OZ world cup bid

[anat0l]

...Israel, one of the few democracies in that region....

Apart from the fact that we've witnessed many times the atrocities of democracy (including in this country), I don't see how Israel barely constitutes a democracy itself.

The non-recognition of Israel by Muslim countries has almost nothing to do with political forms of government. But oddly enough Qatar did say that they would allow Israel to compete if it came to it. Of course, that statement means nothing - you could be an Israeli fan and go to Qatar for the games, and never return home. Or, we might see another Munich incident again, but this time the host jurisdiction won't be as sympathetic as the Germans.

Although people can wail about the environmental and climatic woes, no one cares about them (unfortunately!). People will sit in stadiums cooled to 27 degC and of course they won't have an environmental conscience. Obviously, FIFA doesn't have one either, but then again name a non-environmental international body that does.

This could be a sporting flop reminiscent of the Delhi Commonwealth Games. I guess we'll find out in 12 years. Could be a very different world then.

And for all the Australians who think we got gypped, take a page from your own bible: "Suck it up and move on." If you wanted to get anything from a panel of a**holes, then you'd better train to be a better kisser.

Oh and I'm jealous of Sarah Palin. She only has to open her bedroom window to have the best views of World Cup 2018!

Oh please be more pretentious. Sarah Palin couldn't see past her nose even if she had plastic surgery.

 

[medhead]

Oh please be more pretentious. Sarah Palin couldn't see past her nose even if she had plastic surgery.

I don't think that was pretentious at all. You'll probably find that is a reference to one of the more stupid things that palin said during the last presidential election.

 

[samh004]

Apart from the social conservatism and oppressive liquor laws, it should also be noted that Qatar does not recognise Israel, one of the few democracies in that region, and has a defense pact with Iran... freedom haters. I sure hope the World Cup will change Qatar and the Middle Eastern region for the better, but I'm not holding my breath.

One of their selling points was that they’d try to bridge the gap between the muslim countries and Israel. I doubt they’d back out, they’d just have a boycott and probably some angry Israeli’s bombing their country. Wouldn’t do much good.

Apart from the fact that we've witnessed many times the atrocities of democracy (including in this country), I don't see how Israel barely constitutes a democracy itself.

The non-recognition of Israel by Muslim countries has almost nothing to do with political forms of government. But oddly enough Qatar did say that they would allow Israel to compete if it came to it. Of course, that statement means nothing - you could be an Israeli fan and go to Qatar for the games, and never return home. Or, we might see another Munich incident again, but this time the host jurisdiction won't be as sympathetic as the Germans.

I’m not sure it’ll matter by then, but if such an incident were to occur and the world remained relatively unchanged, I’m sure the US would have a surplus of ordnance they’d want to test by then, were a country with religious views differing to their own likely to let such an act occur without trying to prevent it.

2022 - World Cup Qatar

2023 - What’s Qatar? It’s not there anymore.

I’ll agree with you about Israel though, but I don’t think Qatar would be silly enough to not provide adequate security and protect Israeli fans and sports stars. Such a screw up wouldn’t see them capitalise after the world cup very well…

I don't think that was pretentious at all. You'll probably find that is a reference to one of the more stupid things that palin said during the last presidential election.

It was a wonderful comment taken out of context, but then she is an idiot.

 

[Keith009]

Apart from the fact that we've witnessed many times the atrocities of democracy (including in this country), I don't see how Israel barely constitutes a democracy itself.

Not sure what you're alluding to but last I checked Israel is a parliamentary democracy operating under a proportional representation system. And it's not one of those quote unquote democracies either. If anything the PR system they use (very low quota), coupled with Israel's domestic issues relating to religion and the Palestinian conflict, tends to produce rather fragile coalition governments. Relative to a lot of the totalitarian and freedom hating regimes in that bit of the world, Israel almost seems a democratic utopia. And indeed, it is admirable how they've managed to build a beautiful democracy in the face of much unwarranted hostility in the region which they've had to constantly defend themselves against from Day 1 (they could've simply taken the easy way out and declared martial law for instance or degenerated into lesser forms of governance). And I did not mention nor imply that the non recognition of Israel is to do with political governance....

I don't mind losing out to the US (a sentiment emphatically reciprocated by everyone I've spoken to in SF) or even Japan, not so sure about Korea given the reasons stated in an earlier post, but Qatar... please! When was the last time Qatar even qualified for the World Cup? Not to mention the numerous environmental, political, social and security concerns that wouldn't be as much of a hurdle in any of the other candidates.

