QFF Platinum requesting release of extra Classic Reward seats?

[Brettmcg]

Fair enough. I think that only strengthens my argument that the crew won’t be particularly happy. There’s a huge difference between a bunk bed nestled away from passengers versions lying flat on a poor man’s business class seat.

Absolute bunkum. I have a few JetConnect crew friends and they actually lovingly refer to the crew rest as "the pillow fort". I have very rarely come across badly tempered Kiwi crew - generally they are fantastic, and this applies to TT as well as long-haul like QF69/70 and QF15/16.

 

[Daver6]

Absolute bunkum. I have a few JetConnect crew friends and they actually lovingly refer to the crew rest as "the pillow fort". I have very rarely come across badly tempered Kiwi crew - generally they are fantastic, and this applies to TT as well as long-haul like QF69/70 and QF15/16.

100% agree. The JetConnect crew on QF69/70 are downright amazing!

 

[kangarooflyer88]

Absolute bunkum. I have a few JetConnect crew friends and they actually lovingly refer to the crew rest as "the pillow fort". I have very rarely come across badly tempered Kiwi crew - generally they are fantastic, and this applies to TT as well as long-haul like QF69/70 and QF15/16.

Fair enough. The only reason I brought this up was that I recalled news stories back when this change was made in 2022 with reports that crew weren't happy with the situation. Here's one such report from ORAAT:

Oh My: Qantas A330 Crew Rest Controversy

Here's why Qantas flight attendants built a blanket fort in the cabin on a recent 14 hour flight between Brisbane and Los Angeles.

onemileatatime.com

 

[TheDefenestrator]

My first successful request:
QF25 26 Jun SYD-HND I1 -> U1 Declined
QF59 26 Jun SYD-HND I1 -> U1 Approved and booked

Requested Sunday afternoon, ticketed earlier today (points deducted and card charged).

Ended up changing my flight to:
QF59 19 Jun SYD-HND I3 -> U1 Approved

Wanted to keep the existing PNR for the DSCs (I hope) so it was both a date change + release request in the same call. Kudos to the call centre staff member for getting it all done in about 10 minutes.

 

[fletty]

How feasible is it to request an international J release and then get a domestic connection added to it? Would this also add an additional ~25k points pp for the domestic J leg or is it combined under the one booking?

 

[Brettmcg]

How feasible is it to request an international J release and then get a domestic connection added to it? Would this also add an additional ~25k points pp for the domestic J leg or is it combined under the one booking?

That's exactly the way it works. CSA will push the request for the main international segments through the droid, and then if successful, they'll go and grab an available or request a domestic U class connector. Points amount is calculated using the total distance bracket, not the individual amounts for each segment.

 

[elanshin]

Ended up changing my flight to:
QF59 19 Jun SYD-HND I3 -> U1 Approved

Wanted to keep the existing PNR for the DSCs (I hope) so it was both a date change + release request in the same call. Kudos to the call centre staff member for getting it all done in about 10 minutes.

Thanks for beating me to the same dates

 

[kangarooflyer88]

How feasible is it to request an international J release and then get a domestic connection added to it? Would this also add an additional ~25k points pp for the domestic J leg or is it combined under the one booking?

The challenge in my mind is always getting that international seat released. Domestic awards are generally much easier to released for two reasons. First domestic seats can be released from a larger fare bucket (e.g. D discount business or N discount economy versus I super-discount business and Q super discount economy for international). Second, generally speaking no one cares about flying business domestically. I mean if you are flying say Sydney to Los Angeles and have a 1 hour connecting flight up to Brisbane, are you really gonna care being in economy given business class generally consists of a slightly larger seat? I certainly wouldn't!

Generally, how this works is you'll call up Qantas, you'll tell them where you are flying from and flying to (i.e. final destination) and they'll sort out the rest. Going back to my example, last week, I need to book Sydney to Detroit. So called up Qantas to see if a release could be facilitated. I requested Sydney to Detroit, and had the specific flights I wanted (this obviously was researched before I made the call) with me asking the agent if they could release the Qantas flights that aren't available. As it would turn out they couldn't release the preferred flights I wanted (SYD > DFW or MEL > DFW) but they could get BNE > LAX and SYD > BNE released for me. Yes it does mean I'll need to overnight it in LA, but I would've had to overnight it in Detroit had my desired itinerary went through (it's generally not safe to take buses from Detroit airport to Windsor, Ontario at 10 PM). The agents over the phone can stitch in partner flights if needed. So for instance, if you were flying Sydney to Phoenix, Arizona, and managed to get Qantas to release SYD > LAX for you, the agent could add that connecting flight from San Francisco to Phoenix on AA, provided there is classic award availability on American.

Points amount is calculated using the total distance bracket, not the individual amounts for each segment.

