Guaranteed Family Point Redemption - word of caution

[Deleted member 29185]

Seems I was finally able to use one of VAs additional benefits on a reward booking from MLE-SIN.

My preferred date (check-out day from Conrad) was not available for a reward booking so cleverly, I requested to invoke my guaranteed family reward booking. The lady then checked the T&Cs and came up with a few I was unaware of. They are:

1. Booking must be outside a six month window from date of travel (AOK...I knew that and complied)
2. Booking for max 4 pax (AOK....I knew that and complied)
3. Booking is for a return (I only wanted one way, but still OK as I didn't mind forfeiting the benefit of the other sector)
4. There must be no other available reward flights, 3 days either side of preferred date shock: didn't know that one, but the lady checked and there were no reward flights 3 days either side, phewww saved I thought)
5. As VA only do codeshare, to make the so-called guaranteed booking, the "fees and taxes" on a guaranteed booking skyrocket! The point redemption for the tix remains at 60000 points (20K/pax) but the fees and taxes are suddenly $2365.10 which I'm then told cannot be paid cash, but must be paid with points, or an additional 295 600 points :evil:.

Well done VA. You bring in benefits which sound like they actually offer something, but then shaft us with the fine print (which I still haven't been able to find in the T&Cs).

Poor form in my books. I held off booking these flights as I was O/S and rather than spending a heap on int. phone calls, I just left it a few weeks thinking I had the protection regardless. So beware anyone thinking a guaranteed redemption booking means you'll get it. Not always it seems.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Just an update on this, I just checked a cash purchase directly with SQ and it's US$1240.50.

Some benefit VA :evil:. Just goes to show me, in what utter contempt VA hold their status clients.

 

[anat0l]

I would have asked why the fees and taxes came to $2365.10 to be honest, i.e. get a breakdown. That sounds ridiculously excessive, unless for some reason the cost of the redemption is now equal to an Any Seat award, which I don't believe is the idea of the benefit as given in Clause 17 of the T&Cs (it is Reward seats). Even if they gave you SQ's fuel surcharges (and they shouldn't), that's still far too high.

Also would have tried another agent or called a supervisor.

I suppose if they didn't see nil Reward availability on 3 days either side, they would've just said to you, "there, use your points for this date because there is availability", which in a sense nullifies the point of the benefit. (The benefit requires you to be flexible on 3 days either side of a given date, when the call centre can select any date in this 7 day window for your benefit booking).

Looks like you "got" the booking, but hell with the co-pay, I can't understand it. And since when have they ever had to force people to pay that co-pay in points rather than in cash?

The direct SQ cash price looks rather reasonable.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

The direct SQ cash price looks rather reasonable.

I thought that as well. I also did a Skyscanner search and for less than tax/fee component with VA/SQ, the three of us can fly J with a choice of airlines (not sure of the product value though) like MH, UL, EK and UL combo, KE and UL combo, and for only about an extra AU$800, on SQ! Why would I waste points like that to fly Y?

The cheapest Y through Skyscanner is UL @ AU$882 for the 3 of us!

The VA guarantee beggars belief!

 

[Velocity Frequent Flyer]

Hi swanning_it,

I'm sorry to read of your disappointment. This benefit is valid for flights departing Australia for Australian-based Velocity Platinum members or New Zealand for New Zealand based Platinum members. As the flight you're referring to is from the Maldives to Singapore, it's not eligible. Here is the relevant clause:

17.3.1 VRPL guarantees that Platinum Members can make one booking for up to four guests on:
(a) Virgin Australia domestic Economy Reward Class return flights; or
(b) Economy Reward Class return flights departing from Australia (or from New Zealand if the Platinum Member is a New Zealand based Member) to any international destination to which the Virgin Australia or an Airline Partner flies;

Again, I'm sorry you're disappointed and hope you'll be able to find a suitable travel option so you can take advantage of this benefit.

 

[notzac]

Hi swanning_it,

I'm sorry to read of your disappointment....

The way I read it was that the disappointment was in the calculation of the fees and taxes, rather than where the fare departed from..

 

[anat0l]

Now that I re-read the T&Cs as VFF has highlighted, that does put swanning_it in the drink over this (i.e. origin).

So the prices quoted by the agent that were so exorbitant must have been Any Seat redemptions (as there were no Reward seats remaining).

Still doesn't make sense why the co-pay could not be paid in cash and must be paid in points. Although of course not many people are mad enough to part with that many points and that much money for 3 tickets from the Maldives, unless they were pinned against the wall (but in this case, the cash price is more than satisfactory).

