QF social media team being really vindictive

[drron]

That's not how award seats and tickets work.
In addition to JohnM's post, revenue and classic award systems are different. Paying points for the base fare vs paying cash for the base fare is different.
Don't forget the mixed class exclamation mark. This is no different to that.
eg. MEL-SYD-LHR priced as a J award all the way, with the label "your flight from SYD to LHR will be in economy". With MEL-SYD in J.

Sure, it's not nice and probably not fair, but the point is not whether the system is fair or not, the point is how the system works.

No exclamation marks when I booked my J RTW award.And surely people are allowed to be upset at how the system works.
I cant see why now in our computer age if you pay 280000 points for a J RTW award and 1 or 2 legs do not initially have J award availability but on the day of the flight there are several empty J seats that you then get to occupy 1 of those seats.Might not be simpler but definitely fairer.Unless a fuss is made a totally unsatisfactory situation is allowed to continue.
As well a RTW award is totally different to a MEL-SYD-LHR award.

 

[blackcat20]

No exclamation marks when I booked my J RTW award.And surely people are allowed to be upset at how the system works.
I cant see why now in our computer age if you pay 280000 points for a J RTW award and 1 or 2 legs do not initially have J award availability but on the day of the flight there are several empty J seats that you then get to occupy 1 of those seats.Might not be simpler but definitely fairer.Unless a fuss is made a totally unsatisfactory situation is allowed to continue.
As well a RTW award is totally different to a MEL-SYD-LHR award.

I agree with this. A person who has paid for a J award but seated in a lower cabin should be at the top of the list for any vacant seats in J before point upgrades etc...

 

[JohnM]

It seems clear that the system needs fundamental change to accommodate this issue. But I presume it is systemic to the OWA - not just QF.

I don't think it's quite as simple as one would hope, because the way I see it is that it still revolves around the designated redemption fare buckets on each sector.

To meet the needs of what folks are upset about here, the system would have to be built to discriminate the pax who was on a U-class RTW and had (willingly, albeit begrudgingly) chosen X or Z for a given sector from those pax doing that same sector simply as a point-to-point X or Z redemption.

It's probably come to the fore here because it's QF and Australian pax. But presumably there are plenty of situations where pax of diverse origins have had to face the same choice on OWA carriers outside their own country when trying to build a 280K award.

While practically anything is theoretically possible to program into the IT system, given the resources and time, there has to be a limit.

It's not that I'm unsympathetic, but the system is what it is - for better or for worse.

 

[Alanslegal]

I agree with this. A person who has paid for a J award but seated in a lower cabin should be at the top of the list for any vacant seats in J before point upgrades etc...

Don't agree too much because qantas might just blacklist you or make some notes that you are a hostile member. Woops I shouldn't encourage that idea for the qantas social media team. and that was exactly the main issue of the OPs and qantas putting in restrictive notes on their booking.

 

[hutch]

Good to hear QF resolved the issue! Would be nice to see some of these issues avoided in the first place.

 

[vetrade]

Surely the IT system can't be that complex that a savvy IT team couldn't incorporate a flexible hierarchy of pax to enable empty seats to be allocated to award travellers. Computer systems routinely achieve more complex things than that these days (MYKI in Melbourne being the obvious exception). If it's too hard for the smurfs in QF's IT department I'm sure a few AFF IT boffins would be up to the task!

 

[Edge]

A win for common sense.

Well done to the OP for persistence. A good result for both parties.

 

[Kangol]

No exclamation marks when I booked my J RTW award.And surely people are allowed to be upset at how the system works.
I cant see why now in our computer age if you pay 280000 points for a J RTW award and 1 or 2 legs do not initially have J award availability but on the day of the flight there are several empty J seats that you then get to occupy 1 of those seats.Might not be simpler but definitely fairer.Unless a fuss is made a totally unsatisfactory situation is allowed to continue.
As well a RTW award is totally different to a MEL-SYD-LHR award.

I should have been more explicit, but the principle (classic awards) is what I was referring to. My point still stands though.
Sure, you are allowed to be upset and complain, but that is not what the point is.
The entire trip is priced at the level of the highest cabin booked, regardless of other segments on the same itinerary.
Sure, you are allowed to propose what you think is or is not right/moral/ethical - no harm in that. I would be interested to see what you personally can do about changing such a policy.
How QF choose to release or not release seats for award availability will probably never be revealed to any of us... if it's not available, then it's not available.

