Qantas Increases Legroom Charges; Changes to Row 4 selection on most 737 flights

[serfty]

There will also be less availability for WP.

Every row four seat selected and paid for by SG and below between T-80 and T-24 reduces availability for WP to select for free at T-24.

@madrooster has indicated this will not be the case. Only change is that if a non P1/CL can select it at T-80, they will need to pay.

"PCV" came into it and still will.

The mix of status pax and their PCV scores on the flight will continue to determine what rows are visible, eg. on a elite-lite flight, row 4 will likely be visible to most if not all pax, whereas on a elite-heavy flight, row 4 may only be visible to P1 or a high PCV platinum.

 

[I love to travel]

But why 'clamp down on it'? People were selecting seats as they were allowed to. This isn't about 'clamping down', its revenue raising and another diminution of Plat benefits.

And in any case this has been " a thing" for years so no urgency. They are just dumping a whole lot of bad news lately about new and or increased fees.

 

[RooFlyer]

And in any case this has been " a thing" for years so no urgency. They are just dumping a whole lot of bad news lately about new and or increased fees.

You'd think the 'bad news' would be mixed in with the 'da-dah!!' good news. So ....

 

[elanshin]

You'd think the 'bad news' would be mixed in with the 'da-dah!!' good news. So ....

Classic + is good news ! (At least to them).

 

[Spacetravel]

But why 'clamp down on it'? People were selecting seats as they were allowed to. This isn't about 'clamping down', its revenue raising and another diminution of Plat benefits.

Well maybe a better choice of words would be “exploit the opportunity for extra revenue” QF saw an increase in demand of people using the T80 rule so some bright spark said “what if we charge for it?”.

 

[Captain Halliday]

@madrooster has indicated this will not be the case. Only change is that if a non P1/CL can select it at T-80, they will need to pay.

"PCV" came into it and still will.

This is my point.

At T-80, all those below WP will be able to select row 4 for a fee.

So by the time T-24 rolls around, it’s likely there will be fewer seats available in Row 4 for WP to select for free as pax with lower status may have paid for them in the previous 56 hours.

It’s a clear devaluation for WP IMHO.

 

[oz_mark]

@madrooster has indicated this will not be the case. Only change is that if a non P1/CL can select it at T-80, they will need to pay.

"PCV" came into it and still will.

Problem is that many of the blogs have made out that at T-80 it becomes a free-for-all. It never really was, that way but sometimes looked that way. Hence we got the 'doesn't T-80 work anymore' type posts.

 

[serfty]

At T-80, all those below WP will be able to select row 4 for a fee.

NO - As per @madrooster's post, only those who's PCV would currently allow them access to select seats in row 4 at T-80 would be able to select after this change. The difference is they will have to pay for it at T-80.

 

[FlyingKangaroo]

And yet another "enhancement" that again validates my decision to shift most of my domestic flying to VA. Sitting in Row 3 for consistently half the price of QF.

 

[DC3]

Maybe, with some AFFers jumping from the QF ship, we that are left may fare better?

 

[Bugalugz]

Thing that annoys me the most is there has been 0 investment in the 737 fleet which we all suffer on regularly, least VA putting new seats in and making it as pleasant as possible. Sure increase charges etc but put some money back into the product.

It's like how they charge for Row 1 in the A320's now in the West alternatively you can squeeze into the pocketless JetStar seats down the back,.

 

[Captain Halliday]

NO - As per @madrooster's post, only those who's PCV would currently allow them access to select seats in row 4 at T-80 would be able to select after this change. The difference is they will have to pay for it at T-80.

I’m confused.

At T-80 aren’t the forward rows released for anyone to select: How to reserve the best seats on Qantas flights with the 'T-80' rule?

If so, at T-80 a NB could select 4A for the relevant fee.

Yet a WP who can currently select 4A for free at T-80, will now have to wait until T-24 to select it for free.

By that time, pax with lower status willing to pay for row 4 may have selected those seats.

@serfty I’m not trying to pick a fight. If what I’ve set out is not the case can you explain I’m missing, cause it looks like a devaluation for WP to me.

 

[dairyfloss]

I’m confused.

