Qantas reports $1.9bn loss - plans $400m buyback, COVID losses tally $7b

[coriander]

Not sure if it belongs here or in the "Humour" thread.

 

[SYD]

Not sure if it belongs here or in the "Humour" thread.

Despite the TWUs protestations, I’m pretty sure AJ ain’t going anywhere soon.

 

[burmans]

Agree totally. It’s been a cough few years but that’s true for virtually all airlines (I’m sure someone will post a contra example but they aren’t easy to find), when you are bleeding money spending money you don’t have on things you can’t actually afford isn’t something shareholders like much.

We’d all like better service and I’m no fan of the way the airlines treated their staff but frankly given the financial constraints Qantas options were very limited!

 

[Saab34]

Looking deeper into the accounts two problems appear to be Jetstar Asia and Japan with heavy losses expected to continue for the next year at least. Then again they have been losing money for as long as they have existed.

 

[RooFlyer]

I’m pretty sure AJ ain’t going anywhere soon.

In a story in today's Weekend Oz, Joyce says:

When pressed on when he will leave Qantas, Joyce reconfirms his commitment to stay until at least the end of next year, and it’s clear that despite the negative publicity and calls for his resignation, he still loves the job. “You are asking me to write my obituary here,” he says. “I’m going to give you a quote from (Irish poet) Brendan Behan: ‘The only bad publicity is your obituary’.”

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Buyback of QF shares, (I haven't read indepth), is it an optional one, or is it a "minimum holding" ie small shareholding buyback?
As an Aust citizen, I would love to think I part own QF, but it looks like my shareholding will get down to being sold off if its small shareholding buyback.
I didn't buy a lot of their shares in the first place, meant to keep buying in small lots up to a good number, but over the past few years, they had done "non" optional share buyback.

 

[jase05]

Despite the TWUs protestations, I’m pretty sure AJ ain’t going anywhere soon.

I‘d be ignoring those fools too.

 

[RichardMEL]

Buyback of QF shares, (I haven't read indepth), is it an optional one, or is it a "minimum holding" ie small shareholding buyback?
As an Aust citizen, I would love to think I part own QF, but it looks like my shareholding will get down to being sold off if its small shareholding buyback.
I didn't buy a lot of their shares in the first place, meant to keep buying in small lots up to a good number, but over the past few years, they had done "non" optional share buyback.

huh?

it is an on market share buyback. QF will buy the $400m of shares like anyone else buying shares "on market"

I'm not sure what you mean by "non" optional buybacks - I've not seen one in any company I have invested in that has had on or off market buybacks (off market being where they make a specific offer to buy parcels of shares from their shareholders). Either way one has not had to sell if they do not want to.

So you won't lose any holding of QAN you have. Only those institutions(more likely) and individuals who sell in the course of regular trading will be part of this buyback. Of course if you elect to sell that's totally up to you

 

[mviy]

Companies typically do buybacks when they don't feel they have a better use for the money reinvesting in the business. By reducing the number of shares on the market if you assume the total $ paid in dividends remains the same, the dividend per share will go up as there are less shares to divide it amongst. Though I don't think QF is paying dividends at the moment.

As a customer personally I'd rather QF paid down its debt than did a buyback at the moment, or even raised capital to pay down the debt.

 

[RooFlyer]

I'm not sure what you mean by "non" optional buybacks - I've not seen one in any company I have invested in that has had on or off market buybacks (off market being where they make a specific offer to buy parcels of shares from their shareholders). Either way one has not had to sell if they do not want to.

I'm pretty sure it does happen for off-markets. Small companies especially, if they go through various share consolidations etc, will end up with a large number of legacy, disinterested shareholders with a handful of shares. Costly to administer. I ended up with exactly one (1) share in one listed company!!! They did a compulsory buyback of unmarketable holdings, free of brokerage. I got a deposit of 6 cents to my bank account. Maybe you could object and keep your share(s), but in this type of case, its a saviour to get out at no cost, or able to get out at all.

s a customer personally I'd rather QF paid down its debt than did a buyback at the moment, or even raised capital to pay down the debt.

As a customer, and I think also if I was a ordinary shareholder, I'd like to see it reinvested in the business.

Its been reported that there WILL be a capital raising soon, to purchase new planes (not going to lease them), which makes the buyback even stranger - except when you look at executive options, and the effect of the buyback on the share price (will go up, other things being equal, as there are fewer shares on issue for the same corporation - as you said). Share buy backs trigger a capital gain/loss event for the seller. The company would have a good idea what the buy-in price of their major shareholders were (or they would ask!!), and would be able to do an estimation of the tax effects of a buyback at certain prices to the big guys. So the funds would get tax benefits if they tendered into the buyback at a loss, as well as an uplift in price for any shares they retained.

 

[mviy]

Its been reported that there WILL be a capital raising soon, to purchase new planes (not going to lease them)

Good. I don't want QF's debt position to get any worse. If there's another major shock to the aviation industry they need to have a way to try to ride it out.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

*OffT, I know someone who bought mineral shareholdings, ie 500 shares of $0.01 or so, some paid dividends, some didn't, some never did, but over time, these shares got sold off, and they sent him the cheques as payment.
ASIC allows small shareholding buyback, and you can't say no, you don't want those shares sold, they will be sold, and they send you the proceeds.OnT*
Officially, ASIC calls it "minimum holding buyback".

 

[SYD]

*OffT, I know someone who bought mineral shareholdings, ie 500 shares of $0.01 or so, some paid dividends, some didn't, some never did, but over time, these shares got sold off, and they sent him the cheques as payment.
ASIC allows small shareholding buyback, and you can't say no, you don't want those shares sold, they will be sold, and they send you the proceeds.OnT*
Officially, ASIC calls it "minimum holding buyback".

OT, but compulsary acquisition is also often part of a takeover process. If someone doesn’t follow what’s happening, their parcel can and will be sold (regardless of size). Simetimes for less than the original T/O offer as part of a mopping up exercise.

 

[coriander]

 

[mviy]

QANTAS received money from the government to keep paying workers and to break even on repatriation flights, not all the other expenses that were still incurred.

 

[coriander]

In December 2021 corporate regulator ASIC posted the information to its website with a link to a downloadable spreadsheet.

The data showed Qantas was by far the biggest JobKeeper recipient — claiming $160.5 million in the 2020 financial year and another $695.5 million in the 2021 financial year.

This avoided the need for Qantas to slash their executive workforce or cut salaries and bonuses.

 

[mviy]

JobKeeper paid limited amounts per employee. It was $1,500 a fortnight and then reduced below that later on in the period the scheme ran. It was reimbursed to employers after they paid the full amount received to workers and didn't cover things like superannuation. It wasn't a blank cheque to pay Alan Joyce $20 million at the taxpayer's expense.

 

[RooFlyer]

JobKeeper paid limited amounts per employee. It was $1,500 a fortnight and then reduced below that later on in the period the scheme ran. It was reimbursed to employers after they paid the full amount received to workers and didn't cover things like superannuation. It wasn't a blank cheque to pay Alan Joyce $20 million at the taxpayer's expense.

No. But nor was it "very little government support".

 

[SYD]

No. But nor was it "very little government support".

It would be useful to get the context of the comment. External and internal border closures are examples of very little government support.

 

[mviy]

It would be useful to get the context of the comment. External and internal border closures are examples of very little government support.

I think the comment was speaking relatively to some of its international competitors. That in QANTAS's view compared with Singapore Airlines it received very little government support.