The COVID-19 vaccine rollout in Australia has begun

[lovetravellingoz]

The numbers don't lie, utilization from the primary care channel is the lowest of all channels in use by a long way.

You still do not understand the utilisation rate. Though at least you have abandoned describing it incorrectly as wastage.


By the the way what is the utilisation rate of Pfizer issued to the GP Channel?

 

[Lynda2475]

You still do not understand the utilisation rate

In your opinion. Wastage is indeed a portion of the poor utilization, a fact stated on the chart.

Unused doses sitting in a GPs fridge are not helping anyone, giving those to a hub who can actually get them into arms today is of much greater benefit.

 

[JB expat]

Armed patrols, complacency and COVID-19: Has Australia bungled the pandemic?

NSW is neck-deep into a lockdown with no firm end date and Victoria is going into a snap five-day lockdown. It’s starting to feel like every man and woman for themselves.

www.theage.com.au

It is this - the complete lack of urgency that is at the crux of the problem we are facing -

"Professor Greg Dore is an infectious diseases physician and epidemiologist at the Kirby Institute of UNSW.
He says that while Australia’s elimination strategy has been wonderful and well-achieved, it fostered a complacency that is now biting us.

“This is a really crucial time,” Dore says.

“It does appear the Delta variant is considerably more infectious. That has changed the game. It does make sustaining an elimination strategy very difficult.”
Dore is horrified by the trashing of the AstraZeneca vaccine."

“The anti-AZ push – we will look back on this and be amazed at how we had been so negative about a safe and effective vaccine,” he says.
He calls it “the most baffling public health response I have ever seen”.


“We have been lazily plodding along in elimination mode, and ‘It’s not a race’, and even many in the medical profession not having that urgency.
“We have sat back and rested on our laurels.”
Professor Dore is still a proponent of elimination until there is high vaccine coverage.
He just laments that we don’t have that now.

“The main criticism for me is not the way [the federal government] chose the vaccines or negotiated the contracts, it’s the lack of urgency.”

 

[jakeseven7]

"Scott Morrison’s decision to blame the government’s immunisation advisers for delays in the Covid-19 vaccine rollout has been labelled “unfair” and “disappointing” by a recent member of the group."

‘Not time for blame game’: former Atagi representative says Morrison’s AstraZeneca comments ‘unfair’

Australia’s immunisation adviser says Covid vaccine rollout the responsibility of government

www.theguardian.com

Not siding with anyone but I’d say ATAGI’s contribution has been ‘disappointing and unfair’ to the Australian population so there you go old mates.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

In your opinion. Wastage is indeed a portion of the poor utilization, a fact stated on the chart.

Yes a fact back when you were incorrectly claiming that Utilisation Rate was the Wastage Rate I alerted you to Odd that you want to quote back to myself what I revealed to you now.



So small % wastage and this applies to all channels.

Unused doses sitting in a GPs fridge are not helping anyone, giving those to a hub who can actually get them into arms today is of much greater benefit.

Ok so we will just ship all that unused AZ over to the NSW State Hubs then. Problem solved as according to you it is only matter of efficiency.

Personally my view is that the utilisation rate is largely a function of demand, combined with what the Feds have chosen to supply.

 

[sjk]

Only then (Nov 2020) was the first discussion about 'when can we get some' began. Prior to that the Govt had not confirmed they wished to purchase any Pfizer.

Maybe you meant “only after the release of Pfizer’s surpassed-all-prior-hopes Phase III results on November 9”? Or perhaps “only after mRNA was demonstrated to be more than an entirely unproven technology”?

 

[Lynda2475]

Odd that you want to quote back to myself what I revealed to you now.

Not at all. My position hasn't changed they are both wasting and under utilizing their allocated doses - I've always referred to the official stats.

Ok so we will just ship all that unused AZ over to the NSW State Hubs then. Problem solved as according to you it is only matter of efficiency.

Absolutely not what I said. My post was entirely about Pfizer and you know it.

If anything AZ should be dropped from NSW state hubs altogether to focus solely on Pfizer. Pfizer is what is in demand and what the NSW run hubs were set up to deliver, firstly to the workers in 1a and 1b (via the hospital hubs) then expanded to the general public with addition of the mass vaccination centres. AZ was only a late addition to the NSW state hubs and an unnecessary one.

