Two QF A380s to be scrapped

[henrus]

@mivy If my internet searches are correct Mr Joyce has come from a marketing background so any spin such as this should be taken with a grain of salt.

I'd say he's just being a bit too optimistic at this stage however I can see where the optimism is coming from. If you'd told AJ 12 months ago that JQd would be facing an aircraft shortage in 12 months' time I don't think he'd believe you.

People are wanting to travel (and right now domestic/TT is the only option) but QF wants to be prepared to this the ground running when international travel does become an option otherwise they're going to be demolished by foreign carriers.

I can't really remember what happened in other states but here in Queensland we had our lockdown and it eased with a roadmap ~every 4 weeks. The plan was to allow intrastate travel on 10 July however that was brought forward to 1 June and for the month of June it was impossible to get any flights to CNS/TSV from BNE because they were just operating 4-5 services per week. I don't think the QF group wants to find themselves in a position like that ever again.

 

[mviy]

So any marketing days are long behind him. Doesn't mean he can't spin with the best of them but marketing isn't a big part of his career, especially this millennium.

With a company offering a service requiring repeat sales, any CEO would either need to be good at marketing and/or have people working for him that are good at marketing to help prepare what to say.

Inherently it's Alan Joyce's job in the current situation to try to be as optimistic as possible. At the very least it's good to hear that they hope to be able to fly all 12 A380s again, whether or not that ends up happening.

Great to hear, I still have not tried QF F ....... it is still on my bucket list.

On my last international trip I flew QF F both ways to London (points upgrades from J both ways). It was fantastic. Had extra time in the F Lounge in MEL because the entertainment system wasn't working and they tried unsuccessfully to fix it. Ended up watching entertainment on my tablet for the first flight of the trip to the DXB.

There is a better ratio of flight attendants to passengers (max 7 passengers per flight attendant, but on my flights it was better than that as the cabin wasn't full) and a better ratio of toilets per passenger as well.

In recent years the food offering has been similar to J, but there are obviously some things only offered in F such as the steak sandwich and the expensive champagne. The amenity kit and pyjamas are different for F and provided on every flight even if its daytime.

In the past when J was angled flat there was a bigger difference, but now both J and F have lie flat beds.

A part of the experience on QF and some other the other airlines that have F, but not all is that you can sit opposite another passenger that also is booked into F and have a meal together. I was travelling solo so didn't get to experience that.

Was it a great experience that I'd like to do again? Yes, absolutely.

Would I be likely to try to fly F mainly (where offered) rather than J? No. As nice as it was for me it would be more of a special treat for a special trip rather than something I'd look to do regularly.

Flying F can be an especially good option if classic reward seats are available in F but not J on the date you need to travel as by the time you book say classic reward in Y+ and upgrade it to J you may as well have booked an F seat if it's available.

My next QF F trip could well be on a Project Sunrise flight if I can somehow get a classic reward seat (may be almost impossible as there's likely to be less F seats than on the A380).

 

[bulldog88]

I don't believe anything that clown says

He should make a proper cash refund as easy & quick as making a booking

I wonder how much revenue Qantas books from people who are never refunded for their cancelled bookings.

@mivy If my internet searches are correct Mr Joyce has come from a marketing background so any spin such as this should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[jakeseven7]

I don't believe anything that clown says

He should make a proper cash refund as easy & quick as making a booking

I wonder how much revenue Qantas books from people who are never refunded for their cancelled bookings.

Probably the same % of revenue that Virgin, Air NZ and every other airline in the world is holding.

 

[jakeseven7]

Joyce says all 12 Qantas A380s will fly again

The CEO added that each aircraft could potentially return to service in three to six months.

australianaviation.com.au

 

[jakeseven7]

Maybe Mr Joyce will reactivate the a380 to fly to NZ.

I actually think it would be amazing if they could reactivate 1, maybe 2 and have them operate back and forth on the bubble if it holds up without popping too often. Maybe Fiji later as well.