Oh well, hopefully some good comes out of it, not the least of which their attitudes towards Israel. Doha was a hole when I went to check out the W there this time last year. Hosting the World Cup should give it a little more buzz.

 

[Keith009]

I don't think that was pretentious at all. You'll probably find that is a reference to one of the more stupid things that palin said during the last presidential election.

Though that comment might have made sense if Sarah Palin lives in Little Diomede island:
YouTube - CNN: Palin Has Never Seen Russia From Alaska

 

[ejb]

I find it funny that everyone is bagging FIFA for being corrupt because we lost but if we had won the system would be fine.

I would guess (and it is a guess I am not claiming to be an expert) that about 10% of Australians would have actually cared and the rest could not give a s&^t.

I fall into the 90% group and doubt we would have had the money to stage the event. In Australia soccer is a kids sport mainly and I feel we should put our efforts into other events.

Release the abuse

ejb

 

[codash1099]

Not sure what you're alluding to but last I checked Israel is a parliamentary democracy operating under a proportional representation system. And it's not one of those quote unquote democracies either. If anything the PR system they use (very low quota), coupled with Israel's domestic issues relating to religion and the Palestinian conflict, tends to produce rather fragile coalition governments. Relative to a lot of the totalitarian and freedom hating regimes in that bit of the world, Israel almost seems a democratic utopia. And indeed, it is admirable how they've managed to build a beautiful democracy in the face of much unwarranted hostility in the region which they've had to constantly defend themselves against from Day 1 (they could've simply taken the easy way out and declared martial law for instance or degenerated into lesser forms of governance). And I did not mention nor imply that the non recognition of Israel is to do with political governance....

I don't mind losing out to the US (a sentiment emphatically reciprocated by everyone I've spoken to in SF) or even Japan, not so sure about Korea given the reasons stated in an earlier post, but Qatar... please! When was the last time Qatar even qualified for the World Cup? Not to mention the numerous environmental, political, social and security concerns that wouldn't be as much of a hurdle in any of the other candidates.

Oh well, hopefully some good comes out of it, not the least of which their attitudes towards Israel. Doha was a hole when I went to check out the W there this time last year. Hosting the World Cup should give it a little more buzz.

I had thought of entering this argument, but you have basically said it all.

 

[anat0l]

...reply here...

I had thought of entering this argument, but you have basically said it all.

I had thought about writing a torrid rebuttal, but I'd probably need a new laptop after I vent. So I won't.

I don't mind losing out to the US (a sentiment emphatically reciprocated by everyone I've spoken to in SF)

That seems rather obvious, unless SFO is known to be particularly anti-American.

 

[medhead]

I don't mind losing out to the US (a sentiment emphatically reciprocated by everyone I've spoken to in SF)

That seems rather obvious, unless SFO is known to be particularly anti-American.

Why the need to be anti-american. The key word is reciprocated. The way I read that is that QF009 doesn't mind losing out to the US and the US people in SF reciprocate by not minding if the US lose out to Australia.

 

[Keith009]

Why the need to be anti-american. The key word is reciprocated. The way I read that is that QF009 doesn't mind losing out to the US and the US people in SF reciprocate by not minding if the US lose out to Australia.

Wot he said.

And no not a surprise that FIFA is corrupt. The only surprise is people who are surprised. We were simply outfoxed by everyone else. FIFA appears to be more political than political parties.

 

[Must...Fly!]

'They lied to Frank' | Perth Now

I thought that was a good read. (Although the first line reads like it was written by an avid football hater to try and turn the story anti-soccer)

AUSTRALIA'S 2022 World Cup consultant Peter Hargitay has refused to take responsibility for the bidding debacle and claims he was paid "a pittance".