Anyone in the eligible age group for AZ over 60s has had months to get a vaccination, those under 60 should not even have to contemplate taking the lesser option of AZ.

** edited to add NSW because even though it is obvious I was replying to a sarcastic assertion about NSW, LTO is determined to argue out of context. It is well known that Olympic Park is the only NSW state run hub giving both Pfizer and AZ.

 

[sjk]

those under 60 should not even have to contemplate taking the lesser option of AZ.

Just pointing out that “the lesser option” is an entirely subjective characterisation best kept to yourself <redacted>

 

[Flying mermaid]

Just pointing out that “the lesser option” is an entirely subjective characterisation best kept to yourself <redacted>

newsGP - Evidence indicates AstraZeneca and Pfizer COVID vaccines are equally effective

Experts say the research is reassuring, and indicates that both COVID vaccines offer a pathway to Australia reaching a high level of immunity.

www1.racgp.org.au

 

[Lynda2475]

One jab of AstraZeneca, Pfizer ‘barely inhibits’ Delta variant

A Pasteur Institute study finds that two doses of the widely used vaccines are needed to provide strong immunity against the highly infectious mutation.

www.smh.com.au

"in real world conditions, researchers in Britain found that even one dose of Pfizer provided 94 per cent likelihood of protection against hospitalisation, and AstraZeneca provided 71 percent protection after one jab"

"The same study found two doses of the Pfizer vaccine was 96 per cent protective against hospitalisation with the Delta variant and 88 per cent effective against symptomatic infection. "

 

[lovetravellingoz]

If anything AZ should be dropped from state hubs altogether to focus solely on Pfizer.

For no logical reason at all. It would also disadvantage those who might have a hub convenient to them who are eligible to have AZ.

Pfizer is what is in demand and what the hubs were set up to deliver,

Well I don't know about what NSW does, but the hubs in Vic were set up to deliver all vaccine types.

firstly to the workers in 1a and 1b (via the hospital hubs)

Well as I know many in that category who were given AZ at hubs, that is not accurate. Pfizer was in short supply, and has always been in short supply and in Vic at least until the guidelines changed 1a and 1b were given both vaccine types.

With aged care workers and others who have not yet vaccinated that still remains the case based on their age.

then expanded to the general public with addition of the mass vaccination centres. AZ was only a late addition and an unnecessary one.

One again incorrect on all aspects. AZ was made available as soon as it was available with the right approvals.

The general public has been able to access AZ based on age (as it has with Pfizer) once it was opened up to the general public, and this has varied . It has been varied again recently due the situation in Sydney.

 

[Lynda2475]

My reply to you was wrt NSW as your assertion was that unwanted AZ should go to NSW state hubs giving AZ (which is one site). But you insist on taking my posts completely out of context.

Well I don't know about what NSW does

Clearly, because what I stated is what the NSW sate run hubs were set up for. The original ones were all at hospitals and were Pfizer only for 1a, then expanded to some of 1b workers (other 1B likes over 70s who were eligible only for AZ had to go to commonwealth RCs or a GP). The only NSW State hub that does AZ is Olympic Park, the rest are Pfizer.

Well as I know many in that category who were given AZ at hubs, that is not accurate.

In Victoria maybe, not in NSW state run hubs, maybe in NSW commonwealth respiratory clinincs. Gladys was clear when they added AZ at Olympic Park, that is was the only state site doing dual vaccines.

Glady had to lobby Scomo to be allowed to expand the state hubs to non 1a and 1b workers, and get vaccine allocation outside 1a and 1b because the commonwealth rollout was going to slow. Other states then also asked for the same, Vic's state hubs were stood up sooner, but Olympic Park was planned first.

One again incorrect on all aspects. AZ was made available as soon as it was available with the right approvals.

The general public has been able to access AZ based on age, and this has varied . It has been varied again recently due the situation in Sydney.

No, you have once again taken my comment about AZ being a later addition to Olympic Park and applied that country wide.

AZ has been available via commonwealth primary care channels since March, but when Olympic Park opened it was Pfizer only, AZ was added its 3rd week of operation, hence a small and late addition to the state run hubs in NSW.

 

[RAM]

What the Federal Govt has failed to answer is where did all the weeks of Pfizer supply get injected as it certainly still hasn't made it into all Group 1A Aged & Disability Care residents & workers. The Disability sector is still unable to find available Pfizer doses.

