New Job 80-100% int and dom often at last minute travel advice please :)

[shellthom]

Hi All,

advice wanted:
My partner has been offered a job with a 20k increase in wage (I think it is exactly 15k base but the difference in bonus takes it just shy of 20k)
So given that they have elaborated on the 80-100% travel and it seems like blocks of months in asia and america and where ever else and not daily/weekly travel, although i am sure there will be times when there is.
He doesn't like change and he has never travelled without me.
He is very stressed at this situation now as he will shortly need to quit his current role where he likes the people and the work but not the pay.
To soften the blow he is QF WP until June 2014, we both are, thanks to the advice on here, but we don't know their travel policy yet. The letter of offer will arrive tomorrow but I don't know when he will see the contract.
Any tips, contract must haves, warnings... ?

 

[SeatBackForward]

Hi All,
He doesn't like change and he has never travelled without me.
He is very stressed at this situation now as he will shortly need to quit his current role where he likes the people and the work but not the pay.

My advice, focus more on the above highlighted sections than the pay and travel increases..

 

[shellthom]

My advice, focus more on the above highlighted sections than the pay and travel increases..

Yes we have discussed that. It was a referral by a person who left his company to work at the new and he likes that guy too and while the thought of leaving these people makes him say that he likes them, I usually only hear about how incompetent and annoying they all are and he doesn't even know how they have a job (anywhere not just at his work).
His biggest plan is to take the letter of offer with the wage and bonus on it to his current employer and ask for it to be matched. The issue with that is he may be escorted out of the building instantly so he is also not sure how to do that and keep his job if he wants to stay.

 

[SeatBackForward]

Yes we have discussed that. It was a referral by a person who left his company to work at the new and he likes that guy too and while the thought of leaving these people makes him say that he likes them, I usually only hear about how incompetent and annoying they all are and he doesn't even know how they have a job (anywhere not just at his work).

That could also means hes after a new challenge?

His biggest plan is to take the letter of offer with the wage and bonus on it to his current employer and ask for it to be matched. The issue with that is he may be escorted out of the building instantly so he is also not sure how to do that and keep his job if he wants to stay.

Well even if that happens, and he is forced to leave his current job, he's got the letter of offer in his hand.

But again, my advice, is to make sure the JOB is what he wants, not just the travel or the salary.

 

[shellthom]

That could also means hes after a new challenge?



Well even if that happens, and he is forced to leave his current job, he's got the letter of offer in his hand.

But again, my advice, is to make sure the JOB is what he wants, not just the travel or the salary.

I'll discuss that with him and tell him not to do anything until he has had a full real of the contract/job description. Because it was a referral there are many details about the role that he does not know but I think it was assumed he would know. He only found the ad on Saturday and he had already been offered the role at that stage - this is when we saw the 80-100% travel and a comment was made more recently: "this is a great role for a single person - like you." which made him think maybe its not a great role for him. Up until that point I think he was quite excited about what he had been told, but its become too real all of a sudden and now he's got cold feet...

hmm now maybe this explains why he wont propose

 

[JessicaTam]

Yes we have discussed that. It was a referral by a person who left his company to work at the new and he likes that guy too and while the thought of leaving these people makes him say that he likes them, I usually only hear about how incompetent and annoying they all are and he doesn't even know how they have a job (anywhere not just at his work).
His biggest plan is to take the letter of offer with the wage and bonus on it to his current employer and ask for it to be matched. The issue with that is he may be escorted out of the building instantly so he is also not sure how to do that and keep his job if he wants to stay.

He is unlikely to be escorted out for asking for a pay rise (not that I know the industry he is in, though). I would expect the worst that could occur is that they say no. Especially if he says he was offered this job and that he was not actively looking. Then it is up to your partner to decide to stay or go.

 

[markis10]

He is unlikely to be escorted out for asking for a pay rise (not that I know the industry he is in, though). I would expect the worst that could occur is that they say no. Especially if he says he was offered this job and that he was not actively looking. Then it is up to your partner to decide to stay or go.

I agree, sounds like the company is taking advantage of his likes and loathes to pay below market rates, hence the temptation to look elsewhere. As for the travel, surely they travelled before they met you?? There are also significant advantages for travel re taxation that need to be factored into the equation.

 

[shellthom]

I agree, sounds like the company is taking advantage of his likes and loathes to pay below market rates, hence the temptation to look elsewhere. As for the travel, surely they travelled before they met you?? There are also significant advantages for travel re taxation that need to be factored into the equation.