 

[dandandan]

Is it definitely Maldives and not a typo of Melbourne?

Hi swanning_it,

I'm sorry to read of your disappointment. This benefit is valid for flights departing Australia for Australian-based Velocity Platinum members or New Zealand for New Zealand based Platinum members. As the flight you're referring to is from the Maldives to Singapore, it's not eligible. Here is the relevant clause:

17.3.1 VRPL guarantees that Platinum Members can make one booking for up to four guests on:
(a) Virgin Australia domestic Economy Reward Class return flights; or
(b) Economy Reward Class return flights departing from Australia (or from New Zealand if the Platinum Member is a New Zealand based Member) to any international destination to which the Virgin Australia or an Airline Partner flies;

Again, I'm sorry you're disappointed and hope you'll be able to find a suitable travel option so you can take advantage of this benefit.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Is it definitely Maldives and not a typo of Melbourne?

Holiday of a life time decision.... Maldives or Melbourne, Maldives or Melbourne, Maldives or Melbourne, have to flip a coin here it's so close.......oh look at that, Maldives it is!

 

[anat0l]

Is it definitely Maldives and not a typo of Melbourne?

No, Maldives - I'm sure that's what swanning_it meant (there's no Conrad in Melbourne, and I think I know what kind of trip swanning_it is referring to)

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Hi swanning_it,

I'm sorry to read of your disappointment. This benefit is valid for flights departing Australia for Australian-based Velocity Platinum members or New Zealand for New Zealand based Platinum members......
........Again, I'm sorry you're disappointed and hope you'll be able to find a suitable travel option so you can take advantage of this benefit.

Actually, I'm going out on a limb here and congratulate you. I took anat0ls advice and rung VFF again and ended up speaking to 7 people and you are the only one to pick that little issue. So well done.......but, I know this will astound you, but I am going to have a whine now.

On the VFF website, this is what is says about this benefit:

Guaranteed Economy Reward Seats for an annual family trip

• Gold members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any destination around Australia when flying with Virgin Australia.
• Platinum members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any domestic or international destination when flying with Virgin Australia or our international airline redemption partners.
• Reward Seats must be booked 6 months in advance (minimum Points redemption applies).

So where does it clearly state that it must be from Australia? Once again, VA assume all their status clients wish to spend all their waking hours reading the fine print. I don't! I expect to be able to be correctly informed up front and given so few people actually knew this little "gotcha", I'd say it needs to be clearer.

Oh and thank you VFF, I have found a suitable travel option to take advantage of this benefit, so for me it's all well that ends well.

 

[dandandan]

Not as clever as you say then;

"so cleverly, I requested to invoke my guaranteed family reward booking"

Holiday of a life time decision.... Maldives or Melbourne, Maldives or Melbourne, Maldives or Melbourne, have to flip a coin here it's so close.......oh look at that, Maldives it is!

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Not as clever as you say then;

"so cleverly, I requested to invoke my guaranteed family reward booking"

So true, I can't argue with that. My text should perhaps be reworded, to "foolishly, I assumed I could invoke my guaranteed family reward booking"....

 

[anat0l]

Didn't mean to send you on the goose chase I missed VFF's point, too.

So where does it clearly state that it must be from Australia? Once again, VA assume all their status clients wish to spend all their waking hours reading the fine print. I don't! I expect to be able to be correctly informed up front and given so few people actually knew this little "gotcha", I'd say it needs to be clearer.

Velocity T&Cs, Clause 17 as VFF pointed out. 17.3.1(b) says it's an Economy return reward flight from Australia (or NZ if you're a member based in NZ). It may be a bit vague in that regard as it doesn't explicitly say (to avoid any doubt) that the benefit in Clause 17 is not allowed for any other non-Australian origin.

Unfortunately T&Cs are a fact of life and the real devil in the detail is always found there. This applies to pretty much all airlines. Some airlines have no T&Cs to reflect this, and make it up as they go along (and leave us to nut out the heuristics and conditions).

 

[dandandan]

If you look under status benefits of each status and then family benefits it gives details of the benefit and then says;

For Terms and Conditions, click here.

Actually, I'm going out on a limb here and congratulate you. I took anat0ls advice and rung VFF again and ended up speaking to 7 people and you are the only one to pick that little issue. So well done.......but, I know this will astound you, but I am going to have a whine now.

