Have you Stuck with QF?

[Rono]

For what its worth, this year, I haven't renewed my Qantas Club after 21 years continuous membership.
I feel hollowed out.
My membership benefits seem to have been "so enhanced" that its drained me.
My flights haven't decreased, in fact if anything they have increased markedly in frequency whether interstate or overseas.
I might have flown with Qantas once out of the last 40 - 50 flights and that's not counting the flights that I'm now taking my my wife on along with me.

 

[FirstClass]

Hedge your bets. I fly with QF domestic, to the US and occasionally to Asia. I fly SQ to Europe and the UK and often within Asia. SQ makes it easier to use my points for international travel. Virgin can't offer me both domestic and international unless I want to only travel to the USA. Their connection and poor points transfer to SQ makes them not worthwhile.

Thanks Ronone 69. That's the sort of 'mix' towards which I'm being compelled. Just hafta take the necessary steps...

 

[Dee#]

Got out of Q about 5 years ago. Because of difficulty with redeeming points back then and being treated like cattle/sheep. I live in Perth and Darwin and move with the weather.
So other option is Virgin. Pluses are
1. Family pooling which means my partner and I are both ensure we are Platinum every year on 800 status credits each
2. Less points required to retain Platinum than Q
3. Easier to redeem points, and upgrade to business domestically, and 4 free upgrades a year.
4. One guaranteed family trip on points per year, anytime even busy seasons.
5. Staff more pleasant and helpful than Q
6 Flying Etihad in Business, far better than Q and Emirates until they upgraded theirs. (got a free 2 day stopover in Abu Dhabi once-fabulous hotel Etihad Towers). But now Etihad charging huge additional money for redemption from Virgin.

Disadvantages

1. seems to be a lot harder and more expensive to redeem Velocity points for a trip to Europe or around the world than Q.
2. They have relocated the Virgin domestic to the international Terminal on Perth, another 10min and $15 taxi fare from my place. Q is still in old location and close to me and the city.
3. Doesn't seem to be any lifetime status?

Have given 150,000 Q points away to friends. As I am only a base FF with Q it would be impossible to get upgrades etc.

 

[Warks]

I was fairly well tied to QF until VA got serious a few years ago and comped me to Gold. I managed to requalify with both airlines for a year and then my QP membership covered me for another year but when it ran out I didn't renew. I don't fly enough to qualify for Gold with both and QF don't do direct flights SYD-TSV which I was flying with monotonous regularity for some time so I just stuck with VA despite their lack of a lounge in TSV!!!!

It took me about 17 years to get to LTS with QF and I don't think I'll ever get LTG now. Been with them a fair while (6 digit member number) and there's no real barrier to me flying with them again but it doesn't look like it's happening.

 

[siri]

I suppose Qantas is changing and seems to value business customers more than usual traveller... I am Qantas Life Gold and will use ApacJ with them. Since I hate going via Dubai to UK, I use BA or Sing Air for European travel. Removing via Singapore for UK, pissed off so many including my kids. They fly BA and Sing air since both are VP's in UK bank.
For US, United or Qantas or JAL via Japan some times that includes Europe.
United points are much bigger value if you use their points against Sing Air.

 

[Rebekkap]

I was QFF-loyal and then "Mr" Joyce started on his anti-OW path: got into bed with EK, started shafting OW redemptions, dumped on MH after sponsoring their OW entry, then went hand-in-glove to the Government because "nothing, absolutely nothing other than similar foreign ownership rules would save the Roo" (OK, a bit of a paraphrase!).

Why have you put "Mr" in quotation marks?

 

[marki]

Why have you put "Mr" in quotation marks?

You really don't know why?

 

[FirstClass]

Since airplanes only have one 'type' of bathroom, it's hardly relevant is it?

 

[gadabout]

Platinum member for decades, but no longer "blind loyalty". Their Premium Desk, which had been outstanding, degenerated when it was moved to Hobart, with well-meaning but inexperienced agents making significant mistakes. After three of these in a row (the last of which caused major problems for me - almost marooned in the middle of China), and whinging each time to QF, each time I received a personalised phone call back saying the situation was going to improve. I called three strikes and you're out on the last one. Now Cathay and Singapore for most international bookings, although I will maintain my QF membership.

