Need to decide which to earn - Velocity or Krisflyer

[JennyMG]

Hi there,

I need some help determining whether to put my future KF points into Velocity. An experienced KF/Velocity holder should have an opinion, and I'd like to hear it.
As a new FF collector, I have a healthy QFF account, a very minor Velocity account, (which I pool to my husband who has slightly more - but we're concentrating on earning these too now) and new KF and Flying Blue accounts both with 0 points, but which will both be earning flight milesin 6 mths.
In earning points,I was 'trying' to stick to QFF and Velocity,so as not to spread things too thinly. We're not flying for business, or massive earners or anything, so it's just holiday travel and bookings. Aka no status. (yet.)

I have 2 PAID biz class seats from Syd - Sing SQ, and Air France from Sing to CDG, in a few months, and used QFF reward flights for the homeward journey from Europe. In addition there are multiple intercontinental flights which I'll also book Flying Blue partners for.

So I'll be earning some Krisflyer and Flying blue points.
My question here is about the KF. I don't want to spread my points thinly. Although husband and I will be starting to travel a fair bit, it's not in any predictable sort of way. AND we've only just started churning and burning, and earning. (I love doing the credit card thing, but only QFF so far.) If I had to guess, I'd say we'll go on a couple more 'full on' Europe trips, and a fair few Asian / South Pac. trips. over the next 5 years, and maybe more later. (Actually I've never been to Singapore, so this will be a first.)

So. For our SQ J flight, I am at a loss to know whether to accrue the KF points or link the account to Velocity and have them earn V points straight up.
My concerns are, with only one J flight each from Syd to Sing, that's not going to amount to much, but wouldn't they devalue going over to Velocity? Then if I earned V points from that flight instead, what if I want to fly SQ again? is it likely to be much cheaper booking through KF - and would I ever actually have enough poitns to do anything with them anyway?

SQ looks like an airline I am bound to use again. But I know I can do it with Velocity. thing is....Spread thin and keep the value, or transfer and devalue?? I can't work it out.
I guess it's a pretty hard question to answer.

 

[33kft]

There are pros and cons to any program. One concern I'd have about Krisflyer in your situation is point expiry. Whereas with QFF and VFF you can continue to earn points (eg through credit card earn) to retain your current point balance, KF miles expire 36 months after being credited. If you were short on points to make a redemption within 36 months, you could still transfer VFF points across at that point, or perhaps buy KF miles directly to top up, and you would get the benefit of redemptions under SQ's program (good availability and no "fuel tax" on SQ or UA flights).

It is the status that you'd be spreading thin and with the KF program you need to do some reading - it somewhat differs from from the VFF and QFF programs you might be used to. It may also make little sense to progress both VFF and KF status if you aren't traveling regularly, they are different in that KF is a Star Alliance program and VFF is not, so identifying which airlines you are likely to fly and their applicability to VFF status would be key.

Here's some detail on the program: https://theshutterwhale.com/blog/2016/2/16/singapore-airlines-elite-pps-guide

 

[cove]

If you are certain that you will use the Kris Miles -prior to expiry then go Kris.
We have millions warehoused to avoid expiry and these could go to either but preference would be Kris.

 

[maz1]

If you are certain that you will use the Kris Miles -prior to expiry then go Kris.
We have millions warehoused to avoid expiry and these could go to either but preference would be Kris.

What do you mean by 'warehoused to avoid expiry'? I've never heard of that term and I have a problem using my sq miles before they're due to expire
Thanks

 

[Stealthflyer]

I used to credit my points to KrisFlyer but they always expired before I could use them and the highest I ever got to status-wise was silver (I tend to fly on the cheapest economy tickets). After I earned (to me) a surprising number of VA status points flying Delta from Hobart to New York last year, I realised that getting status with VA was far easier than than I thought. And definitely easier than earning status with SQ. I started crediting all my SQ flights to VA and presto, I went from having no status to VA WP within a year. With VA status, I get into the SQ lounges etc when I fly with SQ, so apart from the free seat selection SQ grant their own gold status holders, I don’t really notice much difference.

Also as a plus, when I fly on an SQ operated flight on a VA ticket I get a 100% bonus on points, which amounts to more points than if I were still flying SQ without status. I bought my first J ticket for later this year (I’m so excited!). It’s a VA ticket but operated by SQ (VA was cheaper). I worked out that with the higher earn rate (VA’s 2 vs SQ’s 1.25 points per mile) and the bonus points that come with WP, I’d get over 40k points for the flights on a VA ticket. If I’d bought the ticket through SQ, I’d only earn about 10K points. It’s a no brainer.