You are correct but there is a wrinkle here. There are several different distance based award charts used, which one Qantas applies depends on the itinerary chosen. The cheapest would be the JetStar award chart which would apply if all of your flights were with JetStar, JetStar Asia or JetStar Japan. The next cheapest award chart would be for awards that contain strictly flights from American, Qantas, and Fiji Airways. Lastly, the most expensive would be the partner award chart which would be used if your trip has a flight operated by another partner like LATAM, KLM, FinnAir, British Airways, etc. Importantly, the moment your award ticket has a flight operated by any of these partners, the whole thing is priced out using that table. So for instance, suppose you are flying from Sydney to São Paulo, Brazil. You got a Qantas seat released for QF27 from SYD > SCL, and then connected onto the LATAM flight to GRU. The whole itinerary would price out under the partner award table and not the Qantas table, even though Qantas operated most of the trip.

Then there is the whole matter of OneWorld classic awards that allow you to travel the world business class on OneWorld partners for peanuts. But that's a discussion for an AFF article.

 

[Brettmcg]

The challenge in my mind is always getting that international seat released. Domestic awards are generally much easier to released for two reasons. First domestic seats can be released from a larger fare bucket (e.g. D discount business or N discount economy versus I super-discount business and Q super discount economy for international). Second, generally speaking no one cares about flying business domestically. I mean if you are flying say Sydney to Los Angeles and have a 1 hour connecting flight up to Brisbane, are you really gonna care being in economy given business class generally consists of a slightly larger seat? I certainly wouldn't!

Generally, how this works is you'll call up Qantas, you'll tell them where you are flying from and flying to (i.e. final destination) and they'll sort out the rest. Going back to my example, last week, I need to book Sydney to Detroit. So called up Qantas to see if a release could be facilitated. I requested Sydney to Detroit, and had the specific flights I wanted (this obviously was researched before I made the call) with me asking the agent if they could release the Qantas flights that aren't available. As it would turn out they couldn't release the preferred flights I wanted (SYD > DFW or MEL > DFW) but they could get BNE > LAX and SYD > BNE released for me. Yes it does mean I'll need to overnight it in LA, but I would've had to overnight it in Detroit had my desired itinerary went through (it's generally not safe to take buses from Detroit airport to Windsor, Ontario at 10 PM). The agents over the phone can stitch in partner flights if needed. So for instance, if you were flying Sydney to Phoenix, Arizona, and managed to get Qantas to release SYD > LAX for you, the agent could add that connecting flight from San Francisco to Phoenix on AA, provided there is classic award availability on American.


You are correct but there is a wrinkle here. There are several different distance based award charts used, which one Qantas applies depends on the itinerary chosen. The cheapest would be the JetStar award chart which would apply if all of your flights were with JetStar, JetStar Asia or JetStar Japan. The next cheapest award chart would be for awards that contain strictly flights from American, Qantas, and Fiji Airways. Lastly, the most expensive would be the partner award chart which would be used if your trip has a flight operated by another partner like LATAM, KLM, FinnAir, British Airways, etc. Importantly, the moment your award ticket has a flight operated by any of these partners, the whole thing is priced out using that table. So for instance, suppose you are flying from Sydney to São Paulo, Brazil. You got a Qantas seat released for QF27 from SYD > SCL, and then connected onto the LATAM flight to GRU. The whole itinerary would price out under the partner award table and not the Qantas table, even though Qantas operated most of the trip.

Then there is the whole matter of OneWorld classic awards that allow you to travel the world business class on OneWorld partners for peanuts. But that's a discussion for an AFF article.

The underlying assumption of my post was that Domestic referred to a connection from an Australian port to the next Australian port from where the international flight is departing. Any domestic flight at the other end of the trip (i.e. not operated by QF) is subject to off-the-shelf availability, and is priced as per your post.

 

[Warragul]

How feasible is it to request an international J release and then get a domestic connection added to it? Would this also add an additional ~25k points pp for the domestic J leg or is it combined under the one booking?

FWIW, I recently requested and obtained two First class seats SYD-SIN return for Sept 25, but could not get any Y CR seats for connecting SYD-CBR flights. Plenty showing online. The agents couldn't understand it, ended up going with a separate CR booking and linking them.

 

[Brettmcg]

FWIW, I recently requested and obtained two First class seats SYD-SIN return for Sept 25, but could not get any Y CR seats for connecting SYD-CBR flights. Plenty showing online. The agents couldn't understand it, ended up going with a separate CR booking and linking them.

That sounds like an agent who doesn't know what they're doing. I'd have HUACA'd it...

 

[Warragul]

That sounds like an agent who doesn't know what they're doing. I'd have HUACA'd it...

