Lunch with Lesley – Attendees

[markis10]

I know the conversation has moved on a bit - but my take remains this... mASAs only available when classic was available anyway.

And the surcharge (over and above a classic award) is several hundred dollars... maybe $300 or more. That extra cash payment is the same as a jetstar bundle... and in reality... you might reach gold (lounge access) by getting the SCs... but you could also have just spent that cash to get qantas club for another year.

So I don't see there being any loss to QF at all.

There was a loss by comparison of a MASA to classic where the points required were less than a classic, sometimes 50% less. And it was these routes that were the most popular at least on this forum for status runs.

 

[medhead]

There was a loss by comparison of a MASA to classic where the points required were less than a classic, sometimes 50% less. And it was these routes that were the most popular at least on this forum for status runs.

I know you've claimed this before. Yet to see it. But [-]even if[/-] accepting it is true beside ditching the product another answer is to fix the pricing.

 

[Deleted User]

I know you've claimed this before. Yet to see it. But even if true beside ditching the product another answer is to fix the pricing.

Agreed medhead... I have done a few MASA's (JASA's)

ADL - PER - ADL for 72,000 points and ~$470 in cash

In my opinion I was not "ripping off" the system... It's a shame for both myself & Qantas that I can't book these after June 30...

I'll be booking a classic, or a cheap Red fare & points upgrade... both of which will produce less revenue for Qantas

If I go down the classic path, the points will be the same, the cash that Qantas will receive will be ~$370 LESS...

Edit: I won't be doing points + pay which is a ridiculous 72,000 points + $1694.00 AUD :shock:

 

[markis10]

I know you've claimed this before. Yet to see it. But even if true beside ditching the product another answer is to fix the pricing.

TSV-DRW Classic 60000, MASA 24000 plus cost of points rewarded which is a lot (3910 for a WP)
ADL-TSV Clasisc 48000, MASA 24000 plus points earned
CBR-HBA Classic 24000, MASA 16000 plus points earned

All in J.

Agree fixing the pricing to reflect true Classic award minimums would have been more palatable.

 

[JohnK]

Agree fixing the pricing to reflect true Classic award minimums would have been more palatable.

But then people would have still complained that Any Seat awards have been devalued.

 

[markis10]

But then people would have still complained that Any Seat awards have been devalued.

Your not living in the real world if you think its possible to please everybody.

 

[medhead]

But then people would have still complained that Any Seat awards have been devalued.

Would they? Seems a big assumption to me.

 

[Deleted User]

Looking at my earlier post, I beleive I'll be saving money under the new rules. And here I thought I might get trapped into status trap. If these changes were made last year it would have saved me quite a lot of money....

 

[markis10]

Looking at my earlier post, I beleive I'll be saving money under the new rules. And here I thought I might get trapped into status trap. If these changes were made last year it would have saved me quite a lot of money....

I think it will save a lot of money for a lot of people, and give the competition a boost as the value proposition slides in their favor. Expect any results after June 30 to show a big drop in QFF redemption's, this will impact the perceived value of the unit in a sell off which of course will impact the share price. As the points lose value, partners will have a closer look at what they are paying for them.

 

[Princess Fiona]

I think it will save a lot of money for a lot of people, and give the competition a boost as the value proposition slides in their favor. Expect any results after June 30 to show a big drop in QFF redemption's, this will impact the perceived value of the unit in a sell off which of course will impact the share price. As the points lose value, partners will have a closer look at what they are paying for them.

This is presuming the majority of QFF are doing the type of redemptions that we would do.
I would suggest that QF think ( ?know) that they are not.
Toaster anyone?

 

[markis10]

This is presuming the majority of QFF are doing the type of redemptions that we would do.
I would suggest that QF think ( ?know) that they are not.
Toaster anyone?

Not at all, its just looking at the ripple effect changes can have both good and bad. That ripple effect has seen MASAs get to the point where QFF think they are used enough to be an issue. Over that time how many people have passed on the tip to others, reinforcing the value they see in QFF points beyond toasters? Those consumers are now smarter with how they earn and burn because they understand the concept that its a currency.

I would expect redemption's will plateau very quickly now for that and other obvious reasons, namely the continuing decline in brand value and the perceived lack of options when it comes to redeeming points for travel overseas, especially away from the east coast customers.

 

[amaroo]

Not at all, its just looking at the ripple effect changes can have both good and bad. That ripple effect has seen MASAs get to the point where QFF think they are used enough to be an issue. Over that time how many people have passed on the tip to others, reinforcing the value they see in QFF points beyond toasters? Those consumers are now smarter with how they earn and burn because they understand the concept that its a currency.

I would expect redemption's will plateau very quickly now for that and other obvious reasons, namely the continuing decline in brand value and the perceived lack of options when it comes to redeeming points for travel overseas, especially away from the east coast customers.

