Melbourne to Europe in Business

[bam71]

I booked BNE DOH MUC J yesterday using VA points. Kept on getting an error message upon the payment of taxes screen. Finally after a few attempts I logged out of Velocity on all devices, and restarted from scratch. All went through. As an aside note, I’ve also booked separately FCO SIN DPS J on the VA site, and no problems there. No substance at all in saying your cant book ex EU to AU or elswhere.

 

[Vic]

Sorry for asking the obvious. Have you cleared cache and cookies and all that stuff?

@bam71 has reminded me of one of my errors.
On some awards I didn't have enough to pay for the entire award with points. Had to use the slider to add a cash component, but that option was not coming up. Not related to what you've described, sorry.

 

[bam71]

Sorry for asking the obvious. Have you cleared cache and cookies and all that stuff?

@bam71 has reminded me of one of my errors. One some awards I didn't have enough to pay for the entire award with points. Had to use the slider to add a cash component, but that option was not coming up. Not related to what you've described, sorry.

Nah I didnt. That was going to be my next tactic if it didnt work.

 

[Vic]

Nah I didnt. That was going to be my next tactic if it didnt work.

I mean reading your error prompted my brain to remember my error. Not saying I had the same error. But you did remind me...

 

[Deon]

Also have seen something similar to your weird availability thing: I've had cases where J award space has shown up on the velocity site for multiple flights on one day, and then I've clicked to a different day's result and then back onto the original day and they were all gone. I presume it's some dodgy coding by VA's legendary IT team and these were phantom award results that never really existed (rather than someone suddenly booking them all).

Yep, this is exactly the behaviour I'm seeing - here's a video

Even just refreshing the page (without changing the date) will cause it to disappear. Hard to tell which fares are real and which don't even exist.

Edit: Here's an even worse example - 5 flights disappeared this time. I have to say, it feels pretty misleading on VA's part.

 

[k974]

Hi

Sorry to hijack but thought it would be best to consolidate in 1 thread

i have almost the exact same situation as Deon 350,000 Points and Platinum
looking for a trip to Europe in J.

is there any one stop shop to find availability on SG QR and EY,

Not sure if anyone here used them but back in 2013 ish when the AUD and USD was about parity i used to buy the American Airlines miles, you used to then download and pay a subscrition to a programme (the name escapes) me but pretty sure it used to be called KVS Tool and it would do all the searching for you.

does that tool or similar still exist

sorry to hijack but thought as we seeking the same/similar info

Thanks all.

 

[TMP]

Hi

Sorry to hijack but thought it would be best to consolidate in 1 thread

i have almost the exact same situation as Deon 350,000 Points and Platinum
looking for a trip to Europe in J.

is there any one stop shop to find availability on SG QR and EY,

Not sure if anyone here used them but back in 2013 ish when the AUD and USD was about parity i used to buy the American Airlines miles, you used to then download and pay a subscrition to a programme (the name escapes) me but pretty sure it used to be called KVS Tool and it would do all the searching for you.

does that tool or similar still exist

sorry to hijack but thought as we seeking the same/similar info

Thanks all.

No one stop shop, unfortunately

 

[hossein_au]

Hi

Sorry to hijack but thought it would be best to consolidate in 1 thread

i have almost the exact same situation as Deon 350,000 Points and Platinum
looking for a trip to Europe in J.

is there any one stop shop to find availability on SG QR and EY,

Not sure if anyone here used them but back in 2013 ish when the AUD and USD was about parity i used to buy the American Airlines miles, you used to then download and pay a subscrition to a programme (the name escapes) me but pretty sure it used to be called KVS Tool and it would do all the searching for you.

does that tool or similar still exist

sorry to hijack but thought as we seeking the same/similar info

Thanks all.

KVS Tool still exists, but I have always stayed away from it unless I really had to (I do not use Windows, and the KVS Tools developer, rather arrogantly, insists it is the user's fault if they do not use Windows). On occasions when I have bought/used it, I run it in VMware. I believe in voting with my wallet...

The other tool is ExpertFlyer (a subscription-based online tool). You can get a discount code if you are a Gold member in this website.

Before you take the plunge though, make sure the tool you choose does support the airline(s) you want to search; some airlines have been limiting access of 3rd party tools.

P.S: Also check out "award.flight", a free Chrome extension, which might be what do the trick for you.