That was the third attempt, all to Hobart. It didn't cost any more in points or fees.
I get that the benefit is being protected on the one booking as opposed to separate ones. Being a QF to QF connection the chances of being told bad luck in the event of delay I reckon are not great given the frequency of flights between SYD-CBR - we shall see. I have experienced that scenario and was automatically rebooked. I have time to drive to Sydney on the outbound trip if it gets that bad.

 

[kangarooflyer88]

That sounds like an agent who doesn't know what they're doing. I'd have HUACA'd it...

The problem I see with HUACA is what happens to those requested seats? Will they still be there if you call back and would the droid allow the request to be made again given how recently the last request was made?

-RooFlyer88

 

[Brettmcg]

The problem I see with HUACA is what happens to those requested seats? Will they still be there if you call back and would the droid allow the request to be made again given how recently the last request was made?

-RooFlyer88

If the droid comes back with a positive response, QF will hold them for 48-72hrs. Tell the agent you need to line up some ducks at your end and you'll call back to confirm and pay. Then try the next agent to sort out the connector.

 

[ChrisMars]

I just call Qantas to fix one of those international Qantas metal award flight I made a few weeks ago with the missing domestic connection. The agent had 20+ years of experience, was fantastic, and fixed it easily. I tried to understand why other agents can't see those domestic award. She tried to briefly explain it's because the booking is on the screen and a few more details, I didn't really get it, but during her explanation, I quote:

"The domestic connection for those international award flight is always guaranteed"
"The (untrained) agent should request the domestic award"
"If the agent has trouble, it should call it's team coach to get help"
"Sorry this is happening"
"I'll contact the original agent to let them know"

It's actually not the first time I heard this "domestic leg guaranteed" on the phone.
Now, this was say in the context of WP, I am not fully sure how it would work with lower status.

I feel it may be beneficial if we collectively keep enquiry about this problem when we call to fix such a ticket and get Hobart. It may eventually improve things.

 

[Brettmcg]

I just call Qantas to fix one of those international Qantas metal award flight I made a few weeks ago with the missing domestic connection. The agent had 20+ years of experience, was fantastic, and fixed it easily. I tried to understand why other agents can't see those domestic award. She tried to briefly explain it's because the booking is on the screen and a few more details, I didn't really get it, but during her explanation, I quote:

"The domestic connection for those international award flight is always guaranteed"
"The (untrained) agent should request the domestic award"
"If the agent has trouble, it should call it's team coach to get help"
"Sorry this is happening"
"I'll contact the original agent to let them know"

It's actually not the first time I heard this "domestic leg guaranteed" on the phone.
Now, this was say in the context of WP, I am not fully sure how it would work with lower status.

I feel it may be beneficial if we collectively keep enquiry about this problem when we call to fix such a ticket and get Hobart. It may eventually improve things.

Part of the issue is that the QF have recently transitioned from a command-line interface to a new GUI system, which has complicated the old processes. One CSA who I know quite well told me in the first few weeks of implementation the amount of time to action what had previously been simple tasks had doubled or tripled.

As a P1 I'm lucky to mostly talk to the really knowledgeable agents in HBA, but the aforementioned issue is one of the reasons WP are having these problems when being put through to NZ, SA or FJ.

 

[madrooster]

It's actually not the first time I heard this "domestic leg guaranteed" on the phone.

For international seat release bookings, where the domestic connection is knocked back by the robot...

The written policy is that the domestic connection can be manually forced in as long as C class is available for J, or S class is available for Y, on the domestic on a standalone basis (eg. looking at just SYD-MEL separately as if it were a new commercial booking).

The agent needs to call a team coach to have this done. Regular agents don't have the access to do it.

 

[kangarooflyer88]

The written policy is that the domestic connection can be manually forced in as long as C class is available for J, or S class is available for Y, on the domestic on a standalone basis (eg. looking at just SYD-MEL separately as if it were a new commercial booking).

For those curious Qantas does publicize their fare codes. Per the site, a C fare code corresponds to the second highest business fare code (just below J), which in many cases would have availability. An S is the second highest fare code available under a red e-deal (just below V) which in theory means less you aren't capturing most of the seats (since there would presumably be quite a few in Flex (B,H, K and Y fare codes). What all of this means ( I think) is that all things being equal, you would have a better chance in getting the agent to force through a business seat than an economy seat, particularly if the economy cabin is filling up.

But I think that begs the question: can an agent force through a domestic business seat if the international portion of your flight is in economy? I would imagine so, although the whole thing would be priced at the business rate and not the economy rate.

-RooFlyer88

 

[madrooster]

can an agent force through a domestic business seat if the international portion of your flight is in economy? I would imagine so, although the whole thing would be priced at the business rate and not the economy rate.

There is no restriction on this.

 

[serfty]

The agent needs to call a team coach to have this done. Regular agents don't have the access to do it.

"If the agent has trouble, it should call it's team coach to get help"

Term of the day "Team Coach".

Is this "forcing" policy directly related to successful award releases only?