SQ to offer PE from next year

[wandering_fred]

Oh this comment was just on a personal level and not for the 'overall' PE product. The whole concept of PE obviously is that it's a class that sits between J/Y but that is the deal breaker for my requirements.
...
So on a personal level, the prospect of getting more legroom + slightly better service just isn't as attractive to me to justify a 2x price for a PE seat, especially when I have status and can score exit rows in Y for free. When PE seats go on sale though, it's a different story altogether as the product suddenly becomes much more attractive.
...

Ah yes, one of my favorite myths. On one of my "special" routes LAX-PER the least expensive CX fares in June (not a sale period) are US$2445 in Y and US$2941 in the W cabin (09 Jun-18 Jun). Also avoids SYD and the Y segment SYD-PER. And for a modest extra a free stopover in HKG.

Qantas wants $US2274 in Y (09 Jun-17 Jun - no flights on 18 $330 more on 19 Jun) and $US3522 in the W cabin (well at least on the TransPacific leg).
NB: I did not price the fares exAustralia. I fully expect the fares would be substantially less customer friendly.

Happy wandering

Fred

 

[mitwg]

Yeah similar experience recently with CX.

I wanted a Y fare between SYD-NRT that credited 100% miles, which was around $1300 at the time as the supersaver fares were going for a ridiculously low price of $700. On that sale though, the PE fares on sale were $1300 as well so this was such a fantastic deal after all.

On the other hand, normally speaking, CX PE fares ex SYD are usually 2x of the equivalent Y fares and this is where I sort of got the idea that PE was hardly worth it. At the 'normal' prices ex-SYD, its a product that achieves neither the full comfort of J or the savings of Y.

 

[OATEK]

As discussed widely on AFF, there are many travellers disenchanted with the QF to Europe via DXB route and cost, and have a preference for flights via Asia. Add to that the number of so-called "grey nomads" or "baby boomers" who place a premium on comfort, I believe there is a strong market for PE through Asia. Recent dummy searches for a trip to Europe delivered PE fares ranging between $3,700-$3,900 on CX/BA via Asia, to $6,000 for QF via DXB for MArch/April 2015.

SWMBO argues that as most of our international travel is self-funded, we can't go on paying J fares into retirement which is only a year or two away. We have have already moved our J fares away from QF to AY this year, and a decent PE offering on CX/BA/SQ would be more likely to attract our attention over the subsequent years both in terms of route and cost than the QF offering. We have annual trips in planning to Europe and US from now until 2017 in various stages of development, and PE is very much part of them.

 

[dajop]

We have annual trips in planning to Europe and US from now until 2017 in various stages of development, and PE is very much part of them.

You should read up on the Avianca Life Miles, AAdvantage & US Dividend Miles "buy miles" type threads. You may well be able to factor business or first class into the equation at a cost lower than most PE fares!

 

[Dalescott]

As discussed widely on AFF, there are many travellers disenchanted with the QF to Europe via DXB route and cost, and have a preference for flights via Asia. Add to that the number of so-called "grey nomads" or "baby boomers" who place a premium on comfort, I believe there is a strong market for PE through Asia. Recent dummy searches for a trip to Europe delivered PE fares ranging between $3,700-$3,900 on CX/BA via Asia, to $6,000 for QF via DXB for MArch/April 2015.

SWMBO argues that as most of our international travel is self-funded, we can't go on paying J fares into retirement which is only a year or two away. We have have already moved our J fares away from QF to AY this year, and a decent PE offering on CX/BA/SQ would be more likely to attract our attention over the subsequent years both in terms of route and cost than the QF offering. We have annual trips in planning to Europe and US from now until 2017 in various stages of development, and PE is very much part of them.

Yes we are the same place as you wrote about. Facing retirement and the cost of J is to high for us in retirement. PE I hope fit us fine, I will find out on Saturday. As to buying miles etc, its all to hard and complicated.

 

[lastrow]

In my experience PE seats are simply not worth the extra spend. Why pay $5-6k for PE on a QF flight to LHR when many Asian airlines will sell you J for that price or less.

True, PE seats are in a separate cabin but you still get Y food and although the seats are a little wider and the pitch is a little greater when the seat in front is fully reclined getting out for a midnight nature call still calls for contortionist skills.

It is also true that grey nomad travellers whose budget will not stretch to J, will willingly pay a little extra for comfort and for this reason a growing number of airlines are now installing economy comfort seating.

First off the block was American Airlines with their MainCabin Extra, and here is their sales pitch:

"With Main Cabin Extra you get a seat towards the front of the Main Cabin with up to six inches of additional legroom to stretch out and relax. You also receive Group 1 boarding which gives you plenty of time to get on the plane, stow your luggage and get settled with prices starting at $16"

Is it too much to suggest that QF incorporates some economy comfort seating in its long haul aircraft, maybe starting with the B787?

 

[Chicken]

True, PE seats are in a separate cabin but you still get Y food and although the seats are a little wider and the pitch is a little greater when the seat in front is fully reclined getting out for a midnight nature call still calls for contortionist skills.

Agree here personally. I'm thin as a stick, so I want leg room, I don't care about extra 2 inches wider.