I tried today as I found it hard to believe given all the publicity, so I went through the questions etc but ticked disability care worker and at the nearest State sites got the message "No appointments available within 60 days, try another available location in the dropdown box".

Trouble is there were no locations shown in the dropdown box.

Glad I'm not a disability worker.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

What the Federal Govt has failed to answer is where did all the weeks of Pfizer supply get injected as it certainly still hasn't made it into all Group 1A Aged & Disability Care residents & workers. The Disability sector is still unable to find available Pfizer doses.

I tried today as I found it hard to believe given all the publicity, so I went through the questions etc but ticked disability care worker and at the nearest State sites got the message "No appointments available within 60 days, try another available location in the dropdown box".

Trouble is there were no locations shown in the dropdown box.

Glad I'm not a disability worker.

I think there are some Pfizer places that give priority to aged and disability care (and health care) workers. But at some places its on a first come first serve (assuming the person is eligible).

Given the brought forward Pfizer doses, there would have been a mad-rush to the online booking system (well at least that's what I humorously imagine to myself). And there will be consequently some with double bookings, which need to get cancelled in due course.

 

[drron]

One jab of AstraZeneca, Pfizer ‘barely inhibits’ Delta variant

A Pasteur Institute study finds that two doses of the widely used vaccines are needed to provide strong immunity against the highly infectious mutation.

www.smh.com.au

"in real world conditions, researchers in Britain found that even one dose of Pfizer provided 94 per cent likelihood of protection against hospitalisation, and AstraZeneca provided 71 percent protection after one jab"

"The same study found two doses of the Pfizer vaccine was 96 per cent protective against hospitalisation with the Delta variant and 88 per cent effective against symptomatic infection. "

So why didn't you give the figures for 2 doses of the AZ vaccine in that study.Could it have been it was 92% effective against hospitalisation with the delta strain.Plus stated there had been no covid deaths from either the alpha or delta variants when fully vaccinated with AZ.The study doesn't make that claim with the Pfizer results.

Real world data from PHE, published as a pre-print, demonstrated two doses of COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca are 92% effective against hospitalisation due to the Delta variant and showed no deaths among those vaccinated. The vaccine also showed a high level of effectiveness against the Alpha variant (B.1.1.7; formerly the ‘Kent’ variant) with an 86% reduction of hospitalisations and no deaths reported

doesn't quite fit the narrative that AZ is an inferior vaccine though.

 

[mviy]

Plus stated there had been no covid deaths from either the alpha or delta variants when fully vaccinated with AZ.The study doesn't make that claim with the Pfizer results.

So if you are fully vaccinated with AZ you're more likely to survive exposure to COVID? Good to know. Feeling good that AZ is what my immediate family and I have had, though I have only had my first dose so far.

The politicians should really be talking this up to remind people that both AZ and Pfizer are good vaccines.

 

[Lynda2475]

So why didn't you give the figures for 2 doses of the AZ vaccine in that study.

Those figures were not part of the article i linked to.

However, 92% is less than 96%, then there is the clot issue and longer time to full vaccination so still inferior choice imo.

 

[burmans]

So if you are fully vaccinated with AZ you're more likely to survive exposure to COVID? Good to know. Feeling good that AZ is what my immediate family and I have had, though I have only had my first dose so far.

The politicians should really be talking this up to remind people that both AZ and Pfizer are good vaccines.

They are talking it up in NSW, I’ve been watching the presser a lot recently and mentioned every day I watch it! They are also saying the protection from just one dose of AZ is quite low against delta hence the push, also mentioned each day, for people in key LGAs to get their second dose earlier that 12 weeks (min. 6 suggested).

 

[Lynda2475]

I disagree that they have been talking it up.

Dr Chant has been encouraging those over 50s who had a first AZ to go back for the second (and consider bringing it foward if you live in South West). But for younger folks they have been careful to say if you want AZ you must get advice from your GP, the state hubs wont give first dose of AZ to under 50s.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Those figures were not part of the article i linked to.

However, 92% is less than 96%, then there is the clot issue and longer time to full vaccination so still inferior choice imo.

Anyone seeking advice on their vaccinations should go to their GP.
This is particularly important in Sydney right now as the risk of contracting Covid vastly outweighs any risk of adverse effects from any of the vaccines (Pfizer / AZ) available in Australia just now regardless of the age group you are in.