 

[JennyMG]

@cove That's the issue, with no set agenda, and no way of knowing exactly when or where we'll be going, I am not sure that I'd definitely use them. But I hope to. SQ is becoming a favourite.

We have millions warehoused to avoid expiry

me too, I'd like to know what you mean.

but it's @Stealthflyer that has virtually answered my question. I

I used to credit my points to KrisFlyer but they always expired before I could use them ......, I realised that getting status with VA was far easier than than I thought. ........With VA status, I get into the SQ lounges etc when I fly with SQ, .......
Also as a plus, when I fly on an SQ operated flight on a VA ticket I get a 100% bonus on points, which amounts to more points than if I were still flying SQ without status. ....... I worked out that with the higher earn rate (VA’s 2 vs SQ’s 1.25 points per mile) and the bonus points that come with WP, I’d get over 40k points for the flights on a VA ticket. If I’d bought the ticket through SQ, I’d only earn about 10K points. It’s a no brainer.

Opinion, reasons. that's what I wanted. choice made. Done. Dusted. Thankyou. I concur. Sounds like your situation is very similar to mine, and your reasoning sound, and correlates with what I've read in regards to pax with irregular travelling situations.
I have used this forum for hours and hours of research (coming just a few months ago from no bookings, no experience and no idea - to a wealth of knowledge, churning cards,amazing growing balances, and 4 FF accounts, two of which (q and Va) are my main ones, and two (KF and FB) are just handy helpers.
I also have booked my SQ J seat for next year, also VERY excited. But it wasn't a reward, it was my return flight from Rome>Syd that is a fullreward flight. Still, NOW I know more, it is THAT SQ J seat that was the 'seat of concern' for me, to keep KF points or transfer them to Vel. I was very buoyed by your points and status story.
So can I ask you @Stealthflyer, do you use QFF points much or stick to Velocity? which is your main focus of collection? and your main method of collection?

 

[coriander]

I "warehouse" my points by keeping a St George Amplify Visa card and an Amex Explorer / Ascent Rewards program, moving them to SQ/KF as required.

 

[Stealthflyer]

do you use QFF points much or stick to Velocity? which is your main focus of collection? and your main method of collection?

Like you, I’m new to this points game. After that previously mentioned Delta flight I started reading up on points, firstly on Point Hacks then more recently on AFF. Before that I’d just credit points to the operating airline’s loyalty scheme (whether it be Korean Airlines, Vietnam etc). It doesn’t really get you anywhere.

My dad has Qantas LTG due to decades of work flights (he was surprised when it appeared in the mail. He doesn’t really care / follow points). I saw the charges he paid when redeeming flights. It was almost the same price in fees to redeem a Sydney to LA flight as it was to buy an economy ticket!! So I dismissed the utility of points for a long time. Of course, now I know that for airlines like VA and SQ, the fees are significantly lower and so I’ve become more interested.

I don’t fly Qantas anymore. The domestic flights are too expensive and infrequent (from HBA) for me, and I’ve had terrible experiences on Qantas international flights. Of the OW partners, the only one I’ve flown with is Qatar (last time they didn’t credit my account with points and I couldn’t be bothered pursuing it). I still have some Qantas points in my account, but not enough to use on a flight redemption.

VA, on the other hand, partners with my preferred airlines. I know the lack of formal alliance annoys some people, but the combo of Delta/Singapore/Etihad is ideal for my flying needs.

As for points, I’m not much of a point collector compared to others on this site. I use Flybuys and transfer to Velocity when they have 15% bonus on transfers. I do occasionally use the Velocity store to purchase goods when there’s a bonus promotion, I need the goods anyway and I don’t mind them knowing what I bought eg. a suitcase from Myer (I always clear the cookies immediately after). I don’t churn CCs. I just don’t want to pay the fees or have it affect my credit score. I got an ANZ travel card this year that came with a 40k point bonus, but I was looking for a cc with no foreign exchange fees anyway so it worked out well. I have no intention of cancelling it just to sign up with another one for the bonus points. Essentially, I always ask myself if I’m being lured into buying something on the basis of points. If so, I reconsider the purchase.

The status points are more important to me than miles. Because I live in Hobart, when I fly internationally I’ll often have to suffer two lay-overs (1 is almost always lengthy) so the lounges make that time much more pleasant. Plus I’m quite nervous about missing flights due to cancellations and delays (based on horrible experiences of strandings in the past). Since gaining status, the airlines are much more helpful when things go wrong.

I should also note that VA has a much better frequency of flights to and from Hobart than it used to, so I fly with them domestically a lot more now. I’ve taken advantage of the two double status points promotions they’ve run this year, which has also helped me gain status. I was lucky in that I was about to book multiple flights each time anyway. Again, it’s my rule: take advantage of the promotions where you can, but don’t be manipulated by airline loyalty programs.

