Japan Airlines plane in flames at Tokyo's Haneda airport

[Quickstatus]

Before or after?

as per my post and also the link

 

[DejaBrew]

I think the high heels tearing the slide is a myth.
It is also not in the Qantas safety briefing.... in fact shoes are not mentioned at all
And the FAA safety recomendations re evacuation puts removing high heel shoes after jumping feet first onto evacuations slide

Personally, I’d prefer the “myth” to be formally debunked and guidelines officially updated before some random DYKWIA decides to test the theory on any aircraft I'm needing to urgently evacuate. Who in their right mind wants to test the theory when their life is on the line??

And yes, I appreciate that in an emergency situation, people often aren’t in their “right mind”.

 

[Quickstatus]

Personally, I’d prefer the “myth” to be formally debunked

I know the BA safety briefing says" high heel shoes must be taken off as it may tear the slide" but I dont recall if the US airlines mention removing high heels - I dont think they even mention shoes.

Though it would be interesting to see if its mentioned on the safety card even if not mentioned in the briefing

 

[LondonAussie]

BA's was also the one I was thinking of that says "take nothing with you" in their safety briefing.

Last time I flew VA (maybe 5 years ago) they had a fairly long bit in theirs, something like "for your own safety and the safety of others, please do not attempt to take any cabin baggage with you off the aircraft"

The only thing I now remember from the Qantas one is their odd bit about being kind to crew and zero tolerance for any aggressive behaviour. Not heard that on any other airline.

 

[mrsterryn]

The only bit I remember from the Qantas one is their odd bit about being kind to crew and zero tolerance for any aggressive behaviour. Not heard that on any other airline.

Loads of places now have that warning. Unfortunately I think with all the , mostly warranted, bad press people believe they can take it out on the face to face staff members

 

[encryptededdy]

I've been saying that for years. Every airline, other the JL, that I've flown on over the past 20 years has been falling all over themselves trying to make the safety video "entertaining", which just defeats the point of the video.

The new ANA one is fine, although the older Kabuki one from a few years ago had a bit of fluff.

 

[encryptededdy]

And all of these observations are why many countries have adopted a “just culture” approach to aviation (and indeed to medicine) which allows for examination of the system to see why an incident might have occurred rather than just blame the last link in the chain, and also to encourage a thinking learning and improvement culture rather than a mindless compliance and blame culture.

Related press release from the Japan Civil Aviation Workers' Union: 2024年1月2日に東京国際空港で発生した航空機事故に関する緊急声明 / Urgent Statement for the Aircraft Accident at Tokyo International Airport on JAN 02, 2024 | 航空安全推進連絡会議

There's an english translation if you scroll down. Second page is of note.

 

[tdimdad]

I know the BA safety briefing says" high heel shoes must be taken off as it may tear the slide" but I dont recall if the US airlines mention removing high heels - I dont think they even mention shoes.

Though it would be interesting to see if its mentioned on the safety card even if not mentioned in the briefing

If the high heels were a risk to the slides, then it would be logical to prohibit people from wearing them in the cabin. If there were the footwear of choice of someone when flying, removing them during an evacuation would render them barefoot which would not be good, either.

A new rule would then be "pack your heels, wear your flats".

 

[JohnM]

I was about to say that, the evacuation part/leaving behind items should be included in all videos, or verbally advised in all briefings.

Cut the fluffy video stuff also. Amazed some regulatory bodies even permit half that stuff, most of it just airline marketing.

The language issue would surely prevent total reliance on verbal briefings.

I agree about cutting out the entertaining stuff and stick to the key message.

That's why I thought that the animated JAL safety video posted upthread was pretty good. The animation clearly showed all key messages and particularly not to take luggage and why (as if any explanation were needed... ). See at 2:40:

I don't recall seeing anything as explicit as that on any other carrier.

 

[Sprucegoose]

HND’s taxiways are pretty complex. Being unfamiliar certainly wouldn’t help.

One must agree with the degree of environmental familiarity and its possible contribution to decision-making.

A point made to me last night was both crews and ATC were Japanese and operating on Japanese territory. Therefore, you would expect language and spatial unfamiliarity to be considered minor factors, notwithstanding the fatigue involved in running emergency relief efforts for fellow citizens.

Sensibly, one should assume little until the facts are known and adequately reviewed. Of interest would be the voice conversations of the crews and ATC and their situational understanding.

One must feel great sympathy for the surviving Dash 8 captain, given his crew was killed. One can only hope he is being well supported.

 

[Sprucegoose]

If the high heels were a risk to the slides, then it would be logical to prohibit people from wearing them in the cabin. If there were the footwear of choice of someone when flying, removing them during an evacuation would render them barefoot which would not be good, either.

A new rule would then be "pack your heels, wear your flats".

I have always worn solid footwear and prepared to evacuate a burning plane. Contrast this to some folk who change into 'night dress' and wear socks only before takeoff - something I have never understood. The FAs I have spoken to about some habits have elicited appropriate derision.

Practical safety messages should be included as more relevant than, say, other phrases that belong in the 'social engineering' class.

 

[DejaBrew]

One must feel great sympathy for the surviving Dash 8 captain, given his crew was killed. One can only hope he is being well supported.

100% agreed. Imagine the recovery from the emotional and psychological trauma of this incident will take years (assuming he can ever come to terms with it).

 

[LondonAussie]

Channel 9 making a big fuss about having an exclusive interview with an Australian family who were on the JAL flight and recorded the evacuation on their phones, to be shown on 9 News tonight.

 

[encryptededdy]

Channel 9 making a big fuss about having an exclusive interview with an Australian family who were on the JAL flight and recorded the evacuation on their phones, to be shown on 9 News tonight.

Hopefully the video was taken after they were out of the plane, not whilst everyone was trying to leave.

From the ANA safety video (I don't actually think the JAL video explicitly mentions this)

 

[LondonAussie]

Hopefully the video was taken after they were out of the plane, not whilst everyone was trying to leave.

The promo said: "see the video they filmed inside the smoky cabin; see how they escaped as the plane went up in flames. Their incredible story, only on 9 news, tonight at 6."

 

[DejaBrew]

see how they escaped as the plane went up in flames.

Out the emergency exit, down the escape slide and swiftly moving away from the burning aircraft. What a scoop!!

 

[jb747]

If the high heels were a risk to the slides, then it would be logical to prohibit people from wearing them in the cabin. If there were the footwear of choice of someone when flying, removing them during an evacuation would render them barefoot which would not be good, either.

A new rule would then be "pack your heels, wear your flats".

They are a risk to slides. But like luggage, the effect will be felt by others, as the slide won't go down immediately. Really a continuation of "I'm right, Jack". They can also damage the flooring. Engineering, ops, and safety would love to see them banned. Sadly, marketing rules these days.

Why anyone would need to travel in them, I do not understand. Like ties, they are a relic.

 

[antycbr]

We were saying this on our international flights just a day ago. They need to outline five? key points only.

Perhaps 60 seconds of an A350 burning from end to end on all screens throughout the cabin might make people watch the video…

“It can happen to you…”

 

[DejaBrew]

Hopefully the video was taken after they were out of the plane, not whilst everyone was trying to leave.

Sadly not....

Aussie family on board Japan plane recount horror crash

www.9news.com.au

 

[elanshin]

Sitting here at MEL taxing out on a b738 and looking over at the dash 8s parked nearby, its also crazy to think that if it was a smaller plane and not a350, there was no way the JL plane wouldn't have taken major hull dmaage on impact. If it was JL166 next in sequence (b738) they too would've likely been smashed up.