He got his passport about 2 years after I met him and over a year after we were together I had been overseas a couple times and he refused to come. It wasn't until I was overseas the third time (it could have been the second since we were together) that he got his passport and came and met me in vegas and he has travelled with me ever since. He did go on trips, mostly via car with his parents, before he met me. I think they flew to tassie, he flew to alice to help a friend move to brisbane and he flew as a group to NZ for the rugby a few years ago without me.
Yes I have told him they have been taking advantage of him since he started. He was put on a wage 20k below what he should have started on but it was his graduate job so he took it. He has managed to get 1 good pay increase and that took him up to what he should have started on and he has had to fight hard for any pay increase since then. But his current boss is a scrooge and he hasn't had any decent pay reviews since that guy has been in power.
As a flake about non uni educated call centre person I was making more than him for the first 2 years in his job - and I was pretty much on minimum wage as it was..

He works in the world of marketing and digital - he is not a sales person or marketing person though his contract has a non-compete clause which the company has actually used many times. They escorted a man out of the building in 2009 and paid him for 6 months because he was not allowed to work for the competitor. I believe that they can't win a court case because they can't prevent someone from getting a new job. But they escorted two people off the premises recently that we know of and took one of them to court 3 times (I am guessing they kept loosing but he was in sales). My partner isn't in an area where he would be able to take clients or systems/data to a competitor - thats just not in his area - but he is worried about going to court and all of the above.
This sales guy is the one that wants to work with him again.

 

[docjames]

I am wondering if you need to seek some professional career guidance / advice, or if you (your partner) has a trusted "mentor" with whom to discuss the situation.

 

[harvyk]

Ignoring the travel aspect of the new job, what is it about the work which he will like?

The worst 3 months of my career I spent getting up each morning to trudge into a job which the work was boring, dull and repetitive. The best part was Friday afternoon when I went home. The pay was pretty good, but the work sucked big time, and no the decent pay did not make up for the fact that I hated the job.

In fact I cheered the day I got my graceful exit from the company... (I couldn't quite just quit as a friend had worked hard to get me a job there).

So I'd suggest looking at all aspects of the new job, and not just the travel aspects, as trust me, been in a terrible job is the pits.

 

[shellthom]

Ignoring the travel aspect of the new job, what is it about the work which he will like?

The worst 3 months of my career I spent getting up each morning to trudge into a job which the work was boring, dull and repetitive. The best part was Friday afternoon when I went home. The pay was pretty good, but the work sucked big time, and no the decent pay did not make up for the fact that I hated the job.

In fact I cheered the day I got my graceful exit from the company... (I couldn't quite just quit as a friend had worked hard to get me a job there).

So I'd suggest looking at all aspects of the new job, and not just the travel aspects, as trust me, been in a terrible job is the pits.

Its essentially the same job as the role he started in at his current company only much busier (when he started the sydney office was just being set up so they only had a few accounts but this new company is already in full swing).
I am not sure what about the role would specially warrant all the travel as he is not the sales man, but he does go out to a lot of meetings now as the "other guy" that sales people like to refer too. Often the account managers are so cough at their job (you know managing accounts, expectations and timeframes) that the companies are calling him. He used to answer but no longer does.
This role would have less responsibilities, larger volume but be something that he has been doing - so its not really new or different work as such.

His main concerns are relationship and travel - if he is away 100% of the time never getting to see me or the cat, wear and tear on his body and emotional toll etc but if it is for months at a time I think thats not too much travel (like not a flight to uk and back then a flight to perth and back in a week - thats a lot of travel) but he will be away from me and while I can be a needy whingey girl he is worse so it will take a toll.

He is also concerned about the large volume of work. It is possible that he already does as much or more than they are expecting as he does his job and most of that of those beneath him because of their incompetence but the fact that they told him large volume kind of scared him.

We have a mentor it is a husband of my friend, he is very wise and in a similar field just a different industry (digital marketing but he is an accountant and my partner is ... I don't even know.. his job title is so far removed from his role its not funny.. but technical project manager). The only problem is that the mentor doesn't travel for personal or for work so can't give any insight into what that might be like for him. But he has raised many of the same points as everyone here and we have discussed a lot of it.
When I told him I was asking on here though he was very interested in what people would say as we know a lot of you have jobs like this.

The other issue is he knows that if a job is cough or boring I won't stick in it. I will just go out and get another. Having never quit a job before I think he is worried that he will turn into me or be stuck in a job he hates because he has no financial viability to leave it.

 

[badseed]

I'd be careful with the no-complete clause. Whilst some do indeed get struck down by courts as an unreasonable restraint of trade, most these days are well drafted and would take a lot of time and money in litigation (whether real or threatened) to resolve.

If it's a clearly identified and worded clause in an employment contract that your partner has signed there'll be a presumption that he intended to be bound by the clause.

 

[shellthom]

I'd be careful with the no-complete clause. Whilst some do indeed get struck down by courts as an unreasonable restraint of trade, most these days are well drafted and would take a lot of time and money in litigation (whether real or threatened) to resolve.