 

[Ozymandias]

is there any one stop shop to find availability on SG QR and EY,

Not sure if anyone here used them but back in 2013 ish when the AUD and USD was about parity i used to buy the American Airlines miles, you used to then download and pay a subscrition to a programme (the name escapes) me but pretty sure it used to be called KVS Tool and it would do all the searching for you.

does that tool or similar still exist

I was in a similar boat a couple of months ago trying to find J availability to Europe for August this year - if you're averse to spending the money on Expert Flyer, the quickest way I found (which still isn't all that fast, mind) was to do a points search for my dates and then amend the URL to only look for J. That way you just skim the day for the purple 'rewards seats available', rather than having to click into every flight and be disappointed when you only see Y. You still have to manually change the dates and arrival point to try different combos, but it's at least quicker than the alternative.

E.g. change this: book. virginaustralia .com/dx/VADX/#/flight-selection?ADT=1&CHD=0&INF=0&bookingType=flights&promoCode=&class=First&awardBooking=true&channel=&tbOption=0&pos=au-en&cmpid=&date=11-03-2023&activeMonth=11-03-2023&date1=11-24-2023&journeyType=round-trip&origin=BNE&destination=LHR&origin1=LHR&destination1=BNE&dxSlot=0&execution=89964c0b-d3ce-4ed1-ab95-68312c13417b

To this: book. virginaustralia .com/dx/VADX/#/flight-selection?ADT=1&CHD=0&INF=0&bookingType=flights&promoCode=&class=Business&awardBooking=true&channel=&tbOption=0&pos=au-en&cmpid=&date=11-03-2023&activeMonth=11-03-2023&date1=11-24-2023&journeyType=round-trip&origin=BNE&destination=LHR&origin1=LHR&destination1=BNE&dxSlot=0&execution=89964c0b-d3ce-4ed1-ab95-68312c13417b

 

[k974]

thank you all for the replies, very helpful.
think i will go with expert flyer looks to be easier than KVS, altho i used KVS successfully a long time ok.

@ ozymandis thank you for the reply, the links didnt seem to work for me however

just one quick question, which hopefull assist the opening poster as well
say you QR Etihad or SG do you need to convert the miles to their programme?

with American airlines it was any star alliance carrier which seemed easier

thanks

 

[Ozymandias]

@ ozymandis thank you for the reply, the links didnt seem to work for me however

They were just examples, I put spaces in there to avoid the forum automatically turning them into links. You'll have to do your own search first, then edit the URL in your browser to change the bolded section. Or go ahead with Expert Flyer, I expect that'll be quicker anyway.

say you QR Etihad or SG do you need to convert the miles to their programme?

If you're using Velocity points and booking via Virgin's website, no, you'll use Velocity points. The cost will appear in your search results.

 

[k974]

They were just examples, I put spaces in there to avoid the forum automatically turning them into links. You'll have to do your own search first, then edit the URL in your browser to change the bolded section. Or go ahead with Expert Flyer, I expect that'll be quicker anyway.



If you're using Velocity points and booking via Virgin's website, no, you'll use Velocity points. The cost will appear in your search results.

Hi Ozymandis,

thank you so much using that link works perfect ,

one last query , if i search the VA reward section it will bring up any availability be it in EY QR or SG, there is no benefit in searching each airline separately?

thanks for all the replies

 

[Ozymandias]

one last query , if i search the VA reward section it will bring up any availability be it in EY QR or SG, there is no benefit in searching each airline separately?

thanks for all the replies

Happy to help! Yes, it will search all airlines available to use Velocity points on (so the ones you mentioned plus a couple more) so no need to search their websites indvidually.

However, I'd just note that the partner airlines only give a limited number of rewards seats to Virgin and there will likely still be reward seats available directly through their individual points programs - so if you've already looked at an airline's site and see that mismatch, that's why.

 

[MattA]

Happy to help! Yes, it will search all airlines available to use Velocity points on (so the ones you mentioned plus a couple more) so no need to search their websites indvidually.

The only one that *might* be worth searching is SQ, given that Velocity points can be transferred to that program. So any award space that SQ have not made available to VA you can book that directly by transferring your Velocity points across. Technically I think it's supposed to be all "saver" awards on SQ that are made available to VA, but I've seen cases where there's a mismatch. There's also a window where they open up savers to Krisflyer members before they make them available to Velocity at 330 days out. And of course SQ has a higher-priced "advantage" award that is not made available to Velocity at all.