Btw, there is no such thing as a RTW award.
https://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/flying/using-points-awards-upgrades#classic-flight-rewards

I agree with this. A person who has paid for a J award but seated in a lower cabin should be at the top of the list for any vacant seats in J before point upgrades etc...

In theory in accordance with your proposed model, they could have a majority of the J cabin paid for with award redemptions. I wonder how that would affect QF's bottom line... Why don't they just release the whole cabin for award redemptions in the first place?
I'm genuinely interested in your progress in being able to instill such a change... to see what you are actually doing about it.

Just saying.

 

[JohnM]

Taking the objections to their logical conclusion.

If release of U seats close to departure became the norm to appease 'downgraded'-sector pax on 280K itineraries, people could book ones that include Z or X 'downgrade' sectors (especially the long-haul ones) almost with impunity and then phone up to harass the call-centre staff to release U seats near departure on the basis that they 'deserve' it by virtue of having the 280K itinerary. The staff would unfairly become collateral damage in the crossfire.

Award flights are, by definition, a lottery.

 

[UP4014]

Is Red Roo a member of the "social media team" ?

Yes by definition. This forum is social media, but as to them being a team, that is subjective.

Matt

 

[farstar]

I think people who get 280000 points for a J RTW award are getting a good deal as it usually is a reduced rate over individual sector points cost and you agree at booking to any z or x fares. Also you can book them as a bronze. Should a bronze get upgrade priority over Platinum ones who booked an economy fare and request an upgrade just because the bronze knew they could game the system by booking an x fare on their 280000 points for a J RTW award and get a free upgrade. If the 280000 points for a J RTW award people do go into the upgrade lottery it should be on status, still not sure if that would be fair due to the discount you get when you book around the world fares.

 

[medhead]

I should have been more explicit, but the principle (classic awards) is what I was referring to. My point still stands though.
Sure, you are allowed to be upset and complain, but that is not what the point is.
The entire trip is priced at the level of the highest cabin booked, regardless of other segments on the same itinerary.
Sure, you are allowed to propose what you think is or is not right/moral/ethical - no harm in that. I would be interested to see what you personally can do about changing such a policy.
How QF choose to release or not release seats for award availability will probably never be revealed to any of us... if it's not available, then it's not available.

Btw, there is no such thing as a RTW award.
https://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/flying/using-points-awards-upgrades#classic-flight-rewards



In theory in accordance with your proposed model, they could have a majority of the J cabin paid for with award redemptions. I wonder how that would affect QF's bottom line... Why don't they just release the whole cabin for award redemptions in the first place?
I'm genuinely interested in your progress in being able to instill such a change... to see what you are actually doing about it.

Just saying.

Actually, I think they've changed the pricing system at some point. There have been reports of being charged as per seat class not higher class for the whole trip.

 

[vetrade]

I think people who get 280000 points for a J RTW award are getting a good deal as it usually is a reduced rate over individual sector points cost and you agree at booking to any z or x fares. Also you can book them as a bronze. Should a bronze get upgrade priority over Platinum ones who booked an economy fare and request an upgrade just because the bronze knew they could game the system by booking an x fare on their 280000 points for a J RTW award and get a free upgrade. If the 280000 points for a J RTW award people do go into the upgrade lottery it should be on status, still not sure if that would be fair due to the discount you get when you book around the world fares.

I don't think priority of one group vs another is the significant issue here. Bronzes (or anyone else initially booked in Y on a segment of a 280K award) aren't looking for priority over WPs wanting upgrades etc. To me the issue is QF planes flying with empty J seats while pax who would/should be entitled to them (by way of either status or a 280K J award booking) are denied access to them. What QF does sometimes is mindless group-think BS, but I guess there's no room for commonsense now that everyone defers to KPIs etc.

 

[Kangol]

Actually, I think they've changed the pricing system at some point. There have been reports of being charged as per seat class not higher class for the whole trip.

