Qantas changed my classic reward seat from business to economy

[JohnK]

What is QF supposed to do in this situation? Fork out its own cash to buy replacement flights on other carriers for every single QFF member with a QFF reward booking on another carrier that has been stuffed up by that other carrier? Most of the current call centre staff wouldn't have a clue how to do it and probably lack the authority to do it anyway. Offering a full refund seems like a sensible option. The QFF member will be disappointed but what is the realistic alternative?

From what I understand airlines never pay each other full price for seats. They have some sort of arrangement in place?

In this situation Qantas needs to discuss with the other airline and find reasonable solution. Offering refund at last minute is not a good look. It's awful.

The other thing Qantas has done horribly wrong. Stop outsourcing. This is not the way of the future. It's counter productive.

Bring call centres back to Australia and hire more staff. The phone should be answered in less than 1 minute with competent staff that can fix issues.

This is called customer service. Customer care....

 

[Matt_01]

@serfty looking at the time stamps we were both responding at the same time. I agree with the comment around the carrier providing an alternate option and in some cases this may not be the prefered option however if on points or a revenue fare if the flight is cancelled or the flight time changes one needs to accept this or change their plans. I do have empathy for those that get can only get through to the offshore call centers however some of the local teams are also not that well trained. I call the VIP team yesterday the call was answered by an AU agent, when I requested seats to be released I was informed there was nothing she do as there were no seats that could be requested. This came as a surprise as I could see x2 seats in the D on EF, I mentioned that QF will release seats from D and I for P1s and at that stage she mentioned that she was not part of the VIP team and was taking overflow calls. My point is that even if people get through to the AU call center some of these staff do not even know what can/not be booked. As for ticketing times this was an issue prior to Covid and I had lost flights on EK, QR and JL however QF had always been able to get them back and I suspect they only put in some additional effort to get them back due to my status.

 

[RooFlyer]

Knowing Anna's background, I'm going to leave myself wide open here, but here goes

What is QF supposed to do in this situation? Fork out its own cash to buy replacement flights on other carriers for every single QFF member with a QFF reward booking on another carrier that has been stuffed up by that other carrier?

I know in part you are expressing and I'm quoting only one side of the equation , but ...
Its not necessarily that the other carrier has 'stuffed up'. Just a cancellation, which we accept happens from time to time. QF should 'make good' the situation that they took payment for. They should explore all the options - getting a new seat released, making one of its own Award seats available, using an indirect route, releasing a revenue seat, going outside OneWorld (which has been done before). Yes, it may cost them money - else the customer pays either in lost opportunity or lost $$ for connections and bookings foregone if its cancelled. Multi-billion corporation Vs individuals. Who should pay?

But another part of me thinks travel generally is still clawing its way out of the pandemic mess, and why should QF be held responsible in this unstable environment to rebook pax where other airlines have changed flights that were scheduled perhaps many months prior? I don't see how QF can force another airline to make a reward seat available for a QFF member, and QF probably can't afford to stump up cash for replacement flights for every QFF member who finds their reward booking on another carrier has been rescheduled or cancelled.

First, Qantas is primarily responsible in these cases because 1) they have received payment and 2) they are the organiser. No matter if the flights are on their own metal or others - its been paid for to Qantas Who else is responsible? The customer? Has no standing with the other airline. The other airline? The customer isn't their customer. Airlines know better than us about the risk of cancellations. Presumably Qantas could see the problems in their own opertions coming (maybe they didn't ) so should have know it was a looming issue with others.

As for forcing a seat. I don't know the ins and outs of the oneWorld Agreement, but I'm guessing there must be something to cover this situation; but if there are simply no seats on the booked airline, again, Qantas should 'make good' some other way. Not just dump it back to the customer 'we'll refund the points' - leaving the costs etc of the rest of the itinerary, hotels etc on the customer's account.

As being able to afford to make good - well, you'd know better than me - that's a question of insolvency, isn't it? Now, we know that the airline would be able to fund replacements, it would just be chronically expensive. Maybe a hit to the bottom line would make them more cautious in their dealings. QFF is a huge profit centre for them - its not as if they are going to stop making award flights available.

when booking booking on partner airlines QF is nothing more than a TA and points are the currency. As I do not use TA's following comment may or may not be be correct, if a TA makes a booking and then the carrier changes/ cancels and impacts the travellers plan is it the TAs fault, is the TA expect to pay for another flight etc.

I don't think the analogy about Qantas being a glorified TA is accurate on a number of fronts.

I have no contract with my TA, other than one of good faith. They arrange services, they don't supply. I do not pay my TA - they receive commissions from the airlines (this may change with commissions being slashed).

With Qantas taking my points in exchange for an Award seat on their metal or others: I have a formal contract with them (ticket with 081- number) - no matter that its infinitely flexible in their favour, it is a formal relationship. Qantas receives payment from me for services to be delivered. Qantas has a formal relationship with other carriers if they are involved.

If the services the TA arranges for me cannot be provided, no, it isn't the TA's fault and they are not expected to pay. They are expected to use best endeavours to rectify (something Qantas isn't doing at the moment). But again, they are merely an agent - my 'contract' is with Qantas, directely via the ticket.

 

[encryptededdy]

My wife extended with our 2 kids and qantas wanted to charge us $14k for one way back! They are absolute criminals! They are price gauging and taking advantage of passengers any way they can and ripping everybody off!

