State border closures illegal under the highest law in the country?

[bigbadbyrnes]

Everything is arguable in law, doubly so in constitutional law. This is a matter for the high court.

But here's my opening argument;

Section 92 of the highest law in the country sets out "On the imposition of uniform duties of customs, trade, commerce, and intercourse among the States, whether by means of internal carriage or ocean navigation, shall be absolutely free. "

Per Cole vs Whitfield 1988 "The notions of absolutely free trade and commerce and absolutely free intercourse are quite distinct". Sec92 clearly sets out the law for interstate trade, but also 'intercourse'.

And on the matter of what intercourse means, per Gratwick v Johnson 1945 it's the ability "to pass to and fro among the States without burden, hindrance or restriction".

Border closures, (and arguably although less certainly isolation requirements), are therefore inconsistent with the highest law in the country and should be set aside.

No one is talking about it, any legal eagles here explain? There's no room on the news for this at the moment, but if people start to fed up with the restrictions, it's worth getting them tested in the high court.

edit:

I think this analysis will answer all your questions: States are shutting their borders to stop coronavirus. Is that actually allowed?

Short version: if there are good public health grounds (for example states of emergency), those laws are likely to be held valid.

Could be worth testing if an individual could be proven to be not a thread to public health, but that would be the exception. Thanks MEL_Traveller for sharing the article.

/thread

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

It makes it completely impossible for anyone to plan anything. And I'm not talking about holidays, but work and family.

There are lives to be saved, and lives to be lived as well. I have had enough.

Well actually it just shows the trigger point of each State border. Let’s see what unfolds over the next few days and how Qld, Tas and NT and maybe Vic respond

 

[N860CR]

There are lives to be saved, and lives to be lived as well. I have had enough.

In all honesty, there would have to be a serious question mark about how many lives are “saved” by having a total hissy fit when a handful of cases pop up. NSW, who we consider to be a disgusting, corona-ridden hotspot, has suffered a whole 55 deaths since this started. Anybody dying is sad, of course, but it’s worth noting that the number is minuscule and despite a constant string of cases recently, there’s not been a single death for months.

I suspect we are now pretty good at managing this virus and the “solution” is now worse than the “problem”.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Well actually it just shows the trigger point of each State border. Let’s see what unfolds over the next few days and how Qld, Tas and NT and maybe Vic respond

There is a trigger point and that's fine, but if your threshold is 1 then your border is not open. If the rules can change from walking out in to the city for lunch, to being stuck in a hotel room for 14 days at literally the drop of a hat (and one case of COVID), then the whole thing is a waste of time.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

There is a trigger point and that's fine, but if your threshold is 1 then your border is not open. If the rules can change from walking out in to the city for lunch, to being stuck in a hotel room for 14 days at literally the drop of a hat (and one case of COVID), then the whole thing is a waste of time.

WA’s trigger point was in black and white.....the border is open, just now need to quarantine for 14 days because of yes 1 local case. ....and yes people were caught out mid-flight. Fortunately they haven’t required all traveling in the past 2 days from SA to quarantine. Small mercies.

It’s happened before. NT requiring Qld to quarantine at one point, Qld closing to NSW after two weeks of being open etc

 

[flydoc]

WA’s trigger point was in black and white.....Fortunately they haven’t required all traveling in the past 2 days from SA to quarantine.

It appears they ARE requiring just that, plus a couple of nasal swabs:

WA directs SA travellers to get tested and quarantine, less than 48 hours after border fall

The number of people entering Western Australia since the hard border ended is believed to have surpassed the 3,000 mark, as a cluster of COVID-19 cases in South Australia continues to grow.

www.abc.net.au

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

It appears they ARE requiring just that, plus a couple of nasal swabs:

WA directs SA travellers to get tested and quarantine, less than 48 hours after border fall

The number of people entering Western Australia since the hard border ended is believed to have surpassed the 3,000 mark, as a cluster of COVID-19 cases in South Australia continues to grow.

www.abc.net.au

Was I wrong? I read it as those already entered are to get tested and isolate until result negative....so maybe 24 hours isolation.

 

[jakeseven7]

WA’s trigger point was in black and white.....the border is open, just now need to quarantine for 14 days because of yes 1 local case. ....and yes people were caught out mid-flight. Fortunately they haven’t required all traveling in the past 2 days from SA to quarantine. Small mercies.

It’s happened before. NT requiring Qld to quarantine at one point, Qld closing to NSW after two weeks of being open etc

I don’t think anyone is disputing WA’s trigger point is black and white but as night follows day every single state is going to be locked out (again) to WA because the threshold could not possibly be lower. Just watch it happen...

They make QLD look reasonable and practical and that is saying something Honestly please god just let March arrive already

 

[oz_mark]

Was I wrong? I read it as those already entered are to get tested and isolate until result negative....so maybe 24 hours isolation.

