The night you want a cranky QF Flight Attendant!

[N860CR]

Had a rather interesting flight on the ROK-SYD direct tonight!

I was one of three paid Premium Economy pax and had a generally pleasant flight with helpful crew. I noticed on boarding, interestinly enough, that there were water bottles placed on seats 2A & 2C (E170) which ended up having no PE pax in them. The three of us in 1A, 1F & 2F were oddly left out...

A late joiner was the rather scruffy looking person who sat in 2A. Now I don't usually judge lol and I thought it odd that he was up in PE. When the cart service began, it was obvious that he was a "Saver" pax as no "Flexi" meal was provided and he purchased his wine. So much for DJ keeping the non-PE pax out of PE...

Moving on... this man proceeded to drink his red wine and began using a game of some description on his iPhone. This game involved very loud and constant gun fire and people screaming. This was added to by him laughing loudly and dropping some lovely lines like "die mother ******". This went on for 10 minutes or so and the crew passed by again and picked up some rubbish. The FA said nothing and (good on her) the lady seated behind me called across the aisle to the man and said "could you turn that down please". He answered with "you're not sleeping or anything are ya?" and she just said "no, but it's very annoying". The FA watched and walked on. A minute or two later said man stopped the FA and asked for another wine which she provided after an exchange about payment methods.

Once settled into his wine, the man continued with his iPhone game/ap however now added wolf whistles and dirty stares to the lady behind me. To her credit, she remained quiet and didn't engage however there was a good chance she was just a little frightened (I was getting a bit concerned myself - he was a solid built man). Finally one of the FA's walked past and I noticed her stop. Finally, I thought, but no. He was asking for another drink and off she went to fetch it. After a few minutes she returned and I heard her say that they were out of red. Very good, I thought, nice way of letting him down without a fight. But no, she offers a white instead The man must have complained a bit as I heard the FA drop lines like "It's only a small plane" etc, however he did accept the white. I thought that just maybe they hadn't noticed the behaviour, however I'd seen enough pauses and sidewards glances to know that they had, especially after argumentitive complaints about the wine.

The flight ended and I figured we were on the ground safely, however when the seatbelt sign was switched off I noticed the man was death staring the lady behind me and continuing with the whistles and cat calls. Being the macho man I am (anyone who knows me is free to laugh now) decided the G&T I'd had on the way down made me twice my size so I stood up to get my bag intentionally standing in the aisle between the two. Said man leaned forward to me and said quietly "careful, there's a terrorist on the plane" and then proceeded to harass the woman across me. I eyeballed the FA to be met with a blank glaze. The chatty American who was sitting next to the lady offered to get her bag down and said man then let go with classy lines like "Oh yes let him grab you're bag" and other references to where the American should be sticking things. I'll leave it to your imagination!

We then walked off the plane as far as I know without incident, however to the ladys credit she did hang back a bit.

I don't like to say bad things about Virgin given all the good work they're doing, however this incident really shocked me and I honestly believe a "good old cranky" QF FA would not have put up with this. I'm hardly versed in the Service Industry (however I do have an RSA) but the general behaviour of this man on boarding and in the early stages of the flight would have thrown up a flag and at least prompted me not to serve drinks to him. One maybe, but three wine's on a 90 minute flight is roughly 5.4 drinks and given the lack of oxygen in the cabin the effect of them was more in the region of 8 plus what he could have had on the ground. The fact that the crew didn't step in to do anything and left it up to the passenger to try to get him under control is also a worry, also the fact that he found himself in 2A on a saver ticket.

Just thought I'd share my story for the evening. I had generally another pleasant DJ PE flight, however this little incident did show (to me anyway) that Virgin still have a little way to go to reach that "premium" mark.

 

[DJ 1D]

...however this little incident did show (to me anyway) that Virgin still have a little way to go to reach that "premium" mark.

No it doesn't. It shows that you had one bad flight with one bad crew. Now you should contact Virgin and let them know. Based on my experience, everything I've heard, everything I've read here and elsewhere, the attitude of crew and management, the direction of the company...they will listen and take your complaint seriously.

 

[JohnK]

One maybe, but three wine's on a 90 minute flight is roughly 5.4 drinks and given the lack of oxygen in the cabin the effect of them was more in the region of 8 plus what he could have had on the ground. The fact that the crew didn't step in to do anything and left it up to the passenger to try to get him under control is also a worry, also the fact that he found himself in 2A on a saver ticket.

I have had 3 beers on a BNE-SYD flight, roughly 4.2 drinks after a few drinks in the lounge, and did not/do not behave like this clown. Are you sure it was the alcohol or does this clown behave this way all the time? Some people do not need any alcohol to annoy others....

 

[N860CR]

No it doesn't. It shows that you had one bad flight with one bad crew. Now you should contact Virgin and let them know. Based on my experience, everything I've heard, everything I've read here and elsewhere, the attitude of crew and management, the direction of the company...they will listen and take your complaint seriously.

True, but aside from the crew not handling the situation well I also took issue with such a person being seated in row 2, a row that I believed was reserved for PE pax only. Trust me I'm the biggest Virgin lover/QF not-so-much lover around these days, but a part of me just seems to think it would have been handled differently on the rat.