On the VFF website, this is what is says about this benefit:

Guaranteed Economy Reward Seats for an annual family trip

• Gold members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any destination around Australia when flying with Virgin Australia.
• Platinum members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any domestic or international destination when flying with Virgin Australia or our international airline redemption partners.
• Reward Seats must be booked 6 months in advance (minimum Points redemption applies).

So where does it clearly state that it must be from Australia? Once again, VA assume all their status clients wish to spend all their waking hours reading the fine print. I don't! I expect to be able to be correctly informed up front and given so few people actually knew this little "gotcha", I'd say it needs to be clearer.

Oh and thank you VFF, I have found a suitable travel option to take advantage of this benefit, so for me it's all well that ends well.

 

[dandandan]

Is there a link for that part or does it have;For Terms and Conditions, click here, below the deatils you copy and pasted?

Actually, I'm going out on a limb here and congratulate you. I took anat0ls advice and rung VFF again and ended up speaking to 7 people and you are the only one to pick that little issue. So well done.......but, I know this will astound you, but I am going to have a whine now.

On the VFF website, this is what is says about this benefit:

Guaranteed Economy Reward Seats for an annual family trip

• Gold members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any destination around Australia when flying with Virgin Australia.
• Platinum members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any domestic or international destination when flying with Virgin Australia or our international airline redemption partners.
• Reward Seats must be booked 6 months in advance (minimum Points redemption applies).

So where does it clearly state that it must be from Australia? Once again, VA assume all their status clients wish to spend all their waking hours reading the fine print. I don't! I expect to be able to be correctly informed up front and given so few people actually knew this little "gotcha", I'd say it needs to be clearer.

Oh and thank you VFF, I have found a suitable travel option to take advantage of this benefit, so for me it's all well that ends well.

 

[bullerdude]

Actually, I'm going out on a limb here and congratulate you. I took anat0ls advice and rung VFF again and ended up speaking to 7 people and you are the only one to pick that little issue. So well done.......but, I know this will astound you, but I am going to have a whine now.

On the VFF website, this is what is says about this benefit:

Guaranteed Economy Reward Seats for an annual family trip

• Gold members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any destination around Australia when flying with Virgin Australia.
• Platinum members are guaranteed four return economy Reward Seats to any domestic or international destination when flying with Virgin Australia or our international airline redemption partners.
• Reward Seats must be booked 6 months in advance (minimum Points redemption applies).

So where does it clearly state that it must be from Australia? Once again, VA assume all their status clients wish to spend all their waking hours reading the fine print. I don't! I expect to be able to be correctly informed up front and given so few people actually knew this little "gotcha", I'd say it needs to be clearer.

Oh and thank you VFF, I have found a suitable travel option to take advantage of this benefit, so for me it's all well that ends well.

I think you have every right to complain as I think VA may be in breach of Australian consumer rights law.

As per the ACCC website:

Businesses are not allowed to make statements that are incorrect or likely to create a false impression.
This rule applies to their advertising, their product packaging, and any information provided to you by their staff or online shopping services.It also applies to any statements made by businesses in the media or online, such as testimonials on their websites or social media pages.

Also as per the ACCC website:

It is common practice for advertisements to include some information in fine print. This information must not contradict the overall message of the advertisement. For example, if an advertisement states that a product is ‘free’ but the fine print indicates some payment must be made, the advertisement is likely to be misleading.

As the advertised service (or benefit) in this case is substantially different (and YES i would argue that limiting the benefits to Australia deep in the T+C's is SUBSTANTIALLY different) I would say they are breaching of Australia Law.

Reference: False or misleading claims | ACCC

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I think you have every right to complain as I think VA may be in breach of Australian consumer rights law

It was not just me who was confused as well. I mentioned earlier that I spoke to 7 different people in a phone call that lasted 2 hours 10 minutes and the end result was that the redemption was made, I received the tix numbers, PNR and an email stating I had a CONFIRMED booking. It lasted all of 1/2 an hour before I received a call from VA stating my booking would be cancelled as I did not meet the T&Cs......coincidentally about the same time VFF posted that info here on AFF.

Poor form in anyones book I'd say.

 

[anat0l]

Incidentally, which call centre staff helped you "use" this benefit - the Australian or the Asian call centre?

 

[kevrosmith]

Subscribing to this thread to see the outcome...

Good luck swanning_it. Have you taken screen shots of the pages you are you referring to, just in case they have updating the information presented? Perhaps a consumer advocate like Choice would be willing to help you out... bullerdude raises some interesting points.