I think I've become an intolerant QP snob!

[haydensydney]

The alternative of loitering in the main terminal is far more scary - miners without status and the general public! Oh noes!

 

[Moody]

[edit] removed deleted post [/edit]

Good to see the ANZAC spirit is alive and well!

I don't have a problem with people wearing work clothes in the lounge, or even resort or casual wear if that is what they have come from or a going to. The big issue is behaviour, and anything that makes other guests uncomfortable should be looked at very carefully. A lout is a lout whether in hi-viz or a suit, and has no place in society let alone an airline lounge that provides services on the understanding that you will adhere to certain standards of dress and behaviour.

 

[medhead]

Thanks for the gross misrepresentation of what was posited.

I don't fly out of mining towns - I have no issue with hi viz but I wonder if people are flying straight from the site and thus unshowered etc.? Genuine question given a lack knowledge in this area - thing is if you have time to shower then don't you have time to change?

It will vary from site to site. The consistent thing will be that people will wear the easiest clothes required to get changed - things, shorts singlet because they have to get dressed for work at work. Consequently, when they come off shift and get on a plane they are not likely to have decent clothing available.

In terms of showering, it really isn't an indication. I've had the misfortune to sit next to someone who most likely came straight off shift and they stunk to high heaven. This was from a mine that has a strict showering rule. If I could have got their name I would have reported it back to management.


Sent from the Throne

 

[Canny man]

Hi viz is to mining as suit is to banking. It's just a uniform with the exception that hviz is enforced by site/HSE regulations rather than social norms.

In my business I am one of the 'suits' and dress appropriately in the office and other circumstances. At times I have to visit an operation for the day and hviz is mandatory, so wear the shirt. If someone can't see beyond the uniform and make the call on behaviour then they may be the one with the problem.

As I commented in another post, the worst behaviour I've endured in a lounge recently was a group of loud drunks in polo shirts and "leisure wear'.

Judge the book, not the cover - unless of course, the cover is covered in tattoos.

 

[11sjw]

Thanks for the gross misrepresentation of what was posited.

I don't fly out of mining towns - I have no issue with hi viz but I wonder if people are flying straight from the site and thus unshowered etc.? Genuine question given a lack knowledge in this area - thing is if you have time to shower then don't you have time to change?

If they're flying "from" site there isn't a problem as they generally won't be in Hi Viz and have showered (even me on day trips, I stop via the local swimming pool and pay $4 for the privelege of a shower!). Not only that most of the "from" terminals don't have a QP (Hedland and KTA have Manager's Lounges). It's when they're/we're flying too sites that the Hi-Viz gear is prominant. The shirts are long sleeved, collared and generally tucked into long trousers. Much neater than most of the shorts and t shirt brigade that are allowed in.

Not sure how much "have to live with it" goes.

There are dress regulations - if these would bar hi-viz, it seems they are rarely enforced.

Posted on a wing and a prayer ...

Why ban it? It would mean crew having to change after arriving somewhere at 0715 instead of being able to head straight to work. Most of the FIFO guys do not travel with luggage as they have their own room.

The live with it comment comes from the PoV that these mining companies are contributing way more to QF's profitability than most (even the highest of WP1s) and generally the people that work for them aren't that poorly behaved (yes you get DH's but that can be said of any group of people). Yes the OP is sounding extremely snobbish and should get over it.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Ahhh FIFOs, the great equaliser of the travelling classes. I mean what can you do? If you can't beat them with SCs, maybe they should have a private airport club where only people who attendend certain schools or unis could obtain access? Just a thought. Here's another random one: could pink hi-vis be the equivilent of the pink business shirt craze of recent times? You read it here first.

I thought purple was the new black. It's apparently all the rage in Italy right now.

Just be careful-I might be working in Karratha next year.Though i dont think I will be in Fluoro!

Why not Dr Ron fluoro would match the golf shorts brilliantly!

I have a fair bit of respect for the FIFO guys, as the very the businesses employing them are keeping me in a job.

I'm sure the FIFO guys show more respect for the cabin crew also or at least acknowledge them when greeted as they board an aircraft.

I overheard one CSM saying she greeted everyone by name & would have been lucky to get six responses & this was on a packed 737 full of suits - not hi viz!

 

[ReLoad]

Back in the day when I was "working for the man" so to speak, we had a company policy; whilst you are in uniform you are representing the company.
Any actions unbecoming whilst in the uniform make the company look bad and thus you are liable to the companies disciplinary procedures.

Most high vis stuff I see (mostly BNE) has company logos emblazoned all over them and I am yet to see a badly behaved one.

However, I've seen sooooo many toss bags and general wannabe flogs in suits that attempt to tout some sort of self importance. - I'd suggest that perhaps we should indeed segregate the Suits from the Hi-Vis folks. The Hi Vis folks would love the extra space and not have to put up with the riff raff suit flogs. :shock:

It takes many different types of people to make the world interesting, and we as frequent travellers see more than most, and that's one of the things I love about being a frequent flyer.