Imagine the F deals they could do.... they could PR it to death. Lots of rich Australians around, do a luxury escape to NZ, Fiji etc....

It will be interesting to see the passenger loads on the bubble - it certainly has gotten off to a big start bookings wise.

Probably pie in the sky thinking, more likely to wake the rest of the A330 fleet up first.

 

[henrus]

Probably pie in the sky thinking, more likely to wake the rest of the A330 fleet up first.

Very wishful thinking. I think the 787s would come back first, I was under the impression that most if not all A330s are back as well.

 

[milehighclub]

I was under the impression that most if not all A330s are back as well.

9 x 333 are in service. The 10th one did operate recently but is showing offline, most likely for maintenance.
7 x 332 are in service
11 still having a sleep

 

[Melburnian1]

Probably the same % of revenue that Virgin, Air NZ and every other airline in the world is holding.

It seems to be in Qantas' and almost every other airline's business plan/modus operandi to keep monies when they don't provide the booked service. A disgrace, although I've only ever been affected once and that was for a domestic sector when there was a typhoon, and a piddling fare of A$60. Different matter of it's an international fare ex Oz that may if J easily be $2500-$7000 per person return.

Imagine if Myer, Woolworths, Metcash (IGA stores in Australia), Coles, Bunnings, Mitre 10, Big W, Target, JBHi Fi, Priceline, Chemist Warehouse or KMart tried to continually do that.

The ACCC and other regulators would be on to them in a flash, not the laggard-like response we see when it involves the airlines.

 

[Melburnian1]

9 x 333 are in service. The 10th one did operate recently but is showing offline, most likely for maintenance.
7 x 332 are in service
11 still having a sleep

Apart from your great in-house information, well done to the Airfleets site whose numbers correlate (except for your comment about 'the 10th one', although Airfleets including it as 'active' indicates that it is highly likely to just be out for some attention.

Airfleets says all 10 B789s are operating. However (for instance) VH-ZNA arrived in DRW on 13 April 2021 on one of those QF110 repatriation flights from LHR and hasn't been used since, while VH-ZNB on 10 April did what may have been crew training overnight over Bass Strait (but commenced and finished in Melbourne), and wasn't then used until yesterday (14 April) when it operated QF97 from MEL to BNE (a freight flight?)

Much of the A333 usage seems to be on freight flights. VH-QPA flew overnight from SYD to PVG on Tuesday 13 April and hasn't yet returned, I assume because the crew need mandated rest. QPB came in to BNE form HKG this morning and is now northwards-bound to CNS as QF83, again a freight flight. QPC landed in BKK last night ex SYD then MEL, presumably a freight flight (7702/7705).

So in some cases utilisation may be somewhat decreased from pre-COVID-19, and in other cases the flights are strictly non-passenger.

 

[jakeseven7]

Imagine if Myer, Woolworths, Metcash (IGA stores in Australia), Coles, Bunnings, Mitre 10, Big W, Target, JBHi Fi, Priceline, Chemist Warehouse or KMart tried to continually do that.

The ACCC and other regulators would be on to them in a flash, not the laggard-like response we see when it involves the airlines.

Imagine if said retailers were allowed to sell gift vouchers for decades with a short expiry date on them which meant they could keep your money forever (or if was truly a gift, someone elses money)..... Oh wait, they did..... and that was only very recently cracked down on.

The retail sector in Australia gets away with a lot too

 

[jb747]

Remember too, that the crews are going into a two week quarantine after each and every flight...!

Before the 380s can come back, they'll need to train about 65 Captains. They'll have to come from somewhere, so there's a ripple effect. If they said "go" right now, I still think it would take about 12 months to actually get things to more or less normal. I expect that most of the 380 training department also took the VR, so you'll need to replace them first.

 

[mviy]

Remember too, that the crews are going into a two week quarantine after each and every flight...!

I suspect they won’t bring the A380s back till well after that requirement is removed.

 

[NM]

Remember too, that the crews are going into a two week quarantine after each and every flight...!