I have had 3 beers on a BNE-SYD flight, roughly 4.2 drinks after a few drinks in the lounge, and did not/do not behave like this clown. Are you sure it was the alcohol or does this clown behave this way all the time? Some people do not need any alcohol to annoy others....

You're right there, John, and I'd often have more, however there was just something about this guy that made me think there was significant alcohol involved. When someone is acting irrationally, I would generally think that feeding them alcohol isn't the answer. Bit like a grass fire, it might not have been caused by petrol, but throw some on and it's going to get worse!

Wasn't my intention to have a go at anyone, just thought I'd throw it out there for discussion. I guess I should raise it with Virgin.

 

[Ascent]

I will agree with you that a cranky/experienced flight attendant probably would have handled it better. That said from what I've seen the JQ / DJ crews have been a bit more willing to cut the booze off than the QF crews in my experience - usually too quickly and not flexible at all 'one drink per hour'. With this situation alcohol should have been stopped straight away, pax warned about their behaviour, female moved to another seat and if the behaviour continued AFP requested to meet aircraft on arrival. Sounds like the crew were new/green/too scared to deal with the situation in which case the Cabin Supervisor should hand back their badge. I would definitely be contacting the airline because the supervisor and crew definitely need to be spoken to.

Surprised that no-one said anything to the crew - had it been me i'd have gone for a walk down the back and asked what they were thinking giving any more booze to someone behaving like that. Something should def have been said about the terrorist comment - even if he'd already left the aircraft.

 

[dfcatch]

The terrorist comment alone is enough to warrant the AFP.

There is a firm legal basis behind "we take jokes about security seriously".

Even if the previous behaviour was enough I would have said something at that point (even quietly to the crew on disembarkation). It's not like they don't know who he is.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

You know, being an FA would have it's perks and fun times, but I'd hate it when faced with situations like that. As said, this guy was intimidating at best........the FA may have felt the same.

I do recall one flight I was on, and the FA was giving the emergency exit brief to those seated in the "blue" zone. The guy nearest the door made a quip I didn't hear, but assumed it had something to do with inappropriate opening of said door! I could see the FA was in a quandry and for a moment continued with the brief, but then made the correct decision. She simply said, "I'm sorry Sir, I did hear what you just said and as such I must now relocate you", with which she went a few seats forward, quietly asked a gentleman if he would swap and it was done. The guy forward got a blue zone seat at the comedians expense! I though everyone knew there are certain topics you do not joke about on a plane!

 

[anat0l]

What befuddles me about this incident is that no one did anything at all about the man's behaviour. This includes all the pax who were in the man's vicinity - including the OP - as well as the crew. Well, except for the lady who was then intimidated for the remainder of the flight - bless her soul - and the fact that she was intimidated and no one did anything about it was also rather befuddling.

In "theory", except for the terrorist comment (and even then), nothing that the man did strictly was against the law. At least, that would probably be his "defence" if he were pulled up on his actions (along with the usual "we live in a democracy; I can do whatever I like" argument). What he did was probably socially unacceptable however, but in cases like these there is a higher onus on pax to take affirmative action in order to address this kind of behaviour. After all, had all the pax around him - including the OP - behaved in the same way, there would probably not be any problem, right?

Perhaps there is more that the FAs should have done here, but I don't think that any of the affected pax, including the OP, can completely wash their hands of being irresponsible for their comfort. What were you afraid of? Him calling you nasty names? Perhaps you getting punched? He could very well have done these to any FA as much as yourself.

The largest failing I see here is that this man managed to sit in PE. This is of course assuming he is not meant to be there, i.e. wrong fare, wasn't invited at the airport to sit there (either through operational or other manual upgrade), etc. He may have been entitled to sit there, in which case the FAs did not fail in that respect. Certainly a QF FA would almost never fail in this respect, as they are usually very good at remembering and checking who and who should not be in J. Then again, I haven't heard many people try to pull off the trick on a QF aircraft; perhaps that says something about the pax who fly QF (even if they do fly Y).

Also, let's be cynical for a second here. This argument - especially given the accusative title - could've been more a discussion which purports that QF FAs are not much more than a bunch of fun police. DJ FAs, especially given that their average age pales in comparison to their counterparts at QF, may have found little wrong with the man's behaviour, or might have just put it down to this man just being one of those weird pax that you meet as part of your job. Others, who may not have flown with you on that day, may think the same way.



----------
This anat0l content, if it must be known,
Was sent via Aust Freq Fly app, but not from an iPhone.

 

[Gremlin]

Perhaps there is more that the FAs should have done here, but I don't think that any of the affected pax, including the OP, can completely wash their hands of being irresponsible for their comfort. What were you afraid of? Him calling you nasty names? Perhaps you getting punched? He could very well have done these to any FA as much as yourself.

I have to politely disagree with this view. As we're reminded every time we get onto a flight, "The cabin crew's primary responsibility is to ensure our safety." The behaviour of this individual (if as reported) represents a threat to the safety of other passengers (whether that threat materialised or otherwise). Whilst the OP or other pax may have chosen to place themselves in the path of that threat, it should be dealt with appropriately by the FAs.