 

[Paddy55]

Just home after a really nice QF J flight (more elsewhere tomorrow on that)

Good to see so many opinions so quickly.

As the OP I thought I'd clarify a couple of things:

1. Don't mind the fluro so much as the singlet, shorts & things, and

2. Why can't the volume be turned down? I don't need to hear their mobile phone conversations, and I certainly aren't interested in the conversation they're having with their mates 20m away.

I like a QP for a bit of peace and quiet, a bit to eat, etc, etc, etc.

Saw a great suggestion earlier in the thread for a (separate/sound-proofed) Sports Bar instead of a J lounge @ Perth.
Might be a good idea that keeps all happy.

 

[Bugalugz]

I must say I am guilty for flying in Hi Vis only because I had a very quick trip to Perth and back on site that afternoon.

If there was a J lounge I think half the people that are present in the normal QP would be there, however it would definitely make a bit more room during peak period and still give J passengers a much better lounge.

However I do find a lot (keep in mind I work with and am mates with heaps of FIFO guys) that a large number of FIFO workers are very arrogant. They are the reason Karratha airport no longer sells proper alcohol and has serving limits, they are the reason we no longer have full strength beer and spirits in FIFO/Cattle class to the Pilbara, however they are the reason we have up to 12 flights a day to Karratha from Perth and flights to BNE, SYD and MEL which gives us choice.....then again I don't think $796 KTA-PER one way 6 months in advance for several days in a row is very good for the people who actually have to live here and fly. (this is from certain company's booking large blocks of seats)

The worst 'incidents' I've seen at the PER QP:

I have been in the lounge and there was 6 guys that walked in and they were absolutely filthy, looked like they had spent 12hrs underground and they left nice big brown boot prints everywhere, not too pleasant to sit near either.

The language.....seriously how hard is it to go an hr or 2 without using the C**t word in every single sentence? especially when there's kid around - the announcement about language is an all too common occurrence in the PER QP.

Seen several people escorted out of the pub oh i mean club for intoxication

Seen a mother and baby told to shut the fu*k up, needless to say that very nice person was not in the lounge much longer (similar even happened on a KTA-PER flight baby was crying and she was told to shut the fuc*king baby up and that she was obviously raped because no one would want her, that's when the alcohol discontinued, rumor had it he could do anything because he was platinum!) Yes that happened, was big news here at the time a couple of years ago.

These are the sort of people who we share the lounges with, luckily most company's now have policy's regarding travel to work and if you misbehave on the plane or the airport you get sacked but there are still rotten apples out there.

It's not just FIFO but they are certainly more rowdy than the office folks in their suits!

 

[drewbles]

A hell of a lot of the FIFO's are WP, so I doubt you would get any respite.

I do question this every time i'm in the PER lounge (which isn't frequently these days as I swapped to DJ).

There's a *lot* of SG bag tags (mainly the coasters) on FIFO type's bags. It is of course entirely possible they are WP and haven't upgraded' their bag candy, but a quick glance at BP's where available also sees 'FF GOLD ONEWORLD SAPPHIRE" on them too.

That said, it's been around a year since I was there, so it's also likely the boom has created more FIFO's that are indeed WP.

 

[drewbles]

Qantas lounges probably need different physical market segmentation, rather than class of travel & level of status.

Thus, in a sense, a true (Qantas) Pub, with completely separate areas -

• A sports bar, with sound isolating walls and one tough looking, cricket bat wielding, bar maid

That would be the bar on the main concourse, where only VB, xx_X and Carlton Draught are served

• A coughtail bar, with a more sophisticated refined atmosphere

VS Clubhouse?

• An (indoor) beer garden, where the kids can have a bit of a play and families relax.

The old BA Terraces Lounge

• A poker machine nook, for all the techno-gadget folk

I'd rather a casino. Gimme a Poker game and i'm there

• A self-serve bistro, to grab a light feed

F Lounge?

• Beds for a bit of a lie down and rest

Could be dangerous. I'd end up missing my flights!

• Rooms for the local CWA meetings

That's the current regional QP's

• VIP saloon for all the local councillors & big city business (wo)men

Sounds like the CL

 

[Stephen65]

I do question this every time i'm in the PER lounge (which isn't frequently these days as I swapped to DJ).

There's a *lot* of SG bag tags (mainly the coasters) on FIFO type's bags. It is of course entirely possible they are WP and haven't upgraded' their bag candy, but a quick glance at BP's where available also sees 'FF GOLD ONEWORLD SAPPHIRE" on them too.

That said, it's been around a year since I was there, so it's also likely the boom has created more FIFO's that are indeed WP.

It could be that even flying 20 times a year FIFO is not enough for WP. For example, MEL - PER - KTA is only 35SC in discount economy.

 

[drron]

It could be that even flying 20 times a year FIFO is not enough for WP. For example, MEL - PER - KTA is only 35SC in discount economy.