Interesting. Yes to QF and airline partners, but no to the OW distance based award (280k max for 35k miles in J):
So the J MEL-SYD-LHR with the long leg in Y has been "enhanced" but the OW has not.

https://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/program/terms#jump13

QF/partner:
14.4.3 Where mixed-class travel is booked on a Trip, the Points required for that Trip will be calculated using the lowest quoted Points level of either:
a) the Points level for the highest class of travel flown on that Trip; or
b) the sum of Points, breaking the Trip into multiple Trips wherever the class of travel changes between sectors within a Trip.

OW:
14.5.6 Where mixed-class travel is booked in a oneworld Classic Flight Reward, the whole Itinerary will be calculated using the Points level for the highest class booked.

Just checked and it works.
eg. MEL-SYD-LAX.
MEL-SYD in J and SYD-LAX in Y is priced as 16+48k.
MEL-LAX in J is 96k.
SYD-MEL-LAX all in J is 96k.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Interesting. Yes to QF and airline partners, but no to the OW distance based award (280k max for 35k miles in J):
So the J MEL-SYD-LHR with the long leg in Y has been "enhanced" but the OW has not.

https://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/program/terms#jump13


Just checked and it works.
eg. MEL-SYD-LAX.
MEL-SYD in J and SYD-LAX in Y is priced as 16+48k.
MEL-LAX in J is 96k.
SYD-MEL-LAX all in J is 96k.

Three cheers for the work experience kids!

 

[Alanslegal]

I think people who get 280000 points for a J RTW award are getting a good deal as it usually is a reduced rate over individual sector points cost and you agree at booking to any z or x fares. Also you can book them as a bronze. Should a bronze get upgrade priority over Platinum ones who booked an economy fare and request an upgrade just because the bronze knew they could game the system by booking an x fare on their 280000 points for a J RTW award and get a free upgrade. If the 280000 points for a J RTW award people do go into the upgrade lottery it should be on status, still not sure if that would be fair due to the discount you get when you book around the world fares.

If a person is already paying 280K for a J award how are they gaming the system The person has already paid J rates - it's not a free upgrade. Anyway if the W@nker Platinum guy is soooooooo concerned s/he will lose out on being upgraded, then they aren't using their benefits - call up the Premium Desk and ask for the J seat to be released as an award, cancel the economy seat and get a confirmed J seat. As for the Nothing Bronze flyer who wants to book these award - getting two premium availability on QF is difficult, no wonder why QF forces you to fly two other non-Qantas airlines because Qantas knows its close to zero getting J awards long haul.

 

[drron]

In my situation the plane went out with more than 40 empty J seats.If the 2 of us were reassigned to J as we had paid for we would not have prevented any "priceless"WP from an upgrade.We were both SG at the time.
This sort of situation is certainly not "fair".

 

[straitman]

Is Red Roo a member of the "social media team" ?

RR are the social media team.

Yes by definition. This forum is social media, but as to them being a team, that is subjective.

Matt

In an AFF sense RR is the social media team. Remember however that whilst RR is often an individual it can be one of several people and in the big picture they are only part of a bigger team. i.e. it is not correct to say RR is the social media team.

 

[timster]

In an AFF sense RR is the social media team. Remember however that whilst RR is often an individual it can be one of several people and in the big picture they are only part of a bigger team. i.e. it is not correct to say RR is the social media team.

I think I have noted before my slight bemusement at the "anthropomorphization" of "Red Roo" here on AFF. As you say "he"/"she"/they are a team, albeit of indeterminate size. It seems there is a small group constantly monitoring Twitter, but a larger group of up to 250 sometimes involved across all social media ....
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=qantas+social+medial+team

And from the OP's post, it seems that "the team" can tag pax bookings with notes to their detriment, such as "do not engage" (translation "do not assist"), for dubious reasons in this case (they had posted a reasonable complaint on social media). And then the team can "fix" things when exposed. As the OP noted, they were "stunned" by this treatment.

One wonders what notes may be attached to the accounts of some identifiable members here.

 

[JohnK]

A few disappointing things that don't change and appear to be getting worse

- Inconsistency of information provided by call centre
- Booking business class and only premium economy available so still get charged for business class points. Every attempt should be made to provide business class seats including trumping upgrade requests from lower cabins