If it were me, I'd have approached airport staff immediately after disembarking and reported it. I'd be submitting a letter in writing to DJ management and also to the AFP.

 

[Moody]

So at no time did the poster or anyone else speak to the crew about the passenger. Seems like a quick solution and a whole lot easier to do than spend 30 minutes writing a long (and frankly pointless) letter to AFF.

 

[anat0l]

I have to politely disagree with this view. As we're reminded every time we get onto a flight, "The cabin crew's primary responsibility is to ensure our safety." The behaviour of this individual (if as reported) represents a threat to the safety of other passengers (whether that threat materialised or otherwise). Whilst the OP or other pax may have chosen to place themselves in the path of that threat, it should be dealt with appropriately by the FAs.

If it were me, I'd have approached airport staff immediately after disembarking and reported it. I'd be submitting a letter in writing to DJ management and also to the AFP.

This is the sticky point. At what exact point in the course of events would you feel that the FAs should've (and, more importantly, could've) intervened as a point of safety? You have to remember that as an FA charged with a certain degree of responsibility and (to another certain degree) authority, you have to be able to justify to the passenger why they are a threat to safety, as well as why you intend to follow through with whatever consequences you intend to inflict upon them. I'm not saying this as an excuse for no enforcement of any rules, but just like you can't just offload someone for any reason and not tell them why.

Also, you mentioned that you would've reported this incident to airport staff as well as a letter to DJ upon disembarkation. The fact that you mention that you would take that action is a validation of my point - there needs to be some affirmative action on the part of the pax in this case, especially because there was not a full blatant illegal act being done. Your point of view would mean that the full onus of reporting this person would and should fall on the FAs. If you mean that FAs should be more proactive so it wouldn't get to that point, well then we are back at the sticking point aforementioned, which could be more quickly unstuck with the help of the pax. In this case, however, none of the pax - bar one poor soul - bothered to do so.

So at no time did the poster or anyone else speak to the crew about the passenger. Seems like a quick solution and a whole lot easier to do than spend 30 minutes writing a long (and frankly pointless) letter to AFF.

This again pretty much sums up my view. If it wasn't a quicker solution it would probably lead to a much more effective outcome for the OP and other affected pax.

 

[drron]

Of course if he had asked for an Orange Juice..............

American Airlines Responds To Psychotic OJ Incident - The Consumerist

 

[opusman]

Why didn't you just ask one of the cabin crew if they could do something about the problem?

 

[Jama]

I would imagine that the laws applying to the responsible service of alcohol on the ground apply equally in the air. Refusing to serve someone alcohol is based on their behavior, there is no requirement to breathalyse someone to check if they have actually had too much before refusing any more. Based on this account, the supply of alcohol likely fueling this person to become more and more obnoxious should have been stopped. Why he was seated where he was, who knows, but you would think there would have been good reason to double check if he should be there and move him if appropriate. Even if he was meant to be there, there comes a point at which you forfeit your privileges. Granted, he might annoy people somewhere else if moved, but given he was victimizing a specific individual moving him away from them would have been the decent thing to do.

From my experience raising issues with VA is a waste of breath so good luck with that, but these things should be pointed out.

 

[Jama]

I do agree also that having a word to staff onboard at the time would also be appropriate. Possibly, offering assistance if necessary given they are all human too.

 

[Noob]

From my experience raising issues with VA is a waste of breath so good luck with that, but these things should be pointed out.

That may well be your experience, but I have always got a prompt and sincere reply from VA - they do care.

 

[MarkD]

That may well be your experience, but I have always got a prompt and sincere reply from VA - they do care.

Of course you have


Damn you iphone and fat fingers. Sent from my iphone and AFF app )

 

[serfty]

It may or may not be an issue, but did the latecomer actually have 2A on their BP?

 

[TonyHancock]

A few years ago I had a rather average experience on a BA flight to SIN.

I was flying Y+ to LHR and found myself sitting next to a a young lad. He kept drinking and drinking the small bottles of red wine. The FA's kept them coming for him. A couple of hours out of SIN he started wanting to talk to me and insisted on touching my arm and shoulder to get attention.

I asked him to stop and he wouldn't. He was absolutely drunk, incapable of any sort of reasonable speech. I called the FA who tried to calm him. Upon final approach he decided to climb over me and start walking about the cabin. The crew had to get him seated. The FA removed 9 (nine) mini red wine bottles from the back of seat storage.:shock:

Upon disembarkation the FA offered me a box of chocolates by way of an apology, with the excuse that he was served by several different FA's and they hadn't realised he had been drinking so much. I did not accept the chocolates. Fortunately his final destination was SIN.

When I got back to Australia I wrote a letter of complaint to BA, who basically shrugged it off as "one of those things". They stated there was nothing they could do about it. :shock: I didn't bother to pursue it further.

 

[dk4]

I take issue to people using any "AV" equipment in public places, and the "A" component of said equipment not being turned off, confined to head/ear-phones or held-against-the-ear speaker setting.