Good. I look forward to being able to secure 4 x award seats easier

 

[markis10]

Good. I look forward to being able to secure 4 x award seats easier

Thats assuming award seats are kept kept their current level, which won't happen as the international fleet continues to shrink, unless you want to ride the orange cancer . FWIW I would attribute the earn changes as being more damaging than the loss of MASAs in the bigger picture, it's clearly aimed at the price sensitive customer rather than those travelling on someone else's dime.

 

[straitman]

I know the conversation has moved on a bit - but my take remains this... mASAs only available when classic was available anyway.

And the surcharge (over and above a classic award) is several hundred dollars... maybe $300 or more. That extra cash payment is the same as a jetstar bundle... and in reality... you might reach gold (lounge access) by getting the SCs... but you could also have just spent that cash to get qantas club for another year.

So I don't see there being any loss to QF at all.

Agreed.

If MASAs are loss making for them, compared to classics, they only have themselves to blame as it is QF, in its wisdom, who set the figures for the add on bundle.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Not at all, its just looking at the ripple effect changes can have both good and bad. That ripple effect has seen MASAs get to the point where QFF think they are used enough to be an issue. Over that time how many people have passed on the tip to others, reinforcing the value they see in QFF points beyond toasters? Those consumers are now smarter with how they earn and burn because they understand the concept that its a currency.

I would expect redemption's will plateau very quickly now for that and other obvious reasons, namely the continuing decline in brand value and the perceived lack of options when it comes to redeeming points for travel overseas, especially away from the east coast customers.

I have absolutely no business sense or acumen behind my thoughts but :
It seems to me that as the QFF program is the most profitable part of QF group anything that has the potential to erode that profitability such as take-up of cheap ASA's is being pulled. We can argue until the cows come home if they were profitable for QFF or not. My own opinion is that if they were profitable they would not be removed.
I seriously doubt that the majority of QF redemptions are meticulously searched through as most do on here. As an example no-one I have ever spoken with outside AFF had any idea that it was possible to earn points and SC on award redemptions or pay a tax bill with a credit card.
I have colleagues with iPads bought on QFF points.
The online commentary on almost every article on Frequent Flyer Redemptions is overwhelmingly negative towards the value of such programs.
I think we are at the end of a bell curve in the QFF community and I fail to see how the ending of MASA's will have any effect (certainly not negative IMO) on QFF's bottom line.

 

[amaroo]

Thats assuming award seats are kept kept their current level, which won't happen as the international fleet continues to shrink, unless you want to ride the orange cancer . FWIW I would attribute the earn changes as being more damaging than the loss of MASAs in the bigger picture, it's clearly aimed at the price sensitive customer rather than those travelling on someone else's dime.

The only downside I see on the award front is a dynamic shift of QFF redeeming seats on CX and BA - reducing the low hanging fruit for family flyers like me.

 

[markis10]

I have absolutely no business sense or acumen behind my thoughts but :
It seems to me that as the QFF program is the most profitable part of QF group anything that has the potential to erode that profitability such as take-up of cheap ASA's is being pulled. We can argue until the cows come home if they were profitable for QFF or not. My own opinion is that if they were profitable they would not be removed.
I seriously doubt that the majority of QF redemptions are meticulously searched through as most do on here. As an example no-one I have ever spoken with outside AFF had any idea that it was possible to earn points and SC on award redemptions or pay a tax bill with a credit card.
I have colleagues with iPads bought on QFF points.
The online commentary on almost every article on Frequent Flyer Redemptions is overwhelmingly negative towards the value of such programs.
I think we are at the end of a bell curve in the QFF community and I fail to see how the ending of MASA's will have any effect (certainly not negative IMO) on QFF's bottom line.

Agree MASA users are the minority, but those users are also influential on how others see the QFF value set. Had that been the only change the effect would not be felt, couple that with the devaluation on earn and I think it will have a noticeable effect on the business case. That effect will be blamed for a fairer and simpler redemption table in the (not quite) foreseeable future.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Those consumers are now smarter with how they earn and burn because they understand the concept that its a currency.

oh no!!

now QF has just made the QFFF program simpler than ever*##... even more people will become savvy!!



*according to 100% senior executives polled

##senior executives may have been sourced from Qantas

 

[medhead]

The dichotomy is that if masa are so trivial then why how do they even make it on the radar for cutting?

Anyway, as I've already said the reduced earning is more than enough reason for me to move flights to VA. The message I get from Qantas is they're not happy with our current relationship. They value my money only at the gold level. I can either accept that or move to an airline that currently values my money at a platinum level.

 

[cove]

I need to make Platinum in this new year by June and pick up Lifetime Gold before becoming Mr Classic is what I have concluded from 42 pages.