Qantas to focus staff & operations in Sydney (details of NSW deal revealed)

[jb747]

I'd assume there'll be a very substantial premium for flying ULR. I'll happily save the money, and go via Singapore.

 

[dajop]

I think you'll find SYD-JFK will be a midday departure, arriving in JFK mid afternoon, departing early evening and arriving in SYD in the morning.
SYD-LHR will be early afternoon departure, arriving LHR early evening, departing in the later evening and arriving in SYD in the morning.

LHR-SYD will be most problematic. If you assume 19.5 hr schedule time (which is probably not far off LHR-DRW is 16, DRW-SYD 4 flying time), a 5am arrival into SYD during the Australia winter would need to depart LHR no earlier than 00:30, I guess it depends if QF can secure a after hours departure @LHR (In the Australian summer it could be easier, 5am arrival is 22:30 departure). The latest departure from LHR and not cause curfew problems (ie land by 10pm) at SYD would be 17:30 (in Australian winter, 15:30 in summer).

I would not be surprised if they do the (pre-COVID) schedule of QF1 to LHR, leaving a couple of hours later, and turn it around to leave early afternoon, to arrive back into SYD late afternoon.

 

[Lynda2475]

I would expect the ULH SYD-JFK/ JFK-SYD would replace the current QF11 & QF12 and depart/arrive at similar times give or take an hour as the LAX plane change is removed. Cant see any reason why US flight would need to depart/arrive outside curfew.

 

[RAM]

Depending on how CV progresses globally (variants & all) then companies may mandate that you have to fly direct (no stopovers outside of Australia) which is what would pay for the routes.

The business case really only stacks up from the Australian perspective given the limited number of destinations at the Australian end that warrant multiple non-stop flights from Europe. European based airlines would be faced with perhaps just a single destination to serve.

For BA - perhaps just LHR, but even with stops not profitable despite several attempted revamps.
From Paris, even with stops it was not profitable for Air France.
From Frankfurt/Munich, not profitable for Lufthansa.

For a non-Australian airline it does not make sense to operate an additional aircraft type for just one route, and economics of adding NZ would look even worse considering NZ entire pop'n is around that of Melbourne or Sydney's alone.

If no CV impact in 3 or 4 years time (vaccines handle everything with zero issues ) then economics may not stack up for Q if enough of Q's previous supporters remember how Q left them high & dry after June 8th, 2020, wouldn't refund their money (until ACCC finally intervened etc etc) & more recent issues (JQ saying Melb impending lockdown did not make fare refundable nor travel credit'able - happened to us with a 4 day Melb booking due to fly to Melb on that Thursday 2 weeks ago). Eventually after FB exposure JQ changed their mind.

Zero issue with the hotel - they immediately offered full refund when we rang on the Wednesday morning.

 

[ayebee]

Haven't read all the (no doubt considered) discussion above, but my knee jerk is ...

Starting from Mel, if a connection is needed via Sydney for any flight you avoid it at all costs.
Better to connect in Singapore, HKG or even Brisbane or LAX into north America.
That would defeat any benefits of a "sunrise" direct flight, but with the benefit of the connection a more reasonable distance into the flight.
I would assume (hope) QF would still operate MEL-LAX, and MEL-PER-LHR, or MEL-SIN- wherever anyway, so us Mel folk would avoid Sydney one way or another.

 

[BD1959]

Originating in MEL I would hardly consider a 4hr detour via Sydney a premium experience to non-stop to LHR although I'd be charged a premium to do so? If I'm flying Y then I'm probably left with the choice of a 787 via PER - no thanks to either - or a A380 codeshare via DXB. If EK continue to honour my WP status and allow me access to the wonder F Lounges (with the exception of the C Concourse FLounge) then it will be the codeshare via the desert with the added bonus of a UK entry point closer to my final destination which is 200km from LHR.

Regards,

BD

 

[justinbrett]

Originating in MEL I would hardly consider a 4hr detour via Sydney a premium experience to non-stop to LHR although I'd be charged a premium to do so? If I'm flying Y then I'm probably left with the choice of a 787 via PER - no thanks to either - or a A380 codeshare via DXB. If EK continue to honour my WP status and allow me access to the wonder F Lounges (with the exception of the C Concourse FLounge) then it will be the codeshare via the desert with the added bonus of a UK entry point closer to my final destination which is 200km from LHR.

Regards,

BD

I'm calling it now, the QF-EK alliance will be dead by the time sunrise starts

I mean once QF pulled out of DXB it was always going to end at some point. QF is just reselling EK tickets now.

 

[BD1959]

QF is just reselling EK tickets now.

QF long ago became as much a virtual airline as a metal carrier. You only have to look at the options for partner flights for rewards *over* possible flights on QF metal. I wouldn't be surprised if QF maintain this little stream via the sandpit, especially given the number of non-LHR destinations it keeps as options in western Europe.

Regards,

BD

 

[sydtlg]

The exact quote (and is also on Australian Aviation) indicates:
"A commitment that Project Sunrise would be based exclusively in Sydney for at least five years, following its commencement;"

What does "based exclusively" mean? Crew base ? Maintenance base? Or all flights must go to/from SYD?

Yeah good question

 

[jase05]

I'd assume there'll be a very substantial premium for flying ULR. I'll happily save the money, and go via Singapore.

Likewise. Much, much better airlines out there also which is more important for me.
Im possibly in the minority but I’m not massively sold on the QF 787 J seating as it is so a ULR flight on them doesn’t really appeal

 

[jakeseven7]

Yeah good question

Exactly, it could well just be the aircraft are based there which would make sense anyway

 

[justinbrett]

Likewise. Much, much better airlines out there also which is more important for me.
Im possibly in the minority but I’m not massively sold on the QF 787 J seating as it is so a ULR flight on them doesn’t really appeal

Sunrise is A350, which will have F. Seating configuration hasn't been announced as far as I'm aware.

And yes I think you are in the minority. If I'm travelling J solo I'm a huge fan of QF 787 seats, by the window with the table on the aisle side. It's my own little fortress.

 

[PineappleSkip]

I'm a huge fan of QF 787 seats, by the window with the table on the aisle side. It's my own little fortress.

I'm a huge fan of fortresses too, but I'm just as happy to run with the EK, AY, CX versions and aware there are many others. Ok, maybe a little happier with QF. Oi, oi oi!

Sunrise is A350, which will have F.

Tempting, But apart from minor bonuses like better champagne, the only advantage I discern with QF F over J is that you get the opportunity to sit on a spindle seat and rotate.

cheers skip

 

[mviy]

Tempting, But apart from minor bonuses like better champagne, the only advantage I discern with QF F over J is that you get the opportunity to sit on a spindle seat and rotate.

J has improved since the F product on the A380 was launched. Direct aisle access for everyone in J was not there when the F product on the A380 was put in place.

With Sunrise a smaller F cabin is expected. QF may look to find ways to differentiate the F product more from J than the difference found on the refurbished A380 fleet.

 

[justinbrett]

With Sunrise a smaller F cabin is expected. QF may look to find ways to differentiate the F product more from J than the difference found on the refurbished A380 fleet.

Spirits in F maybe?

 

[Basalt]

I suspect the recently announced payroll surcharge tax in Victoria was an equal disincentive for Qantas to relocate to Victoria as the measly $50M sweetener was an incentive. Qantas' annual wage bill is $4 billion (from the 2019 financial report) - with a 1% extra tax on any staff Qantas moves to Victoria, well, nice little gift to NSW by Premier Andrews.....