If it's a clearly identified and worded clause in an employment contract that your partner has signed there'll be a presumption that he intended to be bound by the clause.

I have asked him to bring me a copy of his current contract as I doubt it is well written at all.
He was once given a contract to sign which stated only: your role duties will be to perform your role
He had to wait 6 weeks for them to draft a contract that stated duties relating to his role - he had a title change and it appears no one in the company had been that title before.
He thinks it says - you will not work for a competitor.. i asked if it was more specific. I think that is too vague for any judgement to be against him.
Yes they went to town on lawsuits with some people so it is not an aspect that is taken lightly.

 

[simongr]

Personally I wouldn't touch a job with that much travel unless I was single, had no pets and was an alcoholic - as you are pretty much going to end up in that position not long after taking the role.

I only travel one day per week but the grind of the trips to the airport, from the airport in the air really does take a toll.

Unless you can really maximise your time together when you aren't travelling then it almost would be like not being together. Not sure if kids are on the cards but it would be nigh on an impossible situation if they were...

 

[shellthom]

Personally I wouldn't touch a job with that much travel unless I was single, had no pets and was an alcoholic - as you are pretty much going to end up in that position not long after taking the role.

I only travel one day per week but the grind of the trips to the airport, from the airport in the air really does take a toll.

Unless you can really maximise your time together when you aren't travelling then it almost would be like not being together. Not sure if kids are on the cards but it would be nigh on an impossible situation if they were...

kids would be a nightmare for me so no issues not having them.
I usually try to work as little a year as possible - worked only 3 months this calendar year so far - but if I were to travel to where he is working I would need a job to pay for that probably so there could still be some extensive time apart if I kept that up.

He lived in the same house until he was 25 (in newcastle) then he spent half a year on his brothers lounge when he got the job in sydney before admitting that he actually lived with me and we still live in the same place. So he's only ever lived in 2.5 places.
I am worried that this might be an issue for him. I am not sure he has thought about it. But it is lumped in there with the whole - he doesn't like change statement.
He was an alcy when I met him but he was still at uni... we will see if that has changed any on Sat at the mid year xmas party...

 

[shellthom]

I agree, sounds like the company is taking advantage of his likes and loathes to pay below market rates, hence the temptation to look elsewhere. As for the travel, surely they travelled before they met you?? There are also significant advantages for travel re taxation that need to be factored into the equation.

Is this something a normal accountant will know about or do we need to seek out one that deals with this kind of thing.

 

[shellthom]

Personally I wouldn't touch a job with that much travel unless I was single, had no pets and was an alcoholic - as you are pretty much going to end up in that position not long after taking the role.

I only travel one day per week but the grind of the trips to the airport, from the airport in the air really does take a toll.

Unless you can really maximise your time together when you aren't travelling then it almost would be like not being together. Not sure if kids are on the cards but it would be nigh on an impossible situation if they were...

Do you feel the same if your travel was for blocks of months at a time so you were taking minimal flights but away from home?
I think he has decided to give it a go for a year (unless he can get his salary matched but even then he might still leave as the new offers more opportunity at this stage)

 

[markis10]

Is this something a normal accountant will know about or do we need to seek out one that deals with this kind of thing.

Yes, a good accountant! There are determinations that allow for travel allowances to be paid with no deduction of tax and for substantiation to be minimal for actual costs re accommodation and meals, I suspect its an area many pay more tax than they need to when there are legal options!

 

[simongr]

Do you feel the same if your travel was for blocks of months at a time so you were taking minimal flights but away from home?
I think he has decided to give it a go for a year (unless he can get his salary matched but even then he might still leave as the new offers more opportunity at this stage)

I personally couldn't go away for months at a time - but that is because I have young son at home, I would miss my wife and it wouldn't be fair on her being home alone with him without help. But that is my stage in life.

At this point the perfect job for me would be 2 - 3 week/two week trips internationally with up to 10 overnights domestically - if only I could put that into the SEEK search engine...

 

[SeatBackForward]

I personally couldn't go away for months at a time - but that is because I have young son at home, I would miss my wife and it wouldn't be fair on her being home alone with him without help. But that is my stage in life.

At this point the perfect job for me would be 2 - 3 week/two week trips internationally with up to 10 overnights domestically - if only I could put that into the SEEK search engine...

I'm quite fortunate in that sense, my o/s trips are generally between 3-5 days away from home, and domestics are arely more than 2days/2nights away. If i had ot be away for weeks and weeks or even months away at a time, I'd either ask for my family to join me and be looked after, or tell them its not possible.

To the OP, the other thing to bear in mind, if your partner is likely to be away for long periods, is it long periods away from home and in one spot, or long periods away from home in multiple spots? Its a subtle but important difference. If he's going to be away from home but sitll jetting about, there's probably not much point in you being away also.