

[medhead]

I see where you are coming from... however when looking at the benefit, you are not looking at the name of the lounge. You are looking at the concept. Previously QF members were offered access to BA lounges when flying BA. That is the benefit - a lounge.

The lounge is no longer available. Looking at the names is a bit of a red herring.

No matter how much I agree it is a red herring; the fact remains that BA excluded access on the basis of the name and ignored the concept. The info you quote below changes all that.

That aside, I just looked up the lounge benefits on the QF page - now it simply says (apologies if this has already been mentioned):

Partner LoungesWhen travelling with American Airlines, as a Qantas Club member you and a guest are welcome at American Airlines Admirals Club lounges. Simply present your Qantas Club card together with your boarding pass at the lounge reception. Both you and your guest need to be travelling together further that day on a flight marketed^ and operated by the partner airline whose lounge you wish to visit.

​

So any mention of BA has now gone completely. Not even a reference to Terraces or Executive.

Where was the reasonable steps to notify members of this change? ​

Notification of the change is one thing, and a bit of a separate issue. Now that the conditions have been officially changed, notified or not, IMO it is time to ask for the refunds on membership. Until that change wsas made we were all in limbo.

 

[ajw373]

So does mean the bit about being able to use T5, if flying on a QF/BA flight from Asia to T3 and then immediately transferring across to T5 for a European flight with BA has gone? I tried the link to BA on the first page of this thread and the page isn't there anymore. I wish it wouldn't keep changing every 5 minutes - it is worse than the Australian tax rules for Super! Dr FM wants to book a flight from SYD to LHR transferring to T5 and then flying to Istanbul with BA. I told her she would be able to use T5 before the Istanbul leg and T3 before flying back to Aus. Now it looks like just T3? She is PS and QP life.

It does indeed look like that is the case. As for the rules changing every 5 minutes if you look at the post #45 in this thread it was clearly stated that they were interim meassures whilst discussions continued. Seems like said discussions have now concluded with access now only being on Qantas flights out of T3.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

As for cashing out remaining balances (and continuing with QF club) I guess for me it's whether or not I plan to use AA lounges. Their annual membership is quite high compared to QF. They do come in handy when doing mileage runs, but then I guess I would get status through that anyway (if I ever want it again).

once I give up my QF Club, I'd probably go over to Virgin.

 

[simongr]

Interesting just re-reading the LHR T3 access page I think the info is incorrect:

International Business
Next onward flight that day must be a Qantas or British Airways flight. One guest permitted if travelling on a Qantas operated and marketed flight.^
No guest permitted if travelling on British Airways.

As an int'l biz class customer I thought you had access to whatever J lounge you wanted?

 

[Fruitcake]

Interesting just re-reading the LHR T3 access page I think the info is incorrect:

International Business
Next onward flight that day must be a Qantas or British Airways flight. One guest permitted if travelling on a Qantas operated and marketed flight.^
No guest permitted if travelling on British Airways.

As an int'l biz class customer I thought you had access to whatever J lounge you wanted?

There was a oneworld rule change late last year - class of travel lounge access is now limited to the carrier's own facilities. Tier access still applies to lounges from any oneworld carrier though.

oneworld cuts cross-airline lounge access for business, first class - Flights | hotels | frequent flyer | business class - Australian Business Traveller

 

[simongr]

My mistake - apologies for that.

 

[moa999]

simongr - used to.
Latest changes mean pure Business pax have no COS benefits, just a designated lounge.
only oneworld elites have open access.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

There was a oneworld rule change late last year - class of travel lounge access is now limited to the carrier's own facilities. Tier access still applies to lounges from any oneworld carrier though.

oneworld cuts cross-airline lounge access for business, first class - Flights | hotels | frequent flyer | business class - Australian Business Traveller

Oh - that does make a difference. Having to use the QF F lounge at Hong Kong sucks.