The controversial insider claims that "a devastated" Sepp Blatter contacted him after Qatar was announced as host.
Hargitay said he was paid just $381,000 for two years work, considerably less than the $1.65m base fee that has been quoted.
He said Australia had been "conned" and believes Frank Lowy's team suffered the same fate as England and the US.
"The Australian bid employed 25 people, am I the only one (held accountable)? It's convenient," he said.
"Frank had more access to the FIFA President (Blatter) than anybody I know, because I arranged it.
"He could speak to them (FIFA exco members) anywhere he wanted.
"But what can you do if people lie to your face? They lied to Frank's face.
"If a guy comes at 5pm the evening before, shakes hands and tells you I'm voting for you, then doesn't, there's nothing you can do about it."
Hargitay and Australia's 2022 advisers Andreas Abold and Fedor Radmann have come under fire for a two-year campaign that concluded with one vote.
Cypriot Marios Lefkaritis, Turkey's Senes Erzik and one of the African voters are believed to be among those who did an about-turn.
"We started with six votes, maybe seven, but a number of people lied to Frank's face," Hargitay said.
"I couldn't believe it and I didn't see it coming."
Hargitay said he was surprised that Qatar won and claimed they were not a popular choice.
"Blatter called us after the vote and he was devastated," he said.
Hargitay claimed local backlash towards him was uncalled for, especially when taking into account his claimed fee.
"Millions: are you kidding me?" he said.
"I took this ridiculous salary, which is the lowest fee we got in years, because of Frank.
"I wasted two years of my life for a pittance. We got $391,000 in two years for a team of four people, and I have the contract."

 

[drron]

I thought this article in the SMH was spot on-
Misguided bid proved we're not ready to host the globe

Our handling of the bid was very poor.
Even our attempts at corruption were amateur hour stuff-
FIFA investigation clears Australian World Cup bid | The Daily Telegraph
Secret millions grease World Cup bid
Our 2 lobbyists supposedly with close ties to FIFA execs were paid $4.84 million and would have received another $6.5 million if we had won.It was an expensive vote.

 

[Keith009]

I thought they sent a couple of the Socceroos to Zurich? But yes having Elle Macpherson front the bid was an odd decision.

Our handling of the bid was very poor.
Even our attempts at corruption were amateur hour stuff-

Maybe they should've hired a couple of political hacks instead.

 

[JohnK]

I would guess (and it is a guess I am not claiming to be an expert) that about 10% of Australians would have actually cared and the rest could not give a s&^t.

I would be surprised if the number of Australians who care was anywhere near 10%. I heard one news story a few days before the bid result was due to be announced and then nothing until this thread. Not one person I know has even mentioned it in conversation. Does it really matter where the event is staged?

 

[ejb]

I would be surprised if the number of Australians who care was anywhere near 10%. I heard one news story a few days before the bid result was due to be announced and then nothing until this thread. Not one person I know has even mentioned it in conversation. Does it really matter where the event is staged?

As most people would be watching the cup on TV I guess it does not make much difference where it is held.

ejb

 

[JohnK]

As most people would be watching the cup on TV I guess it does not make much difference where it is held.

True.

And I also forgot to mention that the discussion is about an event that is 12 years away. :shock:

 

[simongr]

I would be surprised if the number of Australians who care was anywhere near 10%. I heard one news story a few days before the bid result was due to be announced and then nothing until this thread. Not one person I know has even mentioned it in conversation. Does it really matter where the event is staged?

It certainly does matter where it is staged. They should be taking football to where people actually watch it (hence Australia was always an outside chance).

FIFA are a disgrace - they have changed the selection system twice in recent years to favour their own objectives. England has one of the most widely watched leagues in the world, stadia of the required standard are already in place and people would not have to travel far to actually see multiple matches.

Sadly the English elected not to bribe officials much like the Australians and we see exactly what result that yields.

 

[JohnK]

Sadly the English elected not to bribe officials much like the Australians and we see exactly what result that yields.

You do have a good point there about England being able to organise a good World Cup with most of the infrastructure already in place.

Sadly though corruption is clearly occuring with no one prepared to do anything about it.

 

[kamchatsky]

You do have a good point there about England being able to organise a good World Cup with most of the infrastructure already in place.

Sadly though corruption is clearly occuring with no one prepared to do anything about it.

And the one I really feel sorry for is Frank Lowy. Sure he is rich guy, but football is his true passion, and he has spent a lot of his time promoting Aussie football, getting us to AFC from OFC as well as reforming Football in Australia, not to mention the blood sweat tears he spent on this bid, and only got 1 vote out of it. Without him, football won't be what it is today.

 

[oz_mark]

And the one I really feel sorry for is Frank Lowy. Sure he is rich guy, but football is his true passion, and he has spent a lot of his time promoting Aussie football, getting us to AFC from OFC as well as reforming Football in Australia, not to mention the blood sweat tears he spent on this bid, and only got 1 vote out of it. Without him, football won't be what it is today.

Maybe he needs to buy a football club, like businessmen from Russia and Qatar have. Not that I am suggesting anything.