Before the 380s can come back, they'll need to train about 65 Captains. They'll have to come from somewhere, so there's a ripple effect. If they said "go" right now, I still think it would take about 12 months to actually get things to more or less normal. I expect that most of the 380 training department also took the VR, so you'll need to replace them first.

I wonder how may who took VR might be interested in returning for a few more years if given the opportunity? It might work out well for some of the previous crew. Training time to re-certify will still be significant though.

Of course, many of those who willingly retired will likely prefer their new lifestyle

 

[RAM]

I suspect they won’t bring the A380s back till well after that requirement is removed.

Or perhaps only write them off fully once they have some retained earnings to stop wiping out Shareholders Funds.

Remember in 2019/20 they did not write down $1 on their international fleet other than part write-downs (for zero value in service) A380s and the last few B747s despite their aircraft valuers going on record saying values had dropped between 16 to 23% across all aircraft types in Q's fleet.

 

[Melburnian1]

It will be interesting to see the passenger loads on the bubble - it certainly has gotten off to a big start bookings wise.

However in the release today there's mention of some Oz-NZ flights being 'reduced'.

Perhaps demand has not been quite what QFi thought it would be.

Very hard to predict at present given the worry many have re possible repeat lockdowns or border shuts.

Airlines love to use previous history to predict loads but this COVID-19 situation is a new ball game.

 

[RAM]

However in the release today there's mention of some Oz-NZ flights being 'reduced'.

Perhaps demand has not been quite what QFi thought it would be.

Very hard to predict at present given the worry many have re possible repeat lockdowns or border shuts.

Airlines love to use previous history to predict loads but this COVID-19 situation is a new ball game.

Other bubbles, especially Singapore, seem more distant than impending.

Singapore's daily cases, allowed to shelter at home, continue to reflect their high ex-pat population, not including their 'dormitory' foregn workers who after seeing CV spread like wildfire have now seemingly been widely vaccinated with Pfizer.

Migrant worker who tested positive for COVID-19 completed vaccination

SINGAPORE: The sole dormitory case in Singapore on Sunday (Apr 11) had completed the full COVID-19 vaccination regimen and the case is a reminder that "it is possible for vaccinated individuals to get infected", said MOH. The 23-year-old man from India, identified as Cas

www.channelnewsasia.com

The remaining 19 cases were imported and had been placed on stay-home notice upon arrival in Singapore.

The Singapore Flyer and Time Capsule at 30 Raffles Avenue was added to the list of places visited by COVID-19 cases during their infectious period.

 

[jb747]

Perhaps demand has not been quite what QFi thought it would be.

Very hard to predict at present given the worry many have re possible repeat lockdowns or border shuts.

And there lies the rub. Whilst some people might be willing to go ASAP, I suspect the vast majority are now very wary of the lockdowns and closures, and will want to see quite a period of normality before they becoming willing to risk overseas travel. Even closer to home, I'm not prepared to be more than a day's drive from the border, so we've cancelled our Queensland plans.

 

[Kiwi_Flyer]

However in the release today there's mention of some Oz-NZ flights being 'reduced'.

Perhaps demand has not been quite what QFi thought it would be.

Yes, one of my flights has been cancelled. The only options for rebooked flights are nowhere near as convenient, and worst of all I may not even have time to visit F lounge now (or only very briefly).

 

[Scarlett]

Remember too, that the crews are going into a two week quarantine after each and every flight...!

Before the 380s can come back, they'll need to train about 65 Captains. They'll have to come from somewhere, so there's a ripple effect. If they said "go" right now, I still think it would take about 12 months to actually get things to more or less normal. I expect that most of the 380 training department also took the VR, so you'll need to replace them first.

How many other A380 operators have reduced their fleet size already? How many ex-pat Aussies were flying internationally but have come home? How's the form or history of QF with hiring on different (read 'cheaper') contracts?

QF management may have had to pay out some VRs, but will they hire replacement personnel at the same (old/previous) rates?

Interesting times.