At T-80 aren’t the forward rows released for anyone to select: How to reserve the best seats on Qantas flights with the 'T-80' rule?

If so, at T-80 a NB could select 4A for the relevant fee.

Yet a WP who can currently select 4A for free at T-80, will now have to wait until T-24 to select it for free.

By that time, pax with lower status willing to pay for row 4 may have selected those seats.

@serfty I’m not trying to pick a fight. If what I’ve set out is not the case can you explain I’m missing, cause it looks like a devaluation for WP to me.

Saw that and also thought it didn't seem right... I know my PS wife has been able to select row 4 at T-80 travelling the golden triangle at peak times as a sporadic solo traveller, for some years now... and unless QF had her secretly linked to her loyalty powerhouse of a husband, then I doubt she'd have any real PCV on their books...

 

[mviy]

Will they be available to select for free at T-24 if not yet purchased or is that just wishful thinking?

 

[mviy]

With these changes I guess there may be more of an incentive to use other airlines if/when I reach LTG.

 

[equus]

There are quite a few misconceptions still floating around here - and I don't think the real devaluation for WP1 is as great as it seems. The real issue is that QF have decided to charge for those sears - that is an impost on everybody (regardless of status, and ignore T-80).

The T-80 unblock (if I understand correctly, and I doubt anyone other than QF knows all the details for sure):

1. Happens because part of the algorithm that works out which seats are visible to select includes T-80
2. The algorithm also includes Pax status as part of what it does
3. It also includes PCV - but that PCV is relative to (and here we are not completely sure) some combination of all the other PCV and/or status pax. Possibly looks at only those that have not selected a seat already, maybe the phase of the moon, and a few other things, including how many unselected seats remain.

The result has been that for the most part, row 4 was made available to most pax at T-80, but not always.

What QF has done is said everyone now needs to pay, if they can see the seat. WP1/CL still get it for free, as does anybody who can wait until T-24 (or earlier if on a connecting flight).

In the current scenario, mostly NB , PS etc. can jump in and select at T-80 for nothing (as can all the WP and SG) - so first in best dressed. Now, all can still do so, but need to pay. If you don't want to pay, then you just gamble and see if you can get in during the check in window.

If anything, this change is most likely to actually advantage (vert slightly) those connecting from other flights, as if everybody is too tight to pay when T-80 opens up (for almost all), they get an earlier crack than those waiting for the check in as the first leg.

 

[tdimdad]

You know there's something fundamentally wrong with a loyalty program when partners give better benefits to status holders than the "parent company" because the parent continuously devalues the product.

 

[Basalt]

With these changes I guess there may be more of an incentive to use other airlines if/when I reach LTG.

100% agree. We're getting more and more p*#@ed off with Q. We're both WP, currently in the LTS twilight zone, and have heavily leaned on T-80 row 4 access a lot. Just another incentive to jump ship once we're LTG.

WP/SG is now pretty much useless except for lounge access. The complete lack of award availability at D-353 on any international flight we'd actually use makes WP as useful as NB for redeeming flights because of the (very few) big award dumps, and now this, Q is so meh for FF'ers.

Without scaled benefits for FF tiers, there's no point in bothering to gain tiers. IMHO, the best balance between the need to raise revenue and reward FF'ers (for row 4) would be to charge for all pax except the 'special' elite (WP1/CL) up to T-80, then offer it for free to SG/WP after T-80.

 

[equus]

FWIW I have given up on row 4 some time ago. When flying with my partner (WP and SG), have had a much better experience and hit rate just selecting window and aisle in Row 6 (provided the middle is empty). So far 100% hit rate of spare middle (and sometimes only one or two empty seats left on the flight).

It may go pear shaped one day, but still well ahead. Row 4 always has someone willing to jump into a middle, so no point trying that there, so it means either one of us ends up in the middle, or we have a stranger between us. Much more convenient to be a couple of rows back and have the empty middle seat.

The changes now are probably a negative for me - simply because less people will now be fighting their way into Row 4.

 

[Basalt]

Maybe, with some AFFers jumping from the QF ship, we that are left may fare better?

Yeh, nah....a larger share of nothing is still nothing!