Qantas Oneworld phantom rewards

[RooFlyer]

I have spent literally days trying to get flights added to my Oneworld (RTW) booking that are available to book online on qantas.com but the telephone, SMS and chat operators at Qantas Customer Contact centres continue to tow the party line that these are phantom seats that cannot be added to my booking, that are due to lag with the partner airline systems.

I completely sympathise with you. I've wasted much time working with Qantas' phantom availability and have had much the same experience as you. But, as far as I could determine, at least SOME, maybe most phantom availability is due to lags or glitches between the various airline systems working 'together'. Not to excuse the problems it causes, but I think the issue is a real technology one. @Mattg might be able to add more.

Who else is finding this sort of behaviour with Qantas?

Yes, a known issue and not just with Qantas.

Note: I have raised a formal complaint to have this dealt with, but I'm unsure if this will find a resolution to this problem.

Its good that you have, as I too believe that it shouldn't just be allowed to happen unchallenged, but be prepared for more frustration and be prepared to fold 'em at some stage.

The point is that Qantas consultants are either consistently & identically incompetent,

I'd say more inconstantly and identically poorly trained than 'incompetent'.

I'm sorry I can't be more helpful; people who know me here will know i'm one of the last to ever defend Qantas' management !! It is bloody annoying, but the 'technology' of booking award seats across different airlines, with different booking engines (Qantas - Amadeus and AA - Sabre ) I can imagine makes it particularly difficult. And Qantas is not known for getting simple technology right.

If you can hold them to account - good luck, sincerely, but I doubt you will get far.

 

[MikeG]

> But if AA says they are there and transmitting that to it's One World partners isn't it AA's issue or possible the over arching One World system for reward seats ?

I'm talking to Qantas personnel. I'm purchasing off the Qantas site with QFF points. You think its who's fault??? Are you a Qantas shareholder by any chance?

 

[mrsterryn]

But Mike it isn't a Qantas flight is it ?
Nope not a share holder

 

[MikeG]

But Mike it isn't a Qantas flight is it ?
Nope not a share holder

I have no problem with the flight. Its the booking I'm concerned about. I suspect if I book a OneWorld reward with AA or BA that I won't have quite as much pain as I do booking through Qantas.

 

[RooFlyer]

But Mike it isn't a Qantas flight is it ?

If you are a QFF member, booking with Qantas points, then its a transaction between you and Qantas. You can book AA, CX, QR, BA, AY and many other airlines' flights through Qantas, using cash or points. Getting the airlines IT to talk correctly to each other and/or getting Qantas agents to recognise the problems, is another issue.

 

[MikeG]

I had one consultant last night indicate that he couldn't find AA139 on his system (SFO-DFW).

I think there's an enormous opportunity for Qantas to invest in their IT systems, and become one of the best airlines around. The mere example that I cant use the mobile website reward booking app with many airports outside australia indicates their current IT providers are as incompetent/lazy as their telephone support.

 

[Danger]

But if AA says they are there and transmitting that to it's One World partners isn't it AA's issue or possible the over arching One World system for reward seats ?

If I've understood correctly, MikeG was able to book the so-called phantom flights as a standalone ticket:

I successfully booked phantom flights when qantas told me they were unavailable for a small leg of the journey, and so I went in and successfully booked them with points.

Or have I misunderstood?

I had one consultant last night indicate that he couldn't find AA139 on his system (SFO-DFW).

I think there's an enormous opportunity for Qantas to invest in their IT systems, and become one of the best airlines around. The mere example that I cant use the mobile website reward booking app with many airports outside australia indicates their current IT providers are as incompetent/lazy as their telephone support.

Can you use the desktop version of the website to book from those some overseas ports? Qantas i not able to sell tickets originating in some countries, Qatar being a case in point, so you can't book a ticket originating in Doha on the Qantas website.

 

[MikeG]

Yes and yes. I'm currently on SMS chat with Qantas for the 3rd day running, and it sounds like "Dianne" is a keeper, and she is saying seats are available. If I book these I'll simply cancel the stand alone booking.

 

[MikeG]

Yay they have the flights from SFO-ORD but the downside is 5000 points per person change fee plus 8000 points per person service fee. So 54,000 points plus three days of agony.

 

[MikeG]

I spoke too soon, I was abandoned on the SMS chat except for random messages saying they will get back to me but there are unprecedented customer volumes.
I'm chatting to "Marga" thismorning, and we have had to start all over again - the flights identified yesterday have gone now. Farq.

Seems to be a set of flight via Pheonix that might work if they are not "Phantom" flights.

 

[MikeG]

I'm come to the conclusion that aa.com only had fight data for 6 months leading up to the ticketed date. So maybe I need to wait until december to book these flights.

