Takeoff and Landing - Regulation / Etiquette

[MEL_Traveller]

People who dont follow directions tend to annoy people simply because they can kill, nothing surprising really! Look at what happened with US Air 1493, instructions by crew/airlines are there for a reason, and it's not to annoy.

I agree totally, my post said passengers endangering my path to the exit should be my concern. That would include someone asleep or listening to their ipod if seated at an exit row. But sitting by the window at a non exit row? Or standing up while the plane is in the last couple of seconds before stopping? (If the person under the locker wants to complain then that is their right). Or using your phone with a 30 minute delay announced? Some common sense needs to be employed : )

I'm not condoning it, but these things happen, and if they happen at a non-critical phase, or if they happen and have absolutely no impact on me then that's a different matter. I quite often have my seat partially reclined for landing if the weather is fine and everything is going normal. But that is a risk that only affects me. Different story if I am on a two class aircraft where my seat recline could affect someone else (but on some such as VS it doesn't and recline is permitted anyway)

 

[markis10]

Alright, markis10, I give up - wikipedia has failed to enlighten me on US Air 1493, at least regards passengers ignoring crew or airline instructions. As much as I hate to quote Pauline Hanson.... Please explain?!

Two passengers argued at the exit blocking egress of other passengers despite instructions to deplane, it's one of the few examples of an aircraft accident where so many fatalities were not in their seat.

 

[markis10]

So who put in a report:

http://www.atsb.gov.au/newsroom/new...vices-during-flight.aspx#.T6yMVgLwdKQ.twitter

Report narrative:
The reporter expressed a safety concern about the use of 3G mobile devices onboard a Syd-Melb flight. The reporter, who is a regular traveller, observes that passengers are using these devices more and more frequently, texting and using internet connectivity during flight. The reporter believes that cabin crew do not take this safety matter seriously and often do not adequately warn passengers to turn off electronic devices or that the devices should be in flight mode.

Responses/received:
REPCON supplied the operator with the de-identified report. The following is a version of their response:
Cabin safety has advised that a review of our occurrence database from 01/01/11 shows that on over 500 occasions cabin crew have reported the hazard of passengers using their mobile phones and personal electronic devices (PEDs) onboard. It is felt that the sheer volume of reports received in relation to passenger non-compliance with our PED policy illustrates that cabin crew are very aware of the regulatory requirements and company policies on this matter and are very vigilant in ensuring compliance, particularly during the pre-departure preparations as the cabin is being secured for takeoff.

In addition, it's quite possible that onboard passengers writing text messages are constructing them whilst their phones are in flight mode. It is also not possible for cabin crew to manage passenger use of PEDs during takeoff and/or the descent phase as the cabin crew must be seated. The reports we receive also highlight passenger reluctance and attitudes towards PED usage and the belief it is the operator's policy and not a regulatory requirement. However, the operator honestly believes the hundreds of reports that come through each year show that our cabin crew take passenger use of PEDs at inappropriate times very seriously.

In addition, the PED policy is currently part of the cabin crew recurrent emergency procedures curriculum and is covered in the "Standard Operating Procedures" section of the training day. The proliferation of PEDs has made the potential much higher for non-compliance but it is not possible for cabin crew to check that all PEDs are switched to flight mode and then off. In this respect cabin crew act in good faith that passengers are compliant, responsible and accountable themselves.
REPCON supplied CASA with the deidentified report and a version of the operator's response. The following is a version of the response that CASA provided:
CASA has reviewed this matter with internal subject matter experts and has examined the operator's procedures, CASA is satisfied with the operator's response.
ATSB comment:
The use of mobile phones and other electronic devices is restricted as they could interfere with vital aircraft navigation systems. Current regulations give aircraft crew the power to prohibit the use of any device which can threaten the safety of an aircraft. It is very important that passengers listen to and comply with announcements from the cabin crew when these restrictions apply.

 

[docjames]

Translation: We're not going to do anything else that say you shouldnt use them.


How helpful.

 

[tuapekastar]

Approaching MEL from AKL a few days ago I was in 4C and the lady in 4D was very active with her berry thing, for the last 4 or 5 minutes. I've no idea if she was actively texting 'live' but her fingers were going nineteen to the dozen on the keypad and a little red light at the centre top of the device was flashing. I would have loved to give her a firm reminder of the 'rules' (which were clearly stated over the PA) but I had no idea if she was actually breaking them. But it was not a good look.

Edit: Obviously, she was breaking the rules by even having it switched on, what I meant was I wasn't sure if she was 'transmitting' or 'receiving'. No noises from the device.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

As they say on AA "if your device has a battery & an on/off switch it must be turned off - yes even airplane mode".

 

[openseat]

I quite often have my seat partially reclined for landing if the weather is fine and everything is going normal. But that is a risk that only affects me.)

Actually you are impeding the space behind you which may well have an effect on the ability of the passengers in the row behind you making the quickest possible escape in an emergency.

 

[markis10]

Actually you are impeding the space behind you which may well have an effect on the ability of the passengers in the row behind you making the quickest possible escape in an emergency.

Not to mention increasing the chance of head impact during a sudden stop for that passenger as well.

 

[Katie]

That reminds me - AKL-BNE on 30/4, a few rows behind us another passenger was telling off a
Person in the row in front for not fully turning off her device.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Actually you are impeding the space behind you which may well have an effect on the ability of the passengers in the row behind you making the quickest possible escape in an emergency.

not at all. as i said... if I am on a two-class aircraft I need to be aware of someone sitting behind me. otherwise it doesn't apply.