 

[Rebekkap]

You really don't know why?

No, I really don't. Care to explain?

 

[marki]

Look it's better the original postie do that I may be wrong and which is not unusual

 

[junbugging]

Does he have an honorary doctorate?

 

[Milefest]

Past couple of years I've flown VA significantly more than QF. Premium entry, fly ahead, family pooling (extra SC's don't go to waste) makes it much more convientent to fly with VA for me. Especially as someone who frequently travels BNE-SYD with unexpected travel paterns (fly ahead makes it so easy).

 

[BD1959]

No, I really don't. Care to explain?

Quite simple really, a mark of respect that - in my opinion - is not justified.

Its' not so much the shutdown - and the manner in which it was conducted - which alienated so many of Qantas's loyal customers, it's more the other "CEO strategies" which have been employed (and some of which have cost the company - though you'd struggle to discover how much) over "Mr" Joyce's tenure and shown to be complete rubbish:

- The RedQ strategy "only this will save Qantas International" which was so quickly dropped
- The Jetstar HK venture "only this will allow us to penetrate China" which many analysts warned was doomed to failure but persisted with whilst dollars were wasted on aircraft sitting idle around the world
- The "only an ownership restructure per the VA model can allow us to compete" mission to Government - which subsequently proved to be untrue
- The "65% line in the sand" which was dogmatically followed despite the impact it had on QF's bottom-line
- The refusal to implement the depreciation standard earlier which subsequently moved QFi back to profit, together with the cost savings

There's a whole lot more that have rankled over time but I can't be bothered to remember at this point but for me, the general dissing of his own brand over the years while CEO rates as a prime reason why my use of the "Mr" tag I feel is deserved. Contrast that with the passion and commitment of (most) front-line and service staff and I'll reserve the use of the relevant honorifics for those more deserving.

Regards,

BD

 

[Rebekkap]

Quite simple really, a mark of respect that - in my opinion - is not justified.

Thanks for the response - it never occurred to me that including a title that just denotes someone is an adult male who you don't know personally was a mark of respect. Why would you not simply refer to him as Alan Joyce or just Joyce if you don't feel like calling him Mr?

I certainly am not a huge fan of the way he's run Qantas, but then I don't have to manage an airline in a time when airlines are, I gather, increasingly difficult to run in a profitable manner.

 

[BD1959]

Thanks for the response - it never occurred to me that including a title that just denotes someone is an adult male who you don't know personally was a mark of respect. Why would you not simply refer to him as Alan Joyce or just Joyce if you don't feel like calling him Mr?

I certainly am not a huge fan of the way he's run Qantas, but then I don't have to manage an airline in a time when airlines are, I gather, increasingly difficult to run in a profitable manner.

Hi Rebekkap,

I'm old (and old-fashioned) enough to use honorifics generally and that someone who is capable enough to be CEO of a major airline *should* be afforded that courtesy; hence why I did what I did rather than just refer to him a "Joyce".

I am also old-school enough to think that anyone involved in such, merely has stewardship; that they should be ensuring that the company they leave is in a far better place than the one the joined.

I've no doubt that the current CEO believes that everything he has done to date has been performed for the betterment of the company; I'm convinced that a CEO's psyche would not allow them to think otherwise. Hence, I'll never make a CEO.

Regards,

BD

 

[Rebekkap]

Hi Rebekkap,

I'm old (and old-fashioned) enough to use honorifics generally and that someone who is capable enough to be CEO of a major airline *should* be afforded that courtesy; hence why I did what I did rather than just refer to him a "Joyce".

I am also old-school enough to think that anyone involved in such, merely has stewardship; that they should be ensuring that the company they leave is in a far better place than the one the joined.

I've no doubt that the current CEO believes that everything he has done to date has been performed for the betterment of the company; I'm convinced that a CEO's psyche would not allow them to think otherwise. Hence, I'll never make a CEO.