 

[Isochronous]

I successfully booked phantom flights when qantas told me they were unavailable for a small leg of the journey, and so I went in and successfully booked them with points.
The issue is that qantas are knowingly misleading customers with these phantom flights. The ACCC investigates misleading conduct by retailers. Reward points are part of the price you pay for flights hence reward flights are part of the value they propose when you spend money with qantas. Misleading the public about what reward flights are available is hence Most likely to be in violation of the relevant act.

I managed to book a flight online whilst I was on the phone to the call centre and the agent insisted that she couldn't see the availability. All she could say by way of explanation was that the IT system is unreliable....

 

[MikeG]

In closing, at the end of the 4th day, I was offered flights which were then retracted, and all that I achieved was to have two of the extraneous flights remvoed from the booking so I can purchase separate flights for SFO-ORD.

I have noticed that cash prices get very competitive about 6 months out so I might wait until then.

I have also noticed that aa.com doesn't display award flights further out than 6 months, so I will have a go in December to add the fights to my current bookings.

The supervisor offered to waive the change fees to remove the extra flights, so at least I havn't had to spend extra points for essentially nothing.

Well thats 4 days of my life that I'll never get back.

Suggestions for Qantas:
1. get rid of the SMS/chat in parallel, as I found myself waiting for a response, sometimes up to four hours. Respond in real-time, and if I don't respond within 90 seconds drop the call like any call centre would
2. If you're going to transfer me to another consultant, tell me! Don't just have the first consultant vanish and there be no response until hours later from a new consultant.
3. If you want to save bandwidth of our phone/chat operators, maybe improve the functionality of your website. Let customer remove flights from bookings online, and pay the 5000 point fee pp. Also if you have common tasks you get asked for, add automated questions to populate the details, and then put through to a human to do the grunt work. Saves operator time, and populates details in the system.
4. align expectations for flight availability. If your operators are using live systems, then why not update the website to use live flight data?

 

[DC3]

… I have also noticed that aa.com doesn't display award flights further out than 6 months, so I will have a go in December to add the fights to my current bookings ...

Yes. It can all be very frustrating.

I'm not sure of the source of the information that AA doesn't display awards more than 6 months out. AA awards may be available from 331 days out. Not all the time, as any airline can choose when to release seats, if any at all, for some flights.

As an example, I see milesaaver award availability for at least 2 x U seats for SFO-ORD on 15/8/20:

 

[MikeG]

I had an error come up on mine saying I would need to check back in December for flights on this date. I just tried again now and it was fine. Odd.

** nothing to see here **

 

[DC3]

I had an error come up on mine saying I would need to check back in December for flights on this date. I just tried again now and it was fine. Odd.

** nothing to see here **

However, there are a few routes, mainly seasonal, where AA may not display flight schedules until some months out.

Edit: Regarding cash prices on many AA flights, 2-3 months out can be good. Certainly not much under that time-line.

Also, I find the Oz QF Call Centre staff to be the best (i.e., during the day, from 6.30am) followed by NZ. SA and Manilla not so good. Others have had different experiences. While you cannot choose the Call Centre, if it's not looking good HUACA to save too much time-wasting, but ringing after dark, I wouldn't bother.

 

[DC3]

So, you may have moved on from the plan for MSY-LAX-SFO on 8th July, and I'm aware of frustrating results in dealing with the Call Centres and Chat Line.

However, this is currently showing (as at 5.50pm today) on the QF site, AA.com and EF (with 2 x U and 4 x T), so make of it what you will:

 

[MikeG]

So, you may have moved on from the plan for MSY-LAX-SFO on 8th July, and I'm aware of frustrating results in dealing with the Call Centres and Chat Line.

However, this is currently showing (as at 5.50pm today) on the QF site, AA.com and EF (with 2 x U and 4 x T), so make of it what you will:

Thanks for the heads-up. I'll roll the dice and see who I get today on the Qantas Fun Hotline.

 

[MikeG]

OMG. Why did I bother.

Good news. I was able to get the flights.
Bad news. The consultant cancelled the entire booking and lost the business class seats on Cathay SYD-HKG-IAD so now we're without flights out of Australia. FFS.

Now all I get is "We are working on responding to you as soon as possible..."

What are Qantas like with mistakes on their end. All care, no responsibility???

M

 

[DC3]

OMG. Why did I bother.

Good news. I was able to get the flights.
Bad news. The consultant cancelled the entire booking and lost the business class seats on Cathay SYD-HKG-IAD so now we're without flights out of Australia. FFS.

Now all I get is "We are working on responding to you as soon as possible..."

What are Qantas like with mistakes on their end. All care, no responsibility???

M

Adding flights for the Call Centre is not exactly rocket science.

They need to fix what they have done. Follow this up daily, or even more often.

If you don't get an Oz or Kiwi accent, HUCA in my opinion. I hope that you weren't patched through to SA.

Edit: Phone in the mornings, from about 6.30am, when Oz may answer. Never at night, or you'll need extra luck.