It is also true that grey nomad travellers whose budget will not stretch to J, will willingly pay a little extra for comfort and for this reason a growing number of airlines are now installing economy comfort seating.

Which is what I do when I cannot claim J seat: pay extra for exit row. Cheaper than Y+, but comes with even more leg room!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

SWMBO argues that as most of our international travel is self-funded, we can't go on paying J fares into retirement which is only a year or two away. We have have already moved our J fares away from QF to AY this year, and a decent PE offering on CX/BA/SQ would be more likely to attract our attention over the subsequent years both in terms of route and cost than the QF offering. We have annual trips in planning to Europe and US from now until 2017 in various stages of development, and PE is very much part of them.

There are lots of alternatives to PE for business class or mixed class travel. For Europe: a cheap economy fare to SIN then business class from there can be under $2200 from Australia. For the USA: Fiji Airways has business class to LAX for around $3000. And the benefits can far outweigh PE with lounge access and points etc.

Then of course the miles deals (US Airways, Avianca, AA) - but availability for those is not what it used to be (in terms of the wide availability we enjoyed with Thai).

 

[OATEK]

Everything that has been said about cheap J, or Y exit rows is true as an alternative to PE. However, on my last Y flight I could not get exit rows, and didn't at that time have enough points to enter the upgrade lottery. Our suffering was quite significant, and we vowed never to repeat. And the combined Y/J fares generally require a TA, as the online versions I have found never approach the savings often quoted by fellow travellers.

When you are travelling internationally primarily for leisure, and your long arthritic limbs give you a hard time, the PE gives some certainty. When I was younger I did the Y trips all the time, and managed to twist myself into a sleeping position in most cases. But those days are over well and truly over, and PE fares under $4K provide some certainty that the trip will at least get off to a flying start!.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

And the combined Y/J fares generally require a TA, as the online versions I have found never approach the savings often quoted by fellow travellers.

the fares I quotes are readily available to book yourself (including the sub $2200 mixed class to Europe). but it is economy for the flight to Singapore (and separate tickets).

 

[cmon0005]

True, PE seats are in a separate cabin but you still get Y food and although the seats are a little wider and the pitch is a little greater when the seat in front is fully reclined getting out for a midnight nature call still calls for contortionist skills.

You don't get Y food, you actually get very close to business service and food(some may debate that but in personal experience its been great), you even get the table cloth like in J. However I do agree for some routes QF PE is too much.eg. LHR, to Asia it is good value, but there are not many routes with it left sadly.
CX on the other hand has PE positioned as Y with wider seats, food is still similar if not the same as Y.

 

[Dalescott]

Just got off the CX flight in PE from LHR via HK. Its more Economy than Business, is it worth it. Well let me answer it this way have 5 years travelling J, it was a hard landing in PE. Will we be travelling in PE again


NO


​Trip report will be coming soon.

 

[wandering_fred]

Just got off the CX flight in PE from LHR via HK. Its more Economy than Business, is it worth it. Well let me answer it this way have 5 years travelling J, it was a hard landing in PE. Will we be travelling in PE again

NO
​Trip report will be coming soon.

Well for those of us ancient passengers paying for our own seats, please do go back to the J cabin. I grew up being able to sleep in a recliner and appreciate not having dueling elbows at mealtimes. CX may not have the best y+/PEY ambiance, but I will take it over Y in the back anyday. And yes exAustralia all of them charge an arm and a leg. Buy the tickets somewhere else.

Happy wandering

Fred

 

[Isochronous]

I find QF PE fantastic. Just saying. They desperately need it in the A330 refit.

 

[ermen]

I find QF PE fantastic. Just saying. They desperately need it in the A330 refit.

Agree - QF PE is a great product...

 

[sydks]

Agree - QF PE is a great product...

Me 3! .

 

[cmon0005]

Me 3! .

Me 4! .

 

[Himeno]

I find QF PE fantastic. Just saying. They desperately need it in the A330 refit.

Agree - QF PE is a great product...

Me 3! .

Me 4! .

Agreed. But, although the customers want it, and it will make money for Qantas, Qantas won't do it.

 

[Mr_Orange]

Just got off the CX flight in PE from LHR via HK. Its more Economy than Business, is it worth it.

I did BNE-HKG-CDG and vv in Cathay PE and I would say that the hard product is almost identical to QF's. The F&B offerings aren't up to QF's standards and the FAs weren't brilliant either.

Why you would be surprised that PE is more economy than business, I do not know. It is called Premium ECONOMY not BUSINESS Lite. Of course if you have flown J recently then it is going to seem worse, but just consider the days when PE didn't exist and the choice was Y or J. For most travellers there was no choice and it was Y every time. Now there is greater choice and it is infinitely more comfortable than standard whY down the back of the bus.

 

[Mr_Orange]

I find QF PE fantastic. Just saying. They desperately need it in the A330 refit.

Agree - QF PE is a great product...

Me 3! .

Me 4! .

Agreed. But, although the customers want it, and it will make money for Qantas, Qantas won't do it.

Think I'm, me 6 .

I reckon that 2 rows of 7 on the A330s would do it for a PE cabin. That wouldn't eat into the Y cabin too much. In any case, won't they save space in the J cabin with the new suites compared to the Skybeds?