I do agree that's quite expensive but it sounds like you're trying to book (well, change) tickets very close in, on a route (Australia to/from North America) that's highly congested right now. I doubt any other nonstop airline is any cheaper.

For instance, Delta on DL41 from LAX to SYD for 3 pax on July 14 one way has no space left in economy, and is US$28,000 in Premium Economy. United wants US$19,000 from SFO.

The price is high but there's only so much capacity on this route, especially this close in

Assuming this is how close in you're trying to book, then I'm inclined to even say good on Qantas for the goodwill gesture of waiving your $14k fare difference entirely.

they still can’t seat them together because the system said it doesn’t let them and all seats are restricted and the flight was 3 weeks away.

Many of the flights out of the US are practically full, so if there's no 3 contiguous seats then there's no 3 contiguous seats. That's what you have to deal with when booking this close in. It sounds like there may be "restricted" seats restricted for elites, but I don't think they'd open them for you just because you booked late.

If you give us the flight number we can have a look. Your best bet is to try to seat select 80 hours before the flight when all the seats become unrestricted.

Edit: you mentioned you were booking 3 weeks out, but the same still applies (this is me searching 3 weeks into the future, apologies for the NZD). I recognise one-way tickets are often not the same price as return, but my point is it's unfortunately more or less normal right now for the prices to be astronomical on any airline.

 

[VPS]

Absolutely appalling !
I booked a return flight from Syd to US for me and my family 2 adults 2 kids for $9k. My wife extended with our 2 kids and qantas wanted to charge us $14k for one way back! They are absolute criminals! They are price gauging and taking advantage of passengers any way they can and ripping everybody off! I called over 10 times spent over 12 hrs on phone all up . Spoke to Cape Town , Fiji , Phillipines they were all incompetent and had no idea. I threatened legal action and told them I was going to the AVA.. after Persisting I was not going to pay them a cent! They finally issued me a ticket for no charge. But now they have seated my 2yr old and 4yr old in different rows away from their mother! And they still can’t seat them together because the system said it doesn’t let them and all seats are restricted and the flight was 3 weeks away. These people have no idea!! No idea!! Allan Joyce got to go!! How can u sit a 2yr old away from their mother on a 15hr flight! Because seats are restricted.
Absolute joke! Im seating fighting and still want compensation . They return home 14th July . Good luck to anyone dealing with qantas customer service. Good luck

Welcome to AFF - to be fair you made a change and flights are scarce and prices are at a premium.

I'm sure you don't mean the AVA because the Australian Veterinary Association will be no help. Also I'm not sure what you expect someone to do when it is you who has instigated the change. Most of the other complaints are where Qantas has made an error

 

[drron]

And my TA is far better at fixing QF instigated disruptions than QF. A suitable replacement found before I even know of the problem such as the Great QF Shutdown.

 

[AJEVA]

I do agree that's quite expensive but it sounds like you're trying to book (well, change) tickets very close in, on a route (Australia to/from North America) that's highly congested right now. I doubt any other nonstop airline is any cheaper.

For instance, Delta on DL41 from LAX to SYD for 3 pax on July 14 one way has no space left in economy, and is US$28,000 in Premium Economy. United wants US$19,000 from SFO.

The price is high but there's only so much capacity on this route, especially this close in

Assuming this is how close in you're trying to book, then I'm inclined to even say good on Qantas for the goodwill gesture of waiving your $14k fare difference entirely.

Many of the flights out of the US are practically full, so if there's no 3 contiguous seats then there's no 3 contiguous seats. That's what you have to deal with when booking this close in. It sounds like there may be "restricted" seats restricted for elites, but I don't think they'd open them for you just because you booked late.

If you give us the flight number we can have a look. Your best bet is to try to seat select 80 hours before the flight when all the seats become unrestricted.

Edit: you mentioned you were booking 3 weeks out, but the same still applies (this is me searching 3 weeks into the future, apologies for the NZD). I recognise one-way tickets are often not the same price as return, but my point is it's unfortunately more or less normal right now for the prices to be astronomical on any airline.
View attachment 284211

Thanks for feedback. Flight number is QF8 on jul12. There is no way they can allow a 2yr old sitting on their own for 15.5yrs and a 4yr old..

 

[Princess Fiona]

Thanks for feedback. Flight number is QF8 on jul12. There is no way they can allow a 2yr old sitting on their own for 15.5yrs and a 4yr old..

They won’t. They will fix it at the airport.

 

[encryptededdy]

Thanks for feedback. Flight number is QF8 on jul12. There is no way they can allow a 2yr old sitting on their own for 15.5yrs and a 4yr old..

It looks like there's only one set of workable seats, and it's 44 H/J/K

Maybe others can chime in, but I think 44 H/J/K is only bookable for status holders? However it's less than 80 hours until the flight, so it should be available for you to select now, even if it wasn't before (if my time zone math is correct), so you should go rush onto manage my booking right now and go select those seats.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

If a partner airline changes schedule or cancels a QFFF issued award, QF should, as agent for that other airline, enforce the terms and conditions of contract of carriage. For OW airlines they almost invariably say that if a flight is cancelled you will be reaccommodated on the next available flight, or another flight of the customer’s choosing, or a refund.

Obviously the passenger wants (a) or (b). Qf should work with the partner to achieve that.

In cases where QF cancels a seat and can’t get it back, it is their error and they should pay for or arrange a replacement. It seems a breach of contract, with available remedies?

In cases where Qf cancels or downgrades one of their flights due to operator error, simple that QF can convert a paid seat to revenue.