 

[33kft]

It was almost the same price in fees to redeem a Sydney to LA flight as it was to buy an economy ticket!! So I dismissed the utility of points for a long time. Of course, now I know that for airlines like VA and SQ, the fees are significantly lower and so I’ve become more interested.

Err, I'd say this is misleading at best. The QF fees are higher, that is without debate, but characterising them as almost the same cost as buying the ticket even in Y and then suggesting VA is in the same league as SQ in terms of redemption costs is just dragging that point all over the place. Perhaps just simply stating that the fees are lower and keeping the commentary somewhat factual would avoid getting called out for this in the future.

 

[Stealthflyer]

Err, I'd say this is misleading at best. The QF fees are higher, that is without debate, but characterising them as almost the same cost as buying the ticket even in Y and then suggesting VA is in the same league as SQ in terms of redemption costs is just dragging that point all over the place. Perhaps just simply stating that the fees are lower and keeping the commentary somewhat factual would avoid getting called out for this in the future.

It was over $700 in fees and taxes. You can buy a cash ticket for $1000. I’d say that’s near enough.

VA is much lower than QF. Sure, not as low as SQ on international flights, but it’s not incorrect to say they’re lower than QF. I redeemed points for VA domestic flights earlier this year and didn’t have to pay anything.

 

[33kft]

It was over $700 in fees and taxes. You can buy a cash ticket for $1000. I’d say that’s near enough.

So is $200 nearly $1000?

 

[33kft]

VA is much lower than QF. Sure, not as low as SQ, but it’s not incorrect to say they’re lower than QF.

It's not incorrect - your original statement was. The simple factual statement is that the surcharges for Y are:

QF: $203
VA: $60
SQ: $0 (on SQ or UA)

 

[Stealthflyer]

So is $200 nearly $1000?
View attachment 187988

I was asked for my personal experience by the author of this thread and I gave it. I am not quoting the fees for a flight that you’ve looked up right now. I’m quoting the fees for a return flight that I took a few years back. That’s all. And I quoted the fees because I was asked by the original author of this thread why I don’t favour Qantas points. That’s one of the reasons. I don’t know the ins and outs of the programs - and I declared as such. However, I can share my personal experience of the various FF programs as requested.

 

[JennyMG]

and I appreciate the personal experience and the opinion. The rest is just semantics. I completely understand what is being said, that being that Q fees are very high compared to others.
Since I am interested in BOTH QFF and Vel. it was never a question of choosing between the two.
It WAS a question of choosing between KF and V. I am quite in agreeance with Stealth, that in my situation, aka not knowing if I'll use the KF points in time before expiry, then I'm better off earning V points with SQ.
It was my original opinion, and I feel validated.

We differ in that I AM a churner (new to it, but love it.). The above decision affects my churning efforts, as well as my usual earning ones. Again, I felt it was ridiculous to have 4 small pots of points, instead of 1 or 2 large ones, but I didn't want all my eggs in one basket, cutting myself off from other airlines. I think the Vel idea is a good one, as it will open up other airlines to me, without spreading my points from one side of the globe to the other.
'
I was interested to hear the experience with the Velocity status. I'm not sure how I'll go with status, but anyway, it's somethign I can keep in mind. Thankyou all.

 

[maz1]

I "warehouse" my points by keeping a St George Amplify Visa card and an Amex Explorer / Ascent Rewards program, moving them to SQ/KF as required.

Oh well... I usually don't transfer my points from my cc until I'm ready to make a booking but last year I made a rewards booking and then had to cancel so I thought "warehousing" was something clever to combat losing sq miles.. But sadly it's not

 

[Stealthflyer]

Best of luck your collecting, JennyMG! And enjoy that J flight.

 

[cove]

I have both Velocity and Kris and I have never needed to cross redeem nor switch points and miles. To me Kris Miles are for international and Velocity is for domestic.

 

[serfty]

It's not incorrect - your original statement was. The simple factual statement is that the surcharges for Y are:

QF: $203
VA: $60
SQ: $0 (on SQ or UA)

Of course, in July, Qantas halved their economy surcharges for transpacific flights.

 

[33kft]

Of course, in July, Qantas halved their economy surcharges for transpacific fluights.

They did not halve them. MEL to LAX return in Y for example went from $513 previously to $393 now.

 

[serfty]

They did not halve them. MEL to LAX return in Y for example went from $513 previously to $393 now.

They did halve the economy surcharges which is what I posted.

Qantas halved their economy surcharges

YQ went from $240 return to $120.