It will cost you a lot more points though, so only worth it if you absolutely have to book on a specific date (and are prepared to pay for the higher Advantage award through SQ), or if you're looking for say 4 seats at almost a year out and don't want to risk some of them being snapped up before the calendar opens up for Velocity.

For example: VA east cost - western Europe in J is 139k Velocity points. The equivalent SQ redemption is 130.5k KF (saver) or 154k KF (advantage). Transferring to KF at 1:1.55 that's ~ 202k or 238k Velocity points (so almost 100k more Velocity points to book an advantage award directly with SQ using points transferred from Velocity vs booking a saver award through Velocity). You will pay lower fees booking direct as you avoid the carrier charges, however. Only really worth it as a last resort, I think.

@Ozymandias thanks for tip on changing the query param to *class=Business* btw. Very helpful! I notice if you use that trick to search on a day where there is no J award availability it drops back to an availability calendar. Haven't been able to work out what availability that calendar is showing, but unfortunately it isn't J award availability (maybe it's just showing any award space?) However, it seems like the 7 day calendar at the top of an individual day's result does respect the *class* parameter so you can sort of see a week at a time that way.

 

[Ozymandias]

The only one that *might* be worth searching is SQ, given that Velocity points can be transferred to that program.

Yep, good point, forgot to mention this. Of course the downside is:

It will cost you a lot more points though, so only worth it if you absolutely have to book on a specific date (and are prepared to pay for the higher Advantage award through SQ), or if you're looking for say 4 seats at almost a year out and don't want to risk some of them being snapped up before the calendar opens up for Velocity.

So you’re bang on, it’s good if you need a specific date but otherwise Velocity bookings are the way to go (although I personally ended up transferring points over and getting an SQ economy flight for returning from Europe because their BCN-MXP-SIN routing simply refused to appear on any date remotely in my window on Virgin’s site).

@Ozymandias thanks for tip on changing the query param to *class=Business* btw. Very helpful! I notice if you use that trick to search on a day where there is no J award availability it drops back to an availability calendar. Haven't been able to work out what availability that calendar is showing, but unfortunately it isn't J award availability (maybe it's just showing any award space?) However, it seems like the 7 day calendar at the top of an individual day's result does respect the *class* parameter so you can sort of see a week at a time that way.

Glad I could help, and that that behaviour wasn’t just happening to me! It’s properly irritating when it drops back to that calendar because it doesn’t seem to match up with the results in the standard search. Just a quirk to deal with I suppose.

 

[MattA]

Glad I could help, and that that behaviour wasn’t just happening to me! It’s properly irritating when it drops back to that calendar because it doesn’t seem to match up with the results in the standard search. Just a quirk to deal with I suppose.

I should caveat my previous comment with the fact that at the moment I'm specifically looking for an award ex Europe for the return leg of an upcoming trip. I have something booked but it's an overnight connection so I'm checking regularly on the (very small) chance something better opens up. It's actually slightly easier to look for award space coming back to Australia with your class=Business trick because VA doesn't sell revenue tickets originating outside AU, so there are no "points plus pay" ones in the results at all and you only see awards (or it drops back to that calendar).

When you try it the other way you get all the 1M+ points ones (like, seriously, who books these?), which makes things a bit harder. Doesn't look like there is a param to filter those out, sadly.

 

[k974]

Thanks again all to who replied

@ MattA thanks for the advice

just wondering do Etihad and Qatar operate the same way , as in not all of their reward seats will always appear on VA and you search each of those like SG,

would you then have the same inefficiency when you convert miles to EY or QR?

thanks

 

[MattA]

Thanks again all to who replied

@ MattA thanks for the advice

just wondering do Etihad and Qatar operate the same way , as in not all of their reward seats will always appear on VA and you search each of those like SG,

would you then have the same inefficiency when you convert miles to EY or QR?

thanks

There's no option for direct conversion from VA to EY/QR, only to SQ. So if you wanted to book direct with those partners you would need to source EY/QR miles elsewhere (either a credit card or, say, buying Avios).

 

[jase05]

would you then have the same inefficiency when you convert miles to EY or QR?

Very easy to check their respective websites to check availability.
Bear in mind you can’t transfer points from VA to either of those programs so you would have to find another way to earn points in those programs such as CC’s or purchase points/miles

 

[k974]

thanks MattA & Jase05 , that makes it very clear

thanks