Though once flying MEL-DPO I sat next to a grandmother and noted the WP tag on her bag.She was a cook at KTA and must be a good one as they paid for J for her on the MEL-PER sector.

 

[11sjw]

It could be that even flying 20 times a year FIFO is not enough for WP. For example, MEL - PER - KTA is only 35SC in discount economy.

However if Rio or BHP book it you get full Y SCs.

 

[munitalP]

....


In terms of showering, it really isn't an indication. I've had the misfortune to sit next to someone who most likely came straight off shift and they stunk to high heaven. This was from a mine that has a strict showering rule. If I could have got their name I would have reported it back to management.


Sent from the Throne

I have flown ex mining towns many times both east and west coast, I have never noticed FIFO's to be dirty or smelly - there's always an exception to the rule, but I have had more unhygienic stinkers sitting next to me in casual or business atire than anything else. The exodus from the main mining towns is actually carefully controlled - KTA for example, 100kms out is SINO Iron, they stagger their FOFO's Wed's and Thurs whereas Woodside is Mon & Fri to name a couple I am familiar with. This leads to a lot of FIFO's heading to PER, but few actually carry on further as most companies pay only to PER in WA as I have found out when being involved in writing green and brown field workplace agreements for construction jobs I have been involved with in WA.

On the exodus day, most FIFO's who stay at the managed mine camps for example Fortescue Rive, Sea Breeze or myriad of others in the WA Pilbra region, have their rooms until the day after they leave which gives them the ability to pack and leave. With the restrictions placed on what can and can't be taken onto most mine and construction sites, this is the only way to combat the need to then store masses of luggage off site. This also gives the FIFO's a chance to shower and change.

In the times I have had a few days at a camp, I have never bought luggage with specific clothes to wear home on "the plane" so will change into clean jeans but usually still with an orange reflector shirt and frequently work boots/shoes. Fortunately my days in this atire are limited to a few weeks a year, but for those who are frequent FIFO's such as many of my workers in the past have been, this is a standard MO.

Back in the day when I was "working for the man" so to speak, we had a company policy; whilst you are in uniform you are representing the company.
Any actions unbecoming whilst in the uniform make the company look bad and thus you are liable to the companies disciplinary procedures.

Most high vis stuff I see (mostly BNE) has company logos emblazoned all over them and I am yet to see a badly behaved one...

I couldn't agree more. The days of drunken miners / construction workers are well past. There is NOT a site I have been on in the last 5-6 years where breath testing was not compulsory and drug analysis more frequent than random. In fact, I did a pee in the jar yesterday for access to a Rio Tinto site this week and the week after, and I will probably be tested randomly again during my visits.

A knock on from this is that many workplace agreements made between employers and employees state that as the FIFO is being paid, it must be treated as working time and rule 1 - Zero Tolerance applies. Again there is an exception to that rule, but I know of one company who last year breath tested a bus load of workers who had just been picked up for their ride to camp to start their 4 week stint with about a quarter of them being turned away (possibly terminated) due to drinking at the airport/on the plane on the way to work even though the workers didn't hit the coal face till the next day.



As far as I can see, there is NO prerequisite of frequent flyer status having a "professional uni educated only" stigma attached, therefore Tolerance is a word many of us need to take on board and start practicing.

 

[amaroo]

However if Rio or BHP book it you get full Y SCs.

Correct - all the blokes I know are on full freight point wise.

 

[medhead]

I have flown ex mining towns many times both east and west coast, I have never noticed FIFO's to be dirty or smelly - there's always an exception to the rule, but I have had more unhygienic stinkers sitting next to me in casual or business atire than anything else.

It could very well be me stinking in business or casual gear. Having worked on the site myself, the guy had the just off shift uniform and the distinctive aroma from site and it was an early morning flight. So I'm pretty sure they didn't shower, despite the rule that they must do so before leaving site. Definitely the exception to the rule, but just shows there will always be one filthy pig to wreck things for everyone else.


Sent from the Throne

 

[harvyk]

What they need to do is they need to employ a behaviour rule...

A person who acts badley in the lounge is given one warning, if it continues they are ejected from the lounge. Be ejected from the lounge 3 times in a membership year and they get a one year ban on entering any lounge, regardless of the memberships brought or the SC's earnt.

Furthermore if banned, and they are on a company fare, then the company would also be notified of the ban.

Lets face it, if I acted in the way some ppl do in the QP down at my local RSL, I'd be kicked out and asked not to return.

 

[Longrass]

The workwear I have no problem with, I would like QF to set the bar somewhere though and for me Boardies and thongs are not appropriate in the QP.

As a WP flying in fully paid J class, I would have thought that I would be entitled to dress how I want.

 

[Ausbt]

I'm actually doing SYD-BNE-BDB-BNE-GLT-BNE-SYD late this week and will be clocking a bit of time in the BNE QP Thur Arvo. I'd better pack some flouro. Interestingly I can't actually afford to overnight in Gladstone, accom is way over my corporate budget there. BNE is half the price.