Joyce:"As we're making money, we'll pay corporate tax"

[Mickey Mouse]

According to the ATO, paying $0 on over $9 billion of income.

 

[justinbrett]

How to claim a tax loss

The method of claiming varies depending on if you are an individual, partnership, trust, company or consolidated group.

www.ato.gov.au

 

[oz_mark]

Just because they had income, doesn't mean they were making a profit.

 

[Cruiser Elite]

Remember what Kerry said

 

[Mickey Mouse]

How to tell a lie
The method of saying something which is false or irrelevant.

 

[jb747]

No business pays tax based on income, though I'm sure many a government would like to institute it. The issue is that business has become so good at hiding any profit.

 

[dajop]

Just because they had income, doesn't mean they were making a taxable profit.

Corrected that for you.

Any company who is meeting its obligations to its shareholders finds entirely legal ways of structuring their finances to minimise tax liability.

 

[Mickey Mouse]

The topic of the thread is the words of Joyce:

"As we're making money, we'll pay corporate tax"​

Not

"As we're making money, we'll avoid corporate tax"​

(Please don't get hung up on the use of the word "avoid". Reactions to it demonstrate where people sit on greed vs morality.)

 

[oz_mark]

The topic of the thread is the words of Joyce:

"As we're making money, we'll pay corporate tax"​

Not

"As we're making money, we'll avoid corporate tax"​

(Please don't get hung up on the use of the word "avoid". Reactions to it demonstrate where people sit on greed vs morality.)

There's a difference between 'income' and 'making money'

 

[Mickey Mouse]

There's a difference between 'income' and 'making money'

You're right! If you're not making money then you cant fund share buy backs...

Post automatically merged: Nov 9, 2023

I wonder how many billions (above ten) in income is required to start "making money"?

 

[kangarooflyer88]

According to the ATO, paying $0 on over $9 billion of income.

Do you have a source to the quote attributed to Uncle Alan?

 

[oz_mark]

You're right! If you're not making money then you cant fund share buy backs...

Post automatically merged: Nov 9, 2023

I wonder how many billions (above ten) in income is required to start "making money"?

were they doing a buyback during 2021-2022?

 

[dajop]

The topic of the thread is the words of Joyce:

"As we're making money, we'll pay corporate tax"​

I just realised you're looking at the 2021/22 figures. I think anyone who has been alive and watched any bit of news would realise that the period July 2021 to June 2022 would be difficult for an airline. You will be sorely disappointed when they carry forward losses and don't pay tax in 2022/23 as although they made significant profit, I'm pretty sure recalling that they will have significant losses from the previous two years to offset that profit.

Here is what makes up their income and expenses in 2021/22...

 

[Mickey Mouse]

were they doing a buyback during 2021-2022?

From Qantas Group FY22 Appendix 4E and Preliminary Final Report:

"
No dividend will be paid in relation to the year ended 30 June 2022.
In August 2022, the Directors announced an on-market share buy-back of up to $400 million.
"

 

[Gold Member]

The topic of the thread is the words of Joyce:

"As we're making money, we'll pay corporate tax"​

Not

"As we're making money, we'll avoid corporate tax"​

(Please don't get hung up on the use of the word "avoid". Reactions to it demonstrate where people sit on greed vs morality.)

The resident Qantas PR Team doesn’t make an ethical distinction but will claim unbiased, analytical presentation of “facts”.

 

[CaptJCool]

The RRIA
Revenue Received in Advance is over $8 billion

However, no income tax (or ticket GST) is paid on that until the flight has flown or the toaster redemption delivers

 

[Mickey Mouse]

The resident Qantas PR Team doesn’t make an ethical distinction but will claim unbiased, analytical presentation of “facts”.

I get the feeling the Team members here really need to visit a pub occasionally!

Hire an expensive fully-expensed consultant to tell them they need an expensive fully-expensed Team Building excercise at the local pub...

Learn in-house about the famous test!

 

[dajop]

From Qantas Group FY22 Appendix 4E and Preliminary Final Report:

"
No dividend will be paid in relation to the year ended 30 June 2022.
In August 2022, the Directors announced an on-market share buy-back of up to $400 million.
"

Yeh, and I've never studied finance or accounting, so I could be talking through my backside, but the share buy back relates to cash holdings not necessarily profit. Especially in a business like an airline as a) you bring in of lot of advance ticket sales so have your cash well before you use it (unlike many businesses who often don't receive "cash" until 90 days or more after delivering goods or rendering a service) and b) you're selling points to banks etc and receive cash for that, that sits there also until used, could be years in some instances.

So with a lot of cash you can (to simplify it) earn interest by letting that cash sit in the bank (which investors don't like as they could simply put their own money in the bank), pay it out as dividends (which some investors in Australia don't like, unless there are franking credits attached to it, which don't come if the company doesn't pay tax) , buy back capital (as QF have done) to attempt to increase the share price or invest it back into the business.

A lot of criticism of Qantas share buy backs has been about the "sugar hit" to boost the share price for executives who hold stock and options that they can then cash out, instead of investing back into the business to update the fleet, refresh lounges or other activities that could potentially generate revenue and profit in the future.

Would you object so much to them not paying tax, and doing buy backs, if instead they had invested that $400m back into the business?

 

[jb747]

Share buybacks simply inflate the price (not value) of the shares, and are little more than a way of transferring money to the executives. Others get their cut, but they wouldn't be so popular if they didn't represent a way of paying themselves (management) more. And of the course the entire value of the buyback disappears as soon as the stock market coughs, though it might work well for CEO's who time their sale just afterwards.

 

[Franky]

No business pays tax based on income, though I'm sure many a government would like to institute it. The issue is that business has become so good at hiding any profit.

True, but I recall a certain female Labor Finance Minister whose name I can’t recall stated that was the case….