That's what I understood. Anyone arriving yesterday (Saturday) will need to get tested.

 

[flydoc]

Was I wrong? I read it as those already entered are to get tested and isolate until result negative....so maybe 24 hours isolation.

Agreed, the ABC article was open to interpretation on timeframes, and current online travel advice is a little more explicit:
“Anyone who arrived in WA [from SA] on Saturday 14 or Sunday 15 November will be contacted by WA officials, tested for COVID-19 and will need to self-quarantine until they receive the test results.”

COVID-19

Health advice and information on COVID-19, including when to get tested or self-isolate, symptoms, how to avoid infection, getting vaccinated and long COVID.

www.healthdirect.gov.au

Would not be at all surprised if WA subsequently extend the quarantine period for this cohort though

 

[jb747]

The sooner they use all of that mining equipment to physically separate WA from the rest of the country, the better...

 

[Flashback]

Be interesting to see if this becomes more than just the 3 states, may provide greater confidence in opening borders?

NSW, Victoria and ACT to link up contact tracing systems

Using decentralised national data exchange.

www.itnews.com.au

 

[jakeseven7]

Be interesting to see if this becomes more than just the 3 states, may provide greater confidence in opening borders?

NSW, Victoria and ACT to link up contact tracing systems

Using decentralised national data exchange.

www.itnews.com.au

Yes this was announced last week during National Cabinet, VIC and NSW have the best contact tracing systems, procedures and personnel so have been chosen for the trial, sounds pretty simple in terms of integration so it will be more about data security I expect.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Watching the news for the first time in ages (I decided to tune out for my own health) and I am disgusted at the response of QLD and WA. Our country is completely at the behest of these fools in charge.

It's ridiculous that one single case in a state of 6.4 million people can reset the clock, so to speak, that WA has set - then putting things back 28 days. ONE case! Time to just finally admit defeat that the country will not be one again until a vaccine is widely distributed.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Watching the news for the first time in ages (I decided to tune out for my own health) and I am disgusted at the response of QLD and WA. Our country is completely at the behest of these fools in charge.

It's ridiculous that one single case in a state of 6.4 million people can reset the clock, so to speak, that WA has set - then putting things back 28 days. ONE case! Time to just finally admit defeat that the country will not be one again until a vaccine is widely distributed.

I suppose there will always be a range of views... I agree with the closure/reset. We saw in Victoria the damage a single case can do. A devastating second wave. It's hard to argue with a state wanting to protect itself.

 

[Must...Fly!]

I suppose there will always be a range of views... I agree with the closure/reset. We saw in Victoria the damage a single case can do. A devastating second wave. It's hard to argue with a state wanting to protect itself.

That is a binary view of looking at things though. Depending on your point of view you could easily argue with the decisions of politicians.

Unfortunately we are victims of our own success.

 

[N860CR]

Unfortunately we are victims of our own success.

This is ultimately what it comes down to. Eliminating a contagious, airborne, surface grabbing virus that is so weak most people don’t even know they’ve got it is impossible. We’ve “achieved” what we have by implementing unfathomable restrictions (like locking our own citizens out of the country, preventing people from leaving their own state etc) and gotten to a point where it’s not in the community as such, but can easily be released (as we saw from this cleaner in Adelaide touching a bench or something). It’s not a practical or reasonable long term approach, but that’s what we’ve gone for and it’s going to continue to cause problems.

Most people in the world can’t afford to do what we’ve been forced to. I guess we can appreciate being the rich, spoiled nation of Australia. Well, except for those left behind.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

It’s not a practical or reasonable long term approach...

That's right. And we were waiting for the results of the vaccine trials. They are in now with resounding success. So we'll only have to put up with lockdowns for another few months!

if the vaccines hadn't been successful we'd have had to look at a different way of living: managing the virus and the vulnerable.

 

[trevella]

if the vaccines hadn't been successful we'd have had to look at a different way of living: managing the virus and the vulnerable.

And with a vaccine? We'll still have to manage the virus and the vulnerable.

 

[jakeseven7]

And with a vaccine? We'll still have to manage the virus and the vulnerable.

People are still very confused and think that once the vaccine arrives covid disappears.... sigh. So will we still have the dramatic 'slamming borders' even when there is a vaccine?.... I hope WA and QLD have caught up by then....

 

[antycbr]

People are still very confused and think that once the vaccine arrives covid disappears.... sigh. So will we still have the dramatic 'slamming borders' even when there is a vaccine?.... I hope WA and QLD have caught up by then....

Those of us in NSW seem to have given up on Queensland and WA ever seeing sense and are moving on with our lives. Waiting for my NSW dining and entertainment vouchers now... which will be spent in NSW.

Meanwhile operators in northern NSW make even more bumper profits.