Regards,

BD

Thanks for clarifying,

cheers
Rebekka

 

[eastwest101]

Like Warks and a lot of other contributors I had a foot in each camp for several years, as quite often I'm not given a choice about whom to fly, but over the last few years have been seeing less and less of the inside of QF aircraft so have subsequently redirected most of my points earning loyalty over to the Velocity/SQ/EY ecosystem. Like a lot of comments here - travel patterns seem to dictate a lot of choices and this in turn has probably in turn driven a bit of revenue towards Virgin as I don't travel enough to get Gold status with both VA and QF and the enhancements in the QFF scheme have really made it difficult to justify collecting QFF points at all. When compiling this list and looking at other peoples comments its instructive to see how many "push" factors are at work to discourage loyalty to QF and its loyalty scheme vs the very few "pull factors" that their main competitor had going for it to "pull" accross customers from the QFF ecosystem.

• Acheived lifetime Silver with Qantas but Lifetime Gold probably out of reach i.e. the golden handcuffs getting beyond reach for me.
• The status match from VA let me compare and see VA lounges and products without having to dedicate large spends to VA upfront.
• High Qantas airfares both domestically and internationally, and they are almost never the best/most convenient product to justify the high fares either.
• Ease of status qualification with family poooling in Velocity compared to the grind to reach Gold status on Qantas.
• Perceived sense of lack of long term sustainability due to Qantas management managing by crisis and constantly talking their own business down.
• Many less places for Qantas Club members to use lounges, very high membership cost and QC members always the first to get shafted when terminals/routes/lounge changes are afoot.
• Qantas Frequent Flyer scheme now just a revenue generating department with few benefits for members and frequent flyers.
• Huge number of "enhancements and devaluation of the QFF scheme and distinct lack of award seat availibility unless you're committed to booking a year ahead.
• Astronomical fuel fines/price gouges and surcharges for redemptions on Qantas and Jetstar flights
• High status in Qantas requires "blind loyalty" and negates the ability to choose other better/cheaper/more convenient airlines, in order to get the best out of the QFF scheme
• Fly ahead benefits on VA handy but VA network and VA lounges not quite as good coverage as the Qantas route network and lounges.
• Priority boarding done properly on VA and not very well on QF.
• Attempted Jetstarization of many of my common destinations drives me to adopt my "anyone but Jetstar" policy.
• Simpler and Fairer devaluation of status credit earn on One World partners over the years - begs the question of why be part of an alliance?
• Loss of Woolworths group from the QFF ecosystem - which in hindsight now may have been a blessing - but at the time prompted me to re-evaluate my points earning credit cards/options and points warehousing.
• Increasingly Sydney-centric view of the world from Qantas to the point where QF only makes sense for residents of Sydney (and maybe Melbourne).
• Many more choices of different airlines and destinations internationally out of Australia.
• Many better value frequent flyer schemes now out there too.
• The fact that VA is not part of a "real" alliance (preferably Star Alliance) is no longer such a deal breaker for me as Qantas enhances away its own OW alliance benefits, and the international partners that VA do have (such as DL, SQ and NZ) seem to do a good enough job anyway recognizing VA status.
• While the front line Qantas staff themselves are usually great, you can't deny the sense of arrogance from Qantas management affecting the culture of the company.

Just my opinion - but lots of "self inflicted" damage to Qantas - and I think Qantas can think themselves as being very very fortunate that VA didn't decide to fully join Star Alliance as that may have been the difference between QF surviving and having their own a#$%s handed to them by VA/SQ.

Have learnt a lot since becoming a member here about how to make loyalty schemes work for me.

 

[roseworks]

Don't think about points anymore ,too difficult for an occasional long distance flyer ,used our points on business seats to Perth . Qantas lounge renewal in November means we will probably go to Amex and Priority,and Amex lounges on whatever flight is on offer.
Loss of status credits every year was the last straw

 

[JohnK]

I am leaving for Virgin. After 10 years at Gold, and 2 at Platinum before that, I was shown a message all year on the log in that said I had been awarded Gold for another year on my end of May anniversary. Suddenly overnight they dropped me to Silver and when asked, could not really care less. Time to move on.

Just out of interest do you think Virgin will